Imperial Whitetail Clover
01-06-2005, 03:30 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: jefferson county illinois
Posts: 15
Imperial Whitetail Clover
I have a 40ac. piece of land in South Central Illinois. and considering planting a 1- 1 1/2 ac. imperial whitetail clover food plot. Any experience with this clover would be appreciated.
01-06-2005, 09:49 PM
#3
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: cazenovia, NY USA
Posts: 2,973
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
IWC - puts out a real good video that really shows how to plant it well. And - the plot is a proven winner - for deer. I've planted it - and sometimes still do - its a good plot - and an excellent learning plot.
Still - Ron is right - there are seed sources for common white clovers that will perform as well - at a cheaper price.
I like IWC as a first plot - it was my groups' first REAL plot-quite a few years ago. Many will say that the Ph is the most important thing in a good clover plot - and While you cannot ignore it (strive for 6.0 at least) - I still feel that in most areas of the country - proper seed bed and adequate moisture in the next 2 weeks after planting are the most important considerations.
FH
Still - Ron is right - there are seed sources for common white clovers that will perform as well - at a cheaper price.
I like IWC as a first plot - it was my groups' first REAL plot-quite a few years ago. Many will say that the Ph is the most important thing in a good clover plot - and While you cannot ignore it (strive for 6.0 at least) - I still feel that in most areas of the country - proper seed bed and adequate moisture in the next 2 weeks after planting are the most important considerations.
FH
01-07-2005, 05:38 AM
#4
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: FT Benning
Posts: 116
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
The reason the PH level is important is not for the growth but the palatabilty of the plant to the deer. if your plot tastes better than your neighbor's than guess what more deer will be on your side of the fence
ORIGINAL: farm hunter
IWC - puts out a real good video that really shows how to plant it well. And - the plot is a proven winner - for deer. I've planted it - and sometimes still do - its a good plot - and an excellent learning plot.
Still - Ron is right - there are seed sources for common white clovers that will perform as well - at a cheaper price.
I like IWC as a first plot - it was my groups' first REAL plot-quite a few years ago. Many will say that the Ph is the most important thing in a good clover plot - and While you cannot ignore it (strive for 6.0 at least) - I still feel that in most areas of the country - proper seed bed and adequate moisture in the next 2 weeks after planting are the most important considerations.
FH
IWC - puts out a real good video that really shows how to plant it well. And - the plot is a proven winner - for deer. I've planted it - and sometimes still do - its a good plot - and an excellent learning plot.
Still - Ron is right - there are seed sources for common white clovers that will perform as well - at a cheaper price.
I like IWC as a first plot - it was my groups' first REAL plot-quite a few years ago. Many will say that the Ph is the most important thing in a good clover plot - and While you cannot ignore it (strive for 6.0 at least) - I still feel that in most areas of the country - proper seed bed and adequate moisture in the next 2 weeks after planting are the most important considerations.
FH
01-07-2005, 04:19 PM
#5
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Townsend, DE US
Posts: 6,429
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
Farmhunter I dont remember if you have ever posted on this but do you overseed the clover after a year or so or let it re-seed itself as long as it stays in the field, how long do you figure on it being a viable food source?
01-07-2005, 09:02 PM
#6
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location:
Posts: 241
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
This year will be my 6th. I mow it 3 times per year and treat it better than my lawn.
ORIGINAL: RonM
Farmhunter I dont remember if you have ever posted on this but do you overseed the clover after a year or so or let it re-seed itself as long as it stays in the field, how long do you figure on it being a viable food source?
Farmhunter I dont remember if you have ever posted on this but do you overseed the clover after a year or so or let it re-seed itself as long as it stays in the field, how long do you figure on it being a viable food source?
01-07-2005, 09:35 PM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: cazenovia, NY USA
Posts: 2,973
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
Ron with IWC - I never let it re-seed on purpose. Whenever the field is more than 50% "in bloom" I mow it. It usually works out to 3 times a year - After the last mowing around Labor Day - some heads will always go to seed - but I'm not convinced that the natural seeding does much.
Ladino does a good job of "filling in" the field through propagation from the roots.
A good White Clover Plot (Like IWC) should stay REAL strong for 3 years - and decent another 2-3 years more with regular mowing. I've tried overseeding a couple times - but I've never been real pleased with the results - the truth is that the clover makes ALOT of nitrogen available for invading grasses - and they begin to outcompete the clover after three years. There are those that say you can extend the life of the plot by a couple years with a spray like Poast - and maybe so - but for what it costs - I'd rather plan on re-planting clover plots (or rotating them with other plots) every 4-5 years. Here's a picture of the last IWC plot I put in in 2000. some of you might recognize the picture for an old post. This was the plot's second year - and was very thick with clover - 1st mowing 6/22/02:
Here is a closeup picture of the same plot in June this past year - 2004.
There still is alot of clover - but grasses have really started to become a problem. Mowing helped - but 2005 will probably be the last year of this (my favorite) clover plot - then it will be corn.
For Red Clover - and Alsike - Alowing it to reseed naturally bewteen July 4th and the 1st frost is a good idea - Mow it when most of the seed heads go brown. These clovers are basically a 2 year Perenial - allowing them to go to seed seems to get you another year or two.
