RE: passing bucks
 

i love this statment, because if you really want a nice buck you wouldn't care what joe bob down the hollor shoots. its like saying you would date the fat ugly girl because if you don't the next guy will who cares what the next guy dose its not you

RE: passing bucks
 

Yes, but imagine that that (size and appearance challenged) girl is the probably the only girl you'll see for a year! Maybe two! [:@]

Then you'd have an accurate picture of what it's like hunting public ground ,or areas of the country not as prime as yours, for a lot of folks.

Actually it's not a fair comparison, while you have to check a deer in, nobody's gotta know about the girl right? :D

RE: passing bucks
 

I would much rather wait to shoot a big buck than to kill a small one because after you kill your buck you are done.

RE: passing bucks
 

Then what is all the QDM fuss about??............go tell all those guys that if they really want a nice buck they shouldn't care what anyone else shoots. They missed that part of the seminar ;)



It's not like that at all.

Quote:

---

who cares what the next guy dose its not you

---

I agree.........no one should push their way of hunting on anyone else.

RE: passing bucks
 

That is exactly why you don't understand.

RE: passing bucks
 

Had I not passed on some 6s and 4s LAST year, I wouldn't have seen the small 8s this year...do YOU understand? I shoulda shot the little ones, and then complained there's no big ones around...that makes sense. :D

RE: passing bucks
 

trembow- i understandwhatyour saying, just wondering what state are you from? if you get off the beaten path and scout i see no reason why you can't shoot nice bucks off public land. i have personally seen some of my biggest bucks on public land. if have that few deer on the land i would try looking elsewhere or talk to land owners. when i look for public land i don't look for open areas though, if its 2,000 acres of open woods i keep driving, because deer seem to take the biggest beating in those areas, where thick cover gives deer the upper edge on the hunterswho don't do there scouting.

to be 100% honest i don't care if you or anyone for that matter shoot small bucks,i justget a little frustrated whenguys don't scout then shootthe first buck they seeand complain about notseeing large bucks. shoot whatever makes you happy and enjoy the meat

RE: passing bucks
 

i think we got our signels mixed up, what i am tring to say is if your on public land and want a nice buck don't settle for a little one because you worry that someone else would shoot him. joe down the the way should have no effect over what sizeaniamal you take
(did i make it clear or is it still unclear what i am tring to say?)

RE: passing bucks
 

I don't usually get to hunt where there are big bucks. Still, I've passed on more bucks than I care to think about. Some were decent and afterwards I thought maybe I should have taken some but I really have no regrets. I have never thought I just needed to kill a buck no matter what. I can take does and help the ratio and be just fine.

RE: passing bucks
 

That what I was also trying to say...sorry if I came across differently guys...it's YOUR tag. ;)

RE: passing bucks
 

YEAH YOURE ALLRIGHT LONE WOLF

RE: passing bucks
 

I guess you still don't understand. Think about what you said and read it carefully and it should come to you ;)

RE: passing bucks
 

LOL...riiiiight. Thanks for clarifying, and not making a point. ;)

RE: passing bucks
 

I never killed a buck this year. I let the little guys go and never had a shot at a "shooter". I think the severe drought played a part in this since there was no water on the place I hunt. If I have to, next year I will do the same. I will shoot does and hogs and wait for Mr. Big. He will show up one of these days and I'd be sick if I had filled my buck tag with a forkhorn.

RE: passing bucks
 

I don't see it as "settling"..........and it has less to do with someone else shooting him and more to do with it may be the last deer you see all year.........PLUS if you let him go you are just filling someone else's tag and eating your own.



It has a DIRECT effect. I know the woods we hunt. My family has hunted there for decades. I have no illusions about what I can expect to see come through the trees. There are no trophies to wait on. My brother killed the biggest deer anyone has ever seen come from there and it was a 120" 8 pointer..........That is it in well over 20 years at the same location. We know everyone and we all keep in tounch about what was taken. We have taken countless deer from there and over the years the hunters have grown exponentially. I could sit there for the next 10 years waiting on a trophy and I may as well just sit in Times Square because I have the same chance of seeing one there. Now usually this is the part where someone chimes in and says there are big deer there and I just don't know it or we don't know how to hunt.....blah blah blah. Whatever. I know reality and I am fine with it. I take what the woods has to offer and I am a happy guy. I saw ONE deer all of last year with antlers (not counting spikes) That is hunting hard at a clip of about 6 days a week and well over 250 in the field. Passing on a deer doesn't even enter my mind unless I don't have a tag for it. If I have a tag in my pocket that deer is getting shot. I have no desire to sit in the woods for that long just to let them walk by........I have videos at home if I want to LOOK at deer. I am out to KILL deer.......not wink at them and say "See ya next year"

