Dogs running deer
 

What do u do about a situation like this. dogs are always ruining my hunting. they have raided our camp while hunting in illinois too. what is there to do with out making the owners mad? Any one else have this problem?

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Its legal here, to shoot a dog if its chasing a deer. I dont think I could do it though. I would try blasting the crap out of them with a paintball gun or something.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

It is interesting that when I first joined the board.....this was one of the first questions I asked. I was told at the time that it had been hashed, hashed and re-hashed. Many topics such as this end up being locked eventually. It is a big problem in my area and I make two distinctions.....are they known feral dogs??? Or someones dogs that they let run and say...." No Way My dogs run deer" . Any dog will run a deer unless they have had excellent training, especially if they are packing with other local free run dogs they can and DO alot of damage at times. We are not here to talk about how to dispatch dogs that are pets...but where does one draw the line?? It is a personal choice, one of which perhaps some or many of us have had to make that call at some point.
All I will say is that I will not watch a pack of dogs run a deer til its heart bursts, or watch a pack of wild dogs hamstring and take the throat out of a fawn...or any deer. Wolves do their thing selectively, Yotes sometimes do and often do not....Feral dogs never do, and [b] dang near any dogs that run in a pack will run deer, even a pack of 6 or 7 neighbor dogs. Unfortunately these are often the most ruthless. Talk to the owners......You will know when the time is there what needs done. Nuff said from this lady......[

And folks...keep this topic decent or it will find its way to never never land.......there is more than enough on this subject in the archives, or if one just does a search. If it has not been deleted cause it got out of hand. Not trying to be a hard butt, just do not need to give Anti's any fuel for their fire here at HNI. Please keep that in mind when posting.
Thanks folks ;):)

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Clarify this, feral dogs or trained deer dogs? Suggest to the ownerof thetrained deer dogs they can easily be strapped with shock collars and this problem won't exist. I have 3 deer dogs that all have been trained with these since they were 5-6 months old. all I have to do is yell for them and they will stop running and come to me. If it is Feral dogs, no ideas

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Lonewolf, do you know who the owners of the dogs are? If so approaching them first to see if you can work something out if the first option. You say they raid your camp, all edible stuff should be stored away. All situations are different. If any of your group live there, own any of the land you hunt or do you lease the land, etc. I worked out my problem with a simple visit to the owner that owned the problem dogs.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Do waht we do, if you have a 4 wheeler, run the little buggers down.....

RE: Dogs running deer
 

If the problem gets worse, just look at them as yotes and start laying the smack down.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

I guess i need to pay more attention, I've been running the woods for 36 years and have never seen a dog or dogs come close to catching a deer. Dunno how many folks are out in the brush in June and July and in a position to actually see dogs killing fawns either. But, i guess that it does happen.
No matter. If the dogs are causing damage and disrupting hunts, then talk to the owners. If you can't locate the owners or they won't cooperate, then send the dogs to puppy heaven.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Down on the farm it is pretty darn rural and the we know the few neighbors dogs. Mostly it is gun hunting there and we don't tolerate the dogs coming thru and chasing deer. Period. We wouldn't shoot the neighbors dogs, but then again they don't let them run free. Other dogs? Too much time and money invested and too little of time opportunities.So we try to immediately dispatch them.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Uncle Matt is the Judge Dredd of southern Illinois[:o][:o]

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Unfortunately it is legal to run deer dogs in eastern NC...We have 3 different farms that have been in the family for over 30 years and the local dog hunters think nothing of dropping their dogs beside the road to run deer off our farm onto a farm that they have permission to hunt...

I have looked into this and it is a felony in NC to shoot a deer dog...When we call the game warden, he might be 2-3 counties away...Like on the movie "Top Gun"...The action is over before he can get to the area, and the dog hunters have their CB radios to warn everyone else...Its a problem, but I feel that these guys are digging a hole for themselves...I predict that within 20-30 years the tradition of dog hunting for deer will be a thing of the past...

