I went out tonight and bought a target from Wal-mart for 28 bucks. Its a 4*4 block style target, even endorsed by Jackie Bushman too! LOL!! But I did not want to put the kiss of death on my Block target so that is why I bought it. I got dad shooting my Supermax 175 and again, it did real well with the Tekan II's. Then I put them on my Gold Tip II's and was just as happy! They flew great! I was spanking them in with no problem. They averaged about one inch low and to the left compared to my field tips. I am also still using the Nap Quick Spin Speed Hunters. I am not sure if I am gaining that much with them over the Miller Vanes. The only advantage I see so far is maybe a questionable amount of improvements, but they look pretty cool!! Also, the Wal-mart target is ok, but it will not last. One of my circles had a spot that had been hit the same about five times and I had a arrow pass through the target and stick out about ten inches on the other side. So it is a ok starter, one season target at best.