I also have no desire to pretend that a deer is more of an accomplishment to kill just because you gave him a free pass last year. I see all these comments about deer being passed on private land and then killed when they are big enough to brag about and it just makes me laugh. That deer is not any smarter, wiser, or more ellusive of a creature. In fact he should be considered DUMBER because he walks past you again and again and again year after year. Years 1-3 he is a dumb youngster and all the sudden when he walks by at 4 1/2 he gets whacked and praised as a "mature" unhuntable ghost that only the sharpest skilled hunter could have ever brought down??? Not to mention the private farm deer see barely any hunting pressure in many cases so IMO a deer that has survived the slaughter and flying lead of public land for a year or two is just as wise if not more then a deer strolling a farm that barely sees a human other then on a John Deere.

Just 2 different worlds...........almost impossible to compare.

RE: passing bucks
 

WOW.......I didn't think you would still miss it.

RE: passing bucks
 

Let 'em go and let 'em grow...state mandated antler restrictions in every state in the union is the only way. Education can only penetrate the skulls of the educatable...the dense, stubborn, and irresponsible must be forced by law to do what is right.[:o]

RE: passing bucks
 

Atlas....after how many years of these types of threads, and your STILL on your anti-qdm kick?? LOL One would think that you would get sick of explaining your same point over and over and over...year after year after year.

RE: passing bucks
 

Everyone....Here we have a great example of two people that couldn't be any further from one another in terms of deer management. LOL!!

ATLASMAN---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------WOLFEN68.


j/k fellas.

RE: passing bucks
 

You're the one not getting "it" man. That's okay, I'm not hatin'. ;)

RE: passing bucks
 

LOL! I should have been listed first though!:D

RE: passing bucks
 

Nooo...you're on the "RIGHT" side, see? :D:D

RE: passing bucks
 

Yeah you right!!!;)

RE: passing bucks
 

Right on Davidmil, as usual........

RE: passing bucks
 

I'm not anti QDM........I am against ANYTHING that tries to force selfish and childish needs on others under the smokescreen of nobility. QDM just happens to fall under that umbrella ;)

RE: passing bucks
 

Sounds like something shouted from a balcony in the 40's to a goose stepping army.

RE: passing bucks
 

Do I have to spell it out for ya?

RE: passing bucks
 

You got that right atlasman! QDM nazi's! What kills me is the arrogance in the assumption that those that don't jump on the trophy mentality bandwagon are simply not "educatable". It doesn't even occur to them that those who oppose their "my way is the only way" attitudeunderstand completely but simply disagree. As far as I'm concerned, if killing a trophy buck iswhat isimportant to you then go for it. Get out there and do what it takes to get one but please stop whining about how tough it is and please stop trying to coerceothers into helping you in your single minded quest.

Keep it up atlasman!

RE: passing bucks
 

Simply unbelievable. "Trophy mentality"??? What the he!! are you talking about? "Whining"??? What the he!! are you talking about? It's about a bigger picture than trophy bucks...it's about a trophy herd. I, along with other "QDM nazis", subscribe to scientific FACTS obtained from years and years of field research conducted by educated wildlife biologists, not EMOTIONS pourred forth by those clinging to archaic backwoods campfire logic. Sorry if I cannot be PC about this but what kind of logic is "if it's brown it's down", "if I don't shoot it someone else will", "if it's legal then it's ok". Thats not logic, it's ridiculous. Please find me a wildlife biologist, who in my opinion is by far the most reliable authority on the issue, that argues sound whitetail deer management practice includes the indiscriminant harvest of any deer. Sure many states still allow it but it's not from advice given by biologists but rather to avoid the riots that would occur from the old school. Look at the massive wall of resistence Dr. Alt had in Pennsylvania but then look at the incredible results already being seen from the AR's. More states will see this and with time will adapt and evolve.

RE: passing bucks
 

This tread wasinteresting as always..... Atlas arguing with scientific research and knowledge.

I also think the "if I don't shoot it, someone else will" is not really a mentality but rather a justification to ones self to shoot young deer.

It is a ludicrous statement to begin with and I for one don't buy it.

Looks to me Shed does pretty well on public land, wouldn't you say? Alwyshntn has some nice whitetails from public land as well.

If you want to shoot young deer have at it, it's your tag and decisionbut leave the "if I don't shoot it, someone else will" out of it. It is 100% speculation and I would say is wrong in most cases.

Here are a couple public land bucks, looks like someone else didn't shoot them......

The one on the left.
[/align]


Public land slammer.

RE: passing bucks
 

Rant all you like but nobody is listening anymore. QDM'ers have been preaching "its for the health of the herd" for years nownot but they have lost all credibility. All you have to do is listen for about 1 minute to know their "true" motivation and that is they want it easier to kill a trophy buck.It's just too hard tomange it on their own so they want to coerce others into helping them. It's whining for sure!

What "incredible results"? That's laughable.

RE: passing bucks
 

Assuming their kill is legal, no one needs to "justify" shooting a young deer any more than anyone needs to "justify" killing a trophy sized animal.

RE: passing bucks
 

A truly off the cuff, thoughtless, factless, comment.

I am blessed to live and hunt in a state with a great deer herd and much of that is due to the years of sound management.

RE: passing bucks
 

It is a comment that rings true with an ever increasing numberof hunters across the entire country! QDM is dying and it is dying because the truth of the arrogant trophy mentality that drives it is becoming more and more evident with time.

As do I...

btw, you neglected to share PA's "incredible results" with us.

RE: passing bucks
 

And what may I ask do you base that on? Without doing any research at the moment but only speaking to personal observations, I can say that I've been on my soap box for QDM on the site for at least 5 years and there are many more supporting than I've ever seen.

RE: passing bucks
 

I believe you are indeed convinced of this but IMO you have deceived yourself.

btw, you neglected to share PA's "incredible results" with us.

RE: passing bucks
 

>>Rant all you like but nobody is listening anymore.<<

LMAO...Nobody? You mean yourself and Atlas, right Sylvan? If there's been any ranting it's been from you two.

Shhh...look behind you...go ahead shoot, it has spots, but it has brown on it too, so...shoot it! :D

I'm going to be offering T-shirts for sale. let me know if you want to purchase them. Front and back will be emblazoned with the following:

"I'm a 'if it's brown it's down' kind of clown"

Atlas and Sylvan, that's two shirts, who else wants one? :D:D

RE: passing bucks
 

stoneman, not only have I not "ranted" but if you had taken the time to read what I posted you would notice that, other than it be legal, I have not advocated any criteria for the taking of a deer, be it size, sex, #points or otherwise. That is what you and other QDM'ers and AR'ers are doing. And under the false pretense of being for a healthier herd. That is what I oppose. You have arrogantly taken it upon yourself to ridicule others for the taking of legal game and enjoying the sport in the way they choose. All I've said about your philosophy is that if you want to trophy hunt go for it, but your freedom to do that stops when it comes to telling others that they should adopt your philosophy. You integrity as a sportsman ends when you ridicule other sportsman legally doing what they love to do. Just look at your post. First of all you have "assumed" I ascribe to the "if its down its brown" philosophy and then make jokes and ridicule me for it. Doesn't sound like an advocate for the "scientific" virtues of QDM to me. Sounds more like a child whining when he doesn't get his own way. Just like I said. Wa, wa wa these guys won't help me get a bigger buck! wa wa wa... (see, I can ridicule and make jokes too! How about we quit the childish stuff?)

RE: passing bucks
 

I agree that the excuse "if I don't shoot it someone else will" is a very weak argument for killing a deer, one of the worst.

But guys, almost every QDM hunter/landowner I know is a serious, dedicated deer hunter. They scout year round, place trail cameras out, shoot pics and video, make food plots, and spend weeks in stand each year. After reading all of these posts, it seems to me that they forget that the MAJORITY of deer hunters are not in any way that dedicated to shooting a large buck. Guys like my Uncle who hunt every year, but probably wouldn't shoot a deer if it sat on his lap. My brother who loves to hunt, but with his job may get out 3 or 4 days a year. I've got friends who take 1 huntingn trip a year and love it during that time.. .but if they don't shoot a deer during that week they get no deer. Those guys are the majority, and they don't care a bit about your quest for a huge rack or QDM.

My last point, for those basing their arguments for QDMon scientific research extolling the benefits to a deer herd, then why in most states do they have no antler restrictions, multiple buck tags or unlimited doe tags available? They base seasons, bag limits and buck / doe harvests on real research to control the quality of the deer herd. I have read an awful lot of research as well and there is defeinitely no scientific proof (yet!, I would acknowledge if it happens) forcing young bucks to be passed improves the "health" of the herd. What it does allow is more bucks with larger antlers to be in the woods each fall, but like I said, that isn't all that important to most guys.

RE: passing bucks
 

Yet to some, that's all that matters. Good post MA Jay!