podunk kennels

Acutting your right about the difficulty of hunting in high fence. I pride myself in raising good (not the best but not bad) hog dogs. When i first started guiding i was hired to run some hunts at a 350 acre high fence operation. Candy from a baby i thought..... wrong. That was the hardest hog hunting i had ever done in my entire life. The hogs that were new in there got caught but the ones that had been there long enough to learn the ropes you could forget em. I had numerous races last 3 4 and 5 hours in a 350 acre fenced in area. A lot of times it is just as dificult to hunt high fence as not but you must admit there are also many canned high fence hunts.

WIbuckchaser

Now this sounds like a great idea. I also think it should be mandatory that a picture be put in all the hunting mags of the so called hunter and his pretty little prize.

ACutting

Oh I agree completely that there are places that are running canned hunting areas. There are some associations and legislative things going on right now to try to help minimize this. That is how the high fenced industry has ended up with a bad name. But again even with the association and legistlative happenings its still necessary to respectful of the way everyone enjoys hunting. If that is legal in the area they are in then we should respect it. I for one do not enjoy hunting at a place that is offering a canned hunting experience so I avoid them. I have to admit I've been bitten a few times though. Unethical business people marketing the business as something it is not. In particular I had one place tell me I was going to be hunting a 290 acre area to get there and find that its was about 40 acres. Now I have no issues shooting animal in 40 acres knowing very good and well that I'm going exactly to that situation. I don't consider it hunting when I put my self into that situation its simply a harvest situation where I've purcashed some animals to put meat in the freezer.

podunk kennels

As hunters we are gonna have to stop all this bickering amongst each other and worry about the real issue.... the antis.

Outdoor

OK I started this and now after reading everyone’s pros & cons here goes:
1st and foremost we MUST stick together and I believe everyone here will agree and feels the same...so lets put that to bed
2nd is this not a discussion board? We are discussing the costs of Trophy Fees and Hunting in high fenced areas

So based on that I can say I have been in a high fenced area ...not to hunt but as a visit and for me its the thought that they are not free range animals and IN MY OPINION i think this gives the anti's an edge because they WILL exaggerate the fence issue.
As far as Outfitters making money I can do the math just like the rest of you can. We can ONLY assume their overhead costs so who really knows and in addition they have chosen their profession just like the rest of us. If you don't make enough at what you do you get out of the job...However I will say this some that do guide do NOT spend 40+ hours every week for 52 weeks a year on that profession. So therefore divide what they do make into what ever hours they do spend now lets compare...similar to a teacher not working all year. Again I'm not knocking it I'm just doing the math. If someone wants to spend the cash opening up a high fenced operation that’s their business just like anyone of us who decide to go into business, it’s a risk we take.
Someone mentioned sitting in a heated blind and picking and choosing "which" deer you will harvest is not all that difficult I agree. Could you imagine how many TV shows would NOT be on if they had to still hunt in every one of those shows? They do make clean kills and that is what’s important the rest is just preference.
I'm Blessed and make a very good living, self employed. Money is not the issue >>> but I'm not paying any more for better scoring buck. I don't hunt a 120 B&C buck any different than I would hunt a 200 class buck so why should a smaller one be cheaper?

ACutting

The reason the 120" is cheaper than the 200" is simple. Its just the law of supply and demand. Everyone wants the 200" so they can charge more for it. With that being said there are very few guides in the US, aside high fenced operations, that charge on a trophy fee basis. Trophy fees don't go over well in the US. So they charge the higher average cost per hunter. But again its not an issue you will run into often if you aren't hunting in a high fenced area. Some places charge an additional harvest fee once you harvest an animal but its a per animal fee not on the score of the animal. Its a more politically correct way of guaranteeing the hunt. The guides will do everything they can to ensure you get your animal because they want your additional money. The money they charged you up front is typically to ensure they are covering the necessary expenses. Its just like an automobile dealership "packing" their sale price. They buy the car for 10,000 then they immediately add 2,000 to it on the books then again add another 2,000 for profit. Well if they have to give up the 2,000 or a portion of the 2,000 due to negotiations they will but 99% of the time they will not get into that additional 2000. Those numbers are just examples don't go to a dealership assuming they all have that type of money in their cars. Back to the trophy fees themselves though outside the US trophy fees are quite common practice. The reason why trophy fee's raise such hair here in the US is because simply we aren't used to them. If the industry had always used trophy fee's we wouldn't be having this conversation at this point. We would find it odd that places don't charge trophy fees. The best thing you can do is before you book a hunt talk with the outfitter multiple times and with references, both people who were successful and those who weren't successful. You'll find out rapidly if there are any additional fee's involved in the hunt beyond the normal rate and license.

Another way to look at trophy fee's is you are trading time for money. If you have the time to spend hunting frequently and in good area you will have no reason to pay to hunt somewhere for something. Typically the people that are paying the trophy fee's don't have the time to get out and hunt other than a few days a year or even every couple years. So they replace time with money they pay the outfitter the money and his time go towards finding the animal prior to you getting there and insuring that the caliber of animal you are after is in the area and he knows where it is at so you can harvest it with in the few short days you will be able to hunt. Its just a trade off.

Outdoor

Acutting...I been on many hunts, my first in 1990 and sometimes two a year so as you can see it’s not about the cost merely principle. I certainly know what to look for in a guide/outfitter service at this point. The issue stated is why would anyone pay more for a bigger buck on an honest hunt? We pay to go to a outfitter that has a good herd in his area ...what you shoot is what you shoot. We pay for their knowledge, services and accomodations not ...that one is 23k more because its bigger.
I only see two reasons for doing so primarily the first one;
A) Your on an ego trip
B) Your a terrible hunter and need that kind of help to help prove to others that you must be "good" because of the size buck you shot
The whole thing about not having time I don't buy at all, main reason is if you have that kind of money for trophy fees (23K) you can spend more time anywhere you want.

Acutting what is the most you ever spent on a guided hunt?
Would you dish out an additional 23K above the base price for a bigger buck?

ACutting

The most I've spent on a guided hunt is about 4500. As far as your second question I'm planning on dishing out quite a bit of money when I head to New Zealand for my Stag hunt. They charge trophy fee's there and I'm expecting to spend around 15,000 when I'm there. As far as whitetail hunting goes no I'm not going to spending that type of money on whitetail because I have enough time to hunt frequently enough. I do however know people who have spent that much money on whitetails. They were hunting in a high fenced area however. I don't know of any whitetail outfitters in the US that are charging that type of trophy fee on a free ranging animal though I do expect to start seeing it soon. A guide charging trophy fee's like that is going to have a lot of time in to find the larger deer. Its going to be a full time job year round. He'd likely be planting food plots on the land for each phase of the deer's yearly cycle. He's going to be out in the field frequently learning the patterns. Once he's found a deer that is going to go 200 inches he's going to stay on top of where that deer is at pretty much all the time. So again people are trading money for time/skill. Its no different than someone paying a contractor to build a house. You don't know how to do it so you pay someone who does. Or you dont' have time to do it. In the end you still say you built your house .

Outdoor

Acutting...we are a Building & Electrical contractors and maybe we should start charging "trophy Fees" for the house's/projects we build....after all, they are "trophy's" when we get done!
Still and all there is nothing worse than hear a outfitter tell me they are no making any money...yet year after year they are still doing it! Maybe thats what the 23K was for? Should I feel sorry for them or for the fool thats paying those trophy fees?

Pursuit Hunter

Amen brutha!

Hunting should be about the process, not the end result. Too much "hornography" on TV if you ask me...