Thanks for the shootout results ranchhand. I'm glad someone finally put some pictures of therepattern that just wasn't a fist size hole and say this was my pattern at 40 yards all 450 pellets in a 6'' circle. I have spent who knows how much money on chokes and ammo for 4 different shotguns (including rhino nitro combo) and haven't got these world record patterns that people claim to get. Ithought I've just got to find the right combination, I finally bought a mossberg and got it. It's not the world record but I think It is about the best I will find 19 pellets in the brain and spine at 4o and 26 pellets at 30 yards. Our patterns look to be about the same so I hope you didn't have to go through all the trouble that I did.