Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

I just got my soil test report back from the University of Missouri Extension and my pH showed 5.6. To get my pH to 6.8 their recommendation on the effective neutralizing material at 710. My lime supplier's guarantee is 400 lbs. per ton. Doing the math on these numbers says I need 1.75 tons per acre or 8.9 ton for the 5 acres. I'm not an expert on this but it seems to me this is not a lot of lime to get the pH increase from 5.6 to 6.8. I want to have enough lime spread to get pH to 7.0 to plant alfalfa (alfarack) this August. Looking for thoughts from you guys who are knowledgable on this.
Thanks for all replies.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

This is July, I don't think the bulk lime will not work that fast. We've always allowed at least 6 months.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

Timbercruiser, I agree on the 6 months before I get any increase in pH but I wanted to put it in for a fall planting for less weed competition. I have sprayed and will disc in the lime in the next several weeks. Any growth I get this fall will give me a jump over planting it next spring plus the fact of less weeds. I will fertilize with 0-40-20 next spring when the pH should be better for the plants to receive the nutrients. My main concern is getting the right amount of lime down soon so I can get to a pH of 7.0 in the future (6 to 12 months). 8.9 tons of lime seemed like a small amount for a 5 acre planting with a pH of 5.6 I just want to be sure I can get to the 7.0 pH goal. Any thoughts on the amount of lime to reach 7.0, timbercruiser ? Thanks.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

I would reccomend getting your ph right to start with. That type of seed is very expensive, and alfalfa is very difficult to grow. So, rather than take a chance wasting your time and money get it right the first time. You may get a decent crop, but then again you may have to start all over in the spring. Go here and find out what you need to know about alfalfa: http://www.americasalfalfa.com/alfalfau.htm

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

Criggster, thanks for the reply and info. Good stuff. I couldn't agree more on getting the pH right the first time. That's what I'm trying to accomplish now with the amount of lime I need to get to at least 6.8 or 7.0 even better. I guess I can assume, based on the soil test results, that if I put down 9 to 10 tons of lime on this 5 acres I will get to those desired pH levels. My dilemma now is what to do waiting for the pH to get right. I believe a fall planting is best for alfalfa for several reasons and I know there is no guarantee of success regardless of whether it is planted in spring or fall. This 5 acre field is ideal for an alfalfa plot in that it is a flat hillside, well drained and very secluded. It has produced nice yields of corn and beans the past 5 years. What would you do if this was yours ? Thanks again.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

The manufacturers of liquid lime (liquid dolomitic limestone) say that it will reduce acidity up to 1 full point within a week.......seems like this may be the way to go since the LL will only last one season......your ag lime will take over from there.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

If I were in your situation I would look at the other crops in the area and take that into consideration. If you only plan to use this plot for this fall and plant the alfalfa later, then I would definitely go with an annual. Probably a small grain or a brassica.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

AA, I planted my first plot this year and I planted clovers, brassicas, rapes, turnips, rye grass and what ever else was in the mixture. My clovers are coming on strong and I'm actually impressed so far with the crop. This field was a weed/CRP/goldenrod field for 30 years. Check out my Update link #4 for pics.

Anyway, your obviously doing the right thing by getting your PH level right the first time and these guys sure helped me. If you can have it delivered it certainly is the way to go. I've been told by some experts(?) that liming more than 3 ton an acre is wasting money as the soil cannot absorb more than that and you'll loose it in run off etc...if you can, minimize your liming the first time and then lime a second time if necessary.

What I did was not the right way but it's working so far. Once I sprayed and killed the weeds I went in and disc'd it up. It took a lot for the field I was doing because it had been so dry so I went in after a hard rain and tore it up making a mess. Once it dried I went back and spread 200 lbs of pelletized lime on 1/3 acres, not quite a 1/2 acre and then I disc'd it in smoothing out the ground. I then sprayed liquid lime because of the 6 mo. expectant date of the pelletized lime. I'm sure some of the pelletized was absorbed however I still sprayed Aggrene Liquid Lime...shortly after I spread the seed.

