grim, one thing you may be overlooking is, when someone is new to something they can't always think of everything before being confronted with a situation. You were taught by your father, some people don't have the luxury of a mentor. I'll bet at one point you didn't know everything. If you were berated for making mistakes, and asking about them, I'll bet it took longer to learn from them than had you been properly instructed. By saying this I am in no way suggesting that was the case with you, just making a point. Sometimes things don't go as planned. When dealing with a new and confusing situation, it makes sense for a person to ask for help. Hopefully someone has some experience that will be helpful to them. Jumping in their butt with both feet is not productive, IMO. Some posts make my blood boil, but coming down on people may only serve to alienate them, causing them to get a case of the f-its. An email may be a better way to express strong feelings. I understand your feelings, to a degree, and suggest everyone temper their outrage at others they feel are less than adequate.
Phil.
"Could you guys be quiet, my dad's trying to shoot."<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>