sproulman

making noise as you say, i do agree with that..when you stop ,thats when grouse will flush not usually as you move..

as for dog, i agree there also..dog will flush more grouse that you cant get at..but, fun is not KILLING its hunting with dog..boring without dog..

last, here is where i disagree..on grouse you should never use below no.6 shot..not needed..

the bird is not tough they are just QUICK..1 PELLET WILL PUT THEM DOWN..a good dog comes in handy to find bird then..

i did a lot of research and thinking..it seemed when i used low brass target loads i killed more grouse than i missed.. i use 7 and 1/2..if you pattern your shotgun for distance you will shoot, 7 and 1/2 LOW BRASS target loads is awesome..

most of my shots here in pa. in oct are within 20 yds max..this is do to leaves on trees..so, i use a IMPROVED CYL choke..this choke is good all way to 35 yds..

then ,now when things get harder and leaves are off, i use MODIFIED CHOKE..

now, shots are 25 yds to 40 yds easy..

i can put over 100 pellets fronm 7 and 1/2 LOW brass at 35 yds with modified..remember, 1 pellet will kill a grouse in vitals, heart or head..

you get more pellets also..

dont play with high brass game and the pellet size game..no. 6 pellets are fine to but my favorite is 7 and 1/2..

NOW, why does sproul shoot so much better than others with 7 and 1/2,remember, been doing this for 50 years..

why, i took game loads out and shoot them at 35 yds, many pellets did not hit the 30 inch circle,i then took out the TARGET LOADS,guess what..i hit that 30 inch circle with over half pellets..

those target loads were same, 3 drams of powder, 1 oz of shot,low brass..

so, i cut open a shell of GAME LOADS,then i cut open shell of the TARGET LOADS..what do you think i found??

i found that the GAME LOADS pellets when i cut them with knife they were SOFTER than the TARGET LOADS that are used for skeet..

pellets were HARDER..

this is why i have used TARGET LOADS over game loads and i get better pellets down range..

now, if you are shooting at 25 yds max, game load is not different than the TARGET LOAD,but 25 and out, oh myyyyyyyyyyy!!

look at velocity on box of LOW BRASS, why anyone would use a HIGH BRASS on grouse is beyond me..low brass will have velocity of say 1290, the high brass will have velocity of 1330 but it DEFORMS the pellets going down barrel..

so less pellets past 25 yds get there..

this is why ole sproul can crack a grouse at times beyond 25 yds with 7 and 1/2 shot,its not my shooting its i use TARGET LOADS, LOW BRASS,3 DRAMS,1 OZ OF SHOT,in my 12 ga with MODIFIED choke..

pattern you shotgun with 7 and 1/2 low brass TARGET LOADS , i guarantee you will never, ever, need or use high brass or 1 and 1/8 shot or 1 and 1/4 shot or bigger pellets..

also ,only 2 chokes is all you should ever need..my 2 favorites are this in beretta uricka field..EARLY SEASON,improved cyl,LATE SEASON,modified..

i have used FULL chokebefore if i wanted a grouse at 60 yds, i stopped that foolishness and now let them fly aweay at that range..so, its 2 chokes low brass TARGET LOADS..

if anyone would like info on hunting grouse in the big woods, you can pm me and i will help..

again, this is not knock on any opinions on here, its just sharing what has/has not worked..most would not tell anyone these tricks to getting more grouse ..only thing i ask is, lkeave a few grouse for next year..

i never over hunt area i am in, i saw grouse wiped out because of over hunting..take care