Here's the last pic several weeks ago after I mowed and before this last good rain.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

ROB/PA, Thanks for the reply. I've followed your posts and have read all the others on a daily basis for the past 3 years. A great source of info and I've learned a lot. You have a great looking plot going. As for my 5 acres, I am having 10 tons of lime delivered and spread early next week. I will then disc it in and plant 2 acres in LabLab Plusnext monthsince it was given to me free. The other 3 acres of this field I'm committed to planting Alfarack so I need to decide what annual I want to plant in August knowing it will be disced and prepared for Alfalfa next April if the pH is right. I will probably take Roseaukain's suggestion on the liguid lime and Criggster's on planting a small grain to hopefully have an early fall food source other than the corn and beans on the neighboring farms. Thanks to all for the advice and keep more coming. Everyone have a safe July 4th.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

AA, I was in a very similar situation with our Alfa-Rack food plot. here's the steps we took in planting ours.
1) It was unturned ground. So we bottom land plowed it, dragged it out, and let it sit a season to rot the turned growth.
2) That Sept after we'd turned the soil we had a lime truck come in & spread 3 tons of AG lime per acre. We let is sit until spring.
3) In spring we again dragged out the area, then spread our recommended fertlizer. I can't recall exactly what is was now. Something similar to what you mentioned 0-low Nitrogen, higher rest. Then dragged that into the soil.
4) spread our seed, and bed springed the soil, then rollered it to pack down.
I checked it a few wks later, and it came up great, was like 4" high. I went back month later, and it was near knee high, and had to mow it. The first couple yrs we had very little weeds in it. Mowing helps that. Now its in the 4th season, and weeds are getting into it more. But I'm sure we'll have to re-do it again. Its only suppose to go 3-5yrs.

I hope this helps.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

BuckAlly, thanks for the reply. I'm confidant I can get a good stand of alfalfa going like you have. I have the tractor,disc,spreader, cultipacker and hopefully the knowledge in preparing the seed bed and getting it right the first time. I'm being patient and will not cut any corners. Since you first planted your alfalfa, how much usage has it received from your deer ?

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

Looking good Rob.

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

Sorry I didn't get back to ya right away AA. I was told by others I might want to protect the plot when it first began growing. I placed the Plot saver around it the first couple months. I removed it come Sept. that yr. The first fall itgot some use. But I noticed right off how green itremains into the winter. That 1st spring after was all planted I noticed alot of deer crap in the plot. It was well used over the winter months. Since then it gets used alot, in fact last yr I didn't even really need to mow it. The deer are just gobbling it up. I mowed anyways to keep the weeds down, and to spark new growth. I'm very satisfied with its results overall. Were planning on starting another via the same preparations here soon. The one is just getting hit so much!

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

BuckAlley, I had a feeling you were going to tell me your deer liked alfalfa. About a month ago I toured a friends food plots on two of his farms near mine. He has 4 1 acre plots each of Imperial Clover, Alfarack, Brassica's and BF Oats to see what his deer preferred. 10 months out of the year they hammer the alfalfa and during winter the deer go to the cut bean and corn fields as their food source. This friend did no soil test, no fertilizer, just prepared a good seed bed and then planted. He must have good soil. I imagined what I could accomplish with alfarack if I did everything right. I will wait till next spring, take another soil test and hopefully be able to put in 3 acres of it. Thanks for the reply and advice. Hope your next alfalfa plot is as good as your first !!!

RE: Ph and Alfalfa Question
 

I'm a little late here, BUT the amount of lime to correct PH levels also depends on the type of soil. Sandy soil needs less lime to bring the PH up compared to heavy soils suchas clay! There is also a powdered form of lime that will help correct the PH level quicker than the pellitized lime!