I've never done it - but I'd guess Annual clovers like Crimson clover - should be allowed to "go to seed" if you are not re-planting after the year.
Ladino does a good job of "filling in" the field through propagation from the roots.
A good White Clover Plot (Like IWC) should stay REAL strong for 3 years - and decent another 2-3 years more with regular mowing. I've tried overseeding a couple times - but I've never been real pleased with the results - the truth is that the clover makes ALOT of nitrogen available for invading grasses - and they begin to outcompete the clover after three years. There are those that say you can extend the life of the plot by a couple years with a spray like Poast - and maybe so - but for what it costs - I'd rather plan on re-planting clover plots (or rotating them with other plots) every 4-5 years. Here's a picture of the last IWC plot I put in in 2000. some of you might recognize the picture for an old post. This was the plot's second year - and was very thick with clover - 1st mowing 6/22/02:
Here is a closeup picture of the same plot in June this past year - 2004.
There still is alot of clover - but grasses have really started to become a problem. Mowing helped - but 2005 will probably be the last year of this (my favorite) clover plot - then it will be corn.For Red Clover - and Alsike - Alowing it to reseed naturally bewteen July 4th and the 1st frost is a good idea - Mow it when most of the seed heads go brown. These clovers are basically a 2 year Perenial - allowing them to go to seed seems to get you another year or two.
I've never done it - but I'd guess Annual clovers like Crimson clover - should be allowed to "go to seed" if you are not re-planting after the year.
01-07-2005, 09:55 PM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: cazenovia, NY USA
Posts: 2,973
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
PY Seeker -
You are right on about the taste of clover. Lime makes it Sweeter - no doubt. In fact - most people can taste the difference themselves in the clover - for different Ph values.
Clovers will grow (in varying degrees) in Ph from 5.0 - 7.0+. But those closer to 6.5-7.0 are most likely "best". Ph is funny - a Ph of 7.0 is 10 times less acidic than an Ph of 6.0 and 100 TIMES less acidic than 5.0!!! So increasing the Ph even a couple 10ths of a point can mean alot on clover growth and taste.
Even light - topical applications of lime can have a big effect on clover growth and taste - in the first year - especially if its mowed and NOT harvested - regularly.
I don't like to get too hung up on Ph - If i get a plot anywhere near 6.0-6.5 ph - I did well - and I'm happy with it. If one's plots are more towards the 5.0 end - You should either give up on clovers -and look at oats/rye or plant annuals like oats/rye - and apply lime as you can afford - until the Ph is at least close to 6.0 before you seriously consider a clover type.
You are right on about the taste of clover. Lime makes it Sweeter - no doubt. In fact - most people can taste the difference themselves in the clover - for different Ph values.
Clovers will grow (in varying degrees) in Ph from 5.0 - 7.0+. But those closer to 6.5-7.0 are most likely "best". Ph is funny - a Ph of 7.0 is 10 times less acidic than an Ph of 6.0 and 100 TIMES less acidic than 5.0!!! So increasing the Ph even a couple 10ths of a point can mean alot on clover growth and taste.
Even light - topical applications of lime can have a big effect on clover growth and taste - in the first year - especially if its mowed and NOT harvested - regularly.
I don't like to get too hung up on Ph - If i get a plot anywhere near 6.0-6.5 ph - I did well - and I'm happy with it. If one's plots are more towards the 5.0 end - You should either give up on clovers -and look at oats/rye or plant annuals like oats/rye - and apply lime as you can afford - until the Ph is at least close to 6.0 before you seriously consider a clover type.
01-08-2005, 06:35 AM
#9
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Townsend, DE US
Posts: 6,429
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
Farm Hunter, back in the mid seventies I had a 10 acre field I seeded in clover to combine for seed and then I couldnt get it combined so it went to seed and the next spring it was rank, I sold it to some dairy farmers next door for hay, and it was the real deal , I forget how many bales of hay came off that little field, but it was many, and that has been my only experience with letting clover go to seed and regenerate itself, then it got plowed under and put into crops, rode by there the other day it is in rather large houses now......
01-08-2005, 09:34 AM
#10
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location:
Posts: 241
RE: Imperial Whitetail Clover
Yes, RonM it is terrible how DE has grown. I used to hunt in Symrna with my Gpop for geese. Met a lot of good people from DE/MD. Used to guide at M&M shooting there. Still have M&M shooting here.
ORIGINAL: RonM
Farm Hunter, back in the mid seventies I had a 10 acre field I seeded in clover to combine for seed and then I couldnt get it combined so it went to seed and the next spring it was rank, I sold it to some dairy farmers next door for hay, and it was the real deal , I forget how many bales of hay came off that little field, but it was many, and that has been my only experience with letting clover go to seed and regenerate itself, then it got plowed under and put into crops, rode by there the other day it is in rather large houses now......
Farm Hunter, back in the mid seventies I had a 10 acre field I seeded in clover to combine for seed and then I couldnt get it combined so it went to seed and the next spring it was rank, I sold it to some dairy farmers next door for hay, and it was the real deal , I forget how many bales of hay came off that little field, but it was many, and that has been my only experience with letting clover go to seed and regenerate itself, then it got plowed under and put into crops, rode by there the other day it is in rather large houses now......