cayugad

Pioneer2

.Somewhat messier to clean though.

that is the reason for a good water bath. And if you give the water bath with the nipple still in the barrel, it will clean that at the same time and make it much easier to remove before the second patch goes through with the nipple out.

After two or three water bath patches you will think the rifle barrel is clean. For your own sake, do not be fooled. Get a clean patch, put solvent or bore cleaner on it and work that through the barrel. You will notice it comes out "gray." This is the fine stuff that was back in the pores. I like to do a couple of them like that. Also a good solvent will help to displace any water in the barre from the water bath.

He can handle 50-70gr loads when shooting ball loads ,is this going to be humane on deer at 50-75 yards?

I have a book about muzzleloading written by Don Davis. Don's favorite deer load was 50 grains of powder and a patched roundball. He said it was very accurate, did not waste powder, easy to handle and took them down just as well. Don's theory was, for the ball to enter the animal and not exit. I am not sure I agree with his idea of loosing all the energy of the ball inside the animal. I still like the holes on each side. But 50-70 grains of Goex will take deer out. It is a good load. I would not be afraid to shoot out to 75 yards. For one reason the rifles are really accurate. Have your son put that ball through their heart, and the deer is his.

I used a lubed felt wad and Crisco but it was so hot it melted like applying soup.

Crisco breaks down in heat. If it did not, what good would it be for frying chicken. There are better homemade lubes out there you can make. That Castor oil/bees wax lube I make (a recipe of Stumpkillers for which I will be ever grateful with him for sharing) does not break down in the heat. It will get "softer" but still holds up. You can use it as a patch lube as well if you like.

On occasion after a thorough cleaning two or three days later there is surface rust on the guns[even put away clean and oiled]is this common ?

Not in my gun rack. I personally have seen a little surface rust try and start on the bolster, but the barrel itself, never. What kind of oil are you using? Also, while I am sure you have cleaned thousands of rifles, are you positive you have gotten all the water off the metal before you oil the rifle. The metal needs moisture in order to rust, that is why I ask.

I've taken to giving second cleanings and bore oiling sessions. Good thinking on your part. Also this problem might simply be related to where you live. All parts of the country have their own problems when it comes to guns and their care. By the way, you're going to love the CCI Magnum caps.

Its also nice to hear the accuracy is better. Some rifles just do not like 777. I have one old Renegade that the only thing it shoots is Pyrodex RS. Loaded with Pyrodex RS that thing will shoot as good as any rifle out there. Load it with anything else and it would make a class #1 boat anchor.