Rebel Hog,I can't really complain either they have sure killed everything I shoot with them. I use the 230 gr 451 dia in my System One with 130gr RS what it will do to a deer is suprising but they do seperate some times of course it don't make much differance to the deer and for boar and bear with that gun I put the 54 barrel on and use a purple sabot and a 300gr widner soft point bullet with 150gr RS never had any animal stop that one so far. Lee