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Here we go again.:eek:

RE: Dogs running deer
 

With all the press about animal abuse, dog fighting, hawg doging. Rest assured that it will make its way to dogs running deer.
For the record I don't like the practice, it's not hunting it's target shooting.[:@]

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Uhh, shooting at a deer running full speed is target shooting. Then what do you call it when you are taking a broadside shot at a deer standing still 20 yards from the deer stand. Yep, this thread is bringing them out of the woodwork[&:]

RE: Dogs running deer
 

The bottom line is the: If youare unable keep your dogs on the specific tract of land that you have permission to hunt, and prevent them from running onto other land and ruining other people's hunts, then you shouldn't let them off the leash.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

The dogs we have problems with are beagles mostly dogs that cant harm deer just ruin your hunting.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Let me get this right, scouting, stalking, avoiding the deers senses to gain a kill is the same as running dogs.:D
Yeah we see who has the high ground in this debate. keep trying buddy.[:'(]

RE: Dogs running deer
 

I never seen a dog that was trained for running deer , the dogs we have problems with are beagles and other breeds that cant harm the deer. but they sure mess up a good hunt.

<Sorry folks didnt know this post would be such a touchy subject >

RE: Dogs running deer
 

One thing ive learned since ive joined huntingnet is U cant ask a ? to get a answer to your problem without getting a fire started

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Here's another rule to keep in mind... Never, ever, ever, EVER, EVERsay anything bad about the .243 Win. :D

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Same thing happened to me! I was pissed to say the least. Not to mention the dogs were beagles and stayed on the scent trail of the deer and ran them to death literally! One of those little things chased a nice 8 point onto a main road and the deer got nailed! That was the last straw for me, so I called my local police department and they notified the SPCA and they set traps for the dogs and removed them from my property. Good luck!

RE: Dogs running deer
 

The initial quote that started this thread wasn't even talking about hunting dogs. But it's funny to see the responses. From subtle hints from posters that they would do what needed to be done to protect the fawns from the dogsto people saying they would outrightkill the dogs to people then jumping to hunting with dogsand how bad that is.

Whatever, it's the same oldstory,the same crowd saying hunting with dogs is unethical and non sporting are the same crowd saying they would kill dogs running deer on their property (which in the majority of states is illegal/felony, but hey it's ok to set your ethics to the side for a little while and break the lawif those pesky dogs are around ecspecially since you don't agree with the law protecting the dog anyway). If you have problems with dogs let the local authorities deal with it, that's what they are for.

Most people commenting on this aren't aware of the laws protecting thedogs(whether stray dogs or hunting dogs) and in addition to state animal crueltylaws, states that allow hunting with dogs alsohave hunting regs/laws governing the retrieval of hounds from private property and lawsprotecting the dogs on said private property. I don't know about strays but around my area it would be extremely unwise to tamper with or harm someoneshunting dogs and there would definitely be some fallout (legally) if it was proven.

We may not like all laws but that doesn't mean you can pick and choose the onesyou want to obey (even though that seems to be a pretty popular thing).

RE: Dogs running deer
 

So, you have laws that actually authorize you to trespass on private property to retrieve dogs that aren't supposed to be there? Fine... But, my son and I spend thousands of dollars on deer hunting each year, for lease costs, equipment, travel, etc., and we're only able to get into the woods for about three weekends a year. It seems to me only fair that if your dogs get onto my land, and ruin my hunt, that I should be able to sue you for damages, for the cost of the hunt your dogs destroyed, for loss of enjoyment, for punitive damages because of your gross negligence or willful misconductin allowing your dogs on to run property where you don't have permission to be, etc., etc., etc. Might be cheaper for you just to buy a new dog.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Good post. Let the authorities deal with it.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Sounds like a frivelous(sp?) lawsuit but to answer your question: Yes VA does have hunting regs which allow an unarmed (a person without a weapon not an amputee)person to walk onto private property to retrieve their animal. From the VDGIF website for 2007-08:
Hunting With Dogs
[ul][*]Dogs may be used to pursue wild birds and animals during hunting seasons where not prohibited.[*]When the chase begins on other lands, fox hunters and coon hunters may follow their dogs on prohibited lands, and hunters of all other game, when the chase begins on other lands, may go upon prohibited lands to retrieve their dogs, but may not carry firearms or archery tackle on their persons or hunt any game while thereon. The use of vehicles to retrieve dogs on prohibited lands shall be allowed only with the permission of the landowner or his agent. Any person who goes on prohibited lands to retrieve his dogs and who willfully refuses to identify himself when requested by the landowner or his agent to do so is guilty of a Class 4 misdemeanor.[*]Unlawful to use dogs when hunting any species with archery tackle during any archery season. [/ul]


