Fornra i was referring to a 70 grain barnes loaded in a 22-250, and i know for a fact that this combination will completly penetrate a deer lengthwise and will stop 3/4 of the way through a moose lengthwise. A broadside shot it will always go through a deer, and unless it hits some ribs on entrace and exit it will go through a moose also. If you dont beleive me try it.