Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I think the ranches are best for disabled hunters, or hunters with health problems, or hunters that can't make those long hikes on foot into today's public land. Hunters like that deserve a little adantage to counterbalance their disadvantage. that's just my opinion.

I'd like to hear your twist on the subject: Who then should be able to use ranches?

People who want meat? People who want trophies? People who have the money?
T.V. Stars like Bill Jordan? Disabled or disadvantaged hunters? People who feel it's ethical to do so?
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Hunting leaves tracks on my heart and imprints memories in my head.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I support every form of legal hunting. I wouldn't enjoy that type of hunt myself, but as long as it is legal, I have no problem with those who do. There are some ranches that do offer a very 'wild' hunt. As hunters, we need to stick together and support each other. Not to say you can't try to change the laws if you don't agree, but don't do it in public and don't divide the ranks. The same goes for baiting, dogs, trophy hunting, dove hunting, ect. If we divide ourselves, the Antis job is much easier.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I think that disabled hunters should be able to use atv's on public land to get back into the woods futher.
Grey Fantom are you talking about ranches that are fenced in like a zoo?

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I WOULD AGREE WITH GREEN, ITS A FORM OF LEGAL HUNTING I MIGHT NOT AGREE WITH IT, BUT ITS LEGAL AND IF A DISABLED HUNTER WANTS TO HUNT LIKE THAT THEN HATS OFF TO HIM OR HER.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I too agree with Green! If it is legal, it is up to you how you want to hunt! As I've said before, these &quot;pens&quot; are sometimes several thousand acres large. Even if its only 640 acres, that is a square mile of land! These deer are not exactly tame! As I said if its legal, you've got my support! Lets fight the anti's, not each other!

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

Well Im a yankee ,but learned a big lesson when I lived in South Texas.Them ranches that are fenced are huge.There are some bucks the operators only seen a couple times in years.Then there is the feeder discussion.I spent days and weeks down there huntin and seen very few deer ever come to the feeders in shooting hours. Then I Got stupid and tried walking off the road ways.Took me weeks to pick out the cactus stickers from my butt.I was never poked and stabbed so many times in my life.Looked like I was riddled with a machine gun.Not to mention the brown stripes on my underwear after the rattlesnake nailed my boot.You dont go in after them deer on them ranches,so all that ground is only for the animals,you have to stay on the shooting lanes.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I have no problem with any legal form of hunting, the only thing I do find upsetting is when someone goes to one of the fenced in garuanteed hunts, picks out the deer at the feeder, shoots it and then brags about what a great hunter they are! Do not get me wrong there are some huge fenced operations that are not that way, but some of them disgust me. Like I said if it is legal, that is fine with me, just do not come telling me what a great hunter you are if you shoot deer in a pen.

The Tazman

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I too have no problem with any legal form of hunting. Too each his own. However, let's differentiate between a high fenced &quot;ranch&quot; that has wild deer and a game ranch that has small fenced in enclosures and all the game is privately owned. Yes, there are people that have herds of privately owned whitetail that they buy/sell. These are not wild deer and hunting them can not be considered fair chase. I know of one such operation that has a private herd in a 20 acre fenced enclosure. You sit in a blind with a notebook that has a picture of each buck and a price if you shoot that particular buck.

I consider this type of shooting an animal unethical and unsportmanshiplike. It is legal and I will support the right of people who do it, but will hold them in low regard, even if they are in a wheelchair. I know of several people in a wheelchair who can't tromp through the woods, but with help they can hunt good stands for wild deer. I would whole-heartedly support their right to hunt wild deer in a blind/feeder setup.

The &quot;canned hunt&quot; is probably like the bad things that people do with firearms, you have to take the good with the bad. I don't know how you outlaw one without affecting the other.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I'm not trying to step on any toes, but here's what I don't understand. A guy back east will hunt a 10 to 20 acre woodlot and say it's fair chase. BUT....If you hunt a 1000 acre &quot;PEN&quot; it's not fair chase only killing something.
Is everybody trying to tell me a deer can't get away from a hunter in 1000 acres (or even 400) of brush?

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

Grey Fantom - Anybody should be able to kill animals on game farms - if its legal.

That does NOT mean, however, that it was hunting.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I see what you guys are getting at. A deer is a very smart creature and outwit the socks off most hunters and with 100 acres They cn do amazing things. I'm starting to change my attitude toward the ranches from total disgust to a little respect. If they're big enough you can call it fair chase or whatever you want. These last teo threads were just fire for the anti's and I'm ashamed to say that I put them up. I'm sorry if I p!ssed off anyone and plz don't reply to this anymore. thanx

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

just a little fly in the ointment here. you mentioned shooting deer inthe high fence at the feeder, yes that is pitiful, in my opinion, to even consider that a &quot;hunt&quot;. so where is the differance between that and a guys feed station in his back yard, besides the high fence?
my point is its hard to call one &quot;ethical&quot; and the other a canned hunt.
this goes back to the same ol' argument....
legal=ethical or ethical=legal?

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

Pope and Young Fair Chase rules:
Hunting deer with dogs = Fair Chase
Hunting Deer by pushing them during a drive = Fair Chase
Hunting deer over bait = Fair Chase
Hunting deer behind a fence = NO WAY

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

txhunters rules of fair chase:

Wild deer hunted on a large parcel (+/- high fence) with plenty of escape/hiding cover. Deer trails, feeding/bedding areas have to be scouted, stand sites selected, lots of time spent in the woods, and good shots made.

Pope and young requirements: couldn't care less. A trophy in my mind doesn't have to be validated to be a real trophy.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I wouldn't go on canned hunts, but I don't have a problem with people who do as long as the animals are truly wild and not tame. There should be an element of fair chase.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

A &quot;canned hunt&quot; is not a hunt for wild animals under fair chase rules. A canned hunt is one where the outcome is only in doubt if you can't shoot straight.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

if it is legal go for it now do they have to buy a regular deer license to hunt like this to contribute to better deer management or because it is private land they dont need one<img src=icon_smile_question.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

PABH, I couldn't tell. Sorry

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

Not all high fenced hunts are canned hunts. Canned hunts are usually in small enclosures where deer are not wild. Alot of the high fenced operations are several thousand acres are not meant to keep the deer in but to keep the poachers out.

Chris

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

I could care less how some one hunts as long as its legal. If some one wants to go on a caned hunt and kill a hand feed deer that is a monster there is nothing unethical about it. It is no more unethical than a cattle rancher. My only problem with it is when people try to use these deers as a record. To me you really cant call a caned hunt hunting, it should be called selective harvesting. I choose not to go on a canned hunt, that doesnt make it wrong or unetical.
I agree with a lot of people here that in some situations this would be the only way for some to get to hunt or put meat in the freezer.

RE: Ethical Or Not??? Part Two
 

Chris, that is a VERY good point. I never in my wildest thoughts (they get pretty strange) has that ever came to my mind. I'm really starting to warm up to this subject. I don't look at it with as much disgust and dislike. Once again, you guys have opened my eyes to thw world of hunting.

Thank You All.

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Hunting leaves tracks on my heart and imprints memories in my head.