And trust me I am speaking from both sides of this thing. I occasionally hunt with dogs on one of the bigger leases my club has(3000+ acres) and we have a good group of guys, hunt safe and control our dogs, but at the same time my father and I own a small farm (100 acres) in another area and we have had trouble in the past with people bringing vehicles on our property, shooting deer over our property line, and running deer outside of the legal gun season during bow and blackpowder and messing up some hunts. It took about 2 seasons to nip a lot of these problems in the bud (with the assistance of the local game wardens). They started hitting these guys in the pocket with tickets and finesand we started spending a lot more time posting and "babysitting" the property until it changed for the better. I won't say it is perfect but it is much improved and we now know club presidents and they seem to want to help and avoid having to deal with the law.

Just so you know that I understand where you are coming from and yes it is very frustrating but that is what we did in that situation and I believe it was the right way to handle it.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Why do you think it would be frivolous? I get three weekends a season in the woods. If I'm lucky, I might see one decent buck. If your dogs ruin my hunt, you don't think I've suffered any damages? I shouldn't be compensated for your failure to control your animals? What if the circus comes to town and the handlers negligently lose control of their elephants which stampede, destroying cars and houses? Should the circus not be liable for those damages?

Maybe you didn't quote all of the statute, but, from what you've cited, it doesn't appear that the dog hunters get ticketed if their dogs get on "prohibited lands." They just get a free pass to goget them...

RE: Dogs running deer
 

I f you guys knew anything about deer-dog hunting then you would know that they don't run fawns! Fawns don't produceenough scent for dogs to smell. I have NEVER seen or heard of any deer dogs catching a fawn. It just doesn't happen, the glandular secretions is what hunting dogs 'smell'. The fawns are too young to produce this. get educated before you start bashing deer-dog hunting, and don't judge deer-dog hunters by one bad example, as it sounds like the case here.

Now that I have that out of my system, I too hate being ruined by dogs, but it is part of being in a primary deer-dog hunting club. It only ruins yourconfidence, i havekilled several bucks a couple minutes after the dogs run through a block. I have seen deer feeding just squat down when they hear the dogs coming.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

You don't have to know anything about dog hunting in order to have an opinion about whether you'd appreciate having a bunch of dogs running through your private property, and their owners trespassing to get them (and protected by statute!) during deer season.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

I was replying to the comment on the first page about dogs catching fawns. I did not even read the rest of the comments, as i hear this argument frequently.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

That there is just BS! Can't they be charged for trespassing or something if you atleast video the dogs on your property?

Felony to shoot them? Then you certainly don't want to do that! A felony is a real heap of trouble in most states.

Boy I would sure hate to see those dogs eat anything that might hurt them when theyare running on your property. That would be terrible wouldn't it? ;)

RE: Dogs running deer
 

MAYBE YOU DIDN'T HEAR ME.............

NO MUTTS ON THE FARM!

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Maybe frivolous wasn't a good word. I think it would be a waste of your time and that you would probably lose since there is no law being broken, dogs can't read and if they are released on legal ground and cross over to private ground there is no crime and yes (in VA) the owner of said dog/s can get them off of private property without fear of prosecution or ticketing. Just like if your family dog dug under your fence and ran over to the neighbors yard, you couldretrieve him and that is not considered trespassing. Not saying you don't have a good point just stating what the law says, here anyway. I don't think stampeding elephants and dogs running through your property is a good comparison, but I would say that if the dog did any physical damage to your property the owner of said dog could be liable, but keep in mind deer are not property.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

I just find it absolutely outrageous that people can let their dogs run wherever and whenever they like and there are no rules other than rules that allowthem to trespass on private property. I understand that the dogs can't read. But, the owners know what land they are allowed onand what land