ORIGINAL: tsoc
So every one wants to talk about healthy but no one wants to talk about naturally occurring.Thats self serving and convenient!So if we are killing 75% plus of the antlered deer who are 1 1/2 years old whose interests are we serving? Certainly not the deer herd,our management has been to accomodate the hunter for years with no regard for the natural order of things.You can write 2 page threads and talk until you are blue in the face but no one can refute that we are no where close to the natural order of things.We have been all about maintaining an opportunity for most to shoot a buck any buck with no regard for the true nature of any animal population.So who is manipulating the population?The AR side or,I want to be sure I can shoot a buck side?
Are some arrogant enough to think that their way is better than the way things would naturally be? Without hunting wouldn't the mortality of doe's be equal to the mortality of bucks,factoring out the rigors of the rut and the naive nature of 1 1/2 year old bucks.Would mortality's emphasis be so skewed toward a particular age class?
The answer to all these things would be of course not!
We currently manage for hunters not for the herd.If you don't believe AR is a step closer instead of a step back,you are seeing what you want to see!
I for one am not afraid that I will not take "my buck".I have imposed antler restrictions upon myself for many years,because I am more interested in the way things naturally occur.If I eat a tag I eat a tag,I don't need to kill the most vulnerable age class of buck in the woods to keep my manhood in tact.
We tried the naturally occurring thing. This happened before hunting seasons were put in place. We, defined by nature, are predators. And it is natural for us to prey on animals. But without control to maintain a "healthy balance" we darn near pushed many of these species to the brink of extinction.
Further, you say we do not want to go natural? Ok, do you remember anything that was taught to you in school about the predator-prey relationship? Or are you making stuff up as you go. Natural predation demands preying on the weak and the young, the healthy and mature. If youwant natural, we would all be shooting buttons, spikes and forks, as these are the weakest part of the herd.
Keep it coming, I can kill your arguments. anyone of the ones you choose to present. I can do so with basic science and historical fact. But, this is fun, and I sincerely hope at the end of the day you actually learn something beneficial.
And where the heck did you pull that 75% of antlered deer number from? The agency in charge of collecting harvest information cannot get an accurate count of the dead each year, and they haven't conducted any field surveys and aerial counts in well over a decade.
Please, let's not make up numbers to suit your own beliefs. You cannot back that up at all.
Here, I'll kill your claim right now.
2005, DEC estimated the total deer herd was nearly 1 million whitetails across the state.
2005 Buck harvest was @ 89,000 across the state. If this is 75% of the antlered deer, this means the entire population of bucks in NYS was @ 111,000.
Which means the balance of deer are anlterless. This makes a 10:1 antlerless to antlered ration.
The ratio of antlered deer vs antlerless deer is estimated between 2 and 2.5:1 (antlerless v antlered)
Get the picture? Your numbers are so far off base it isn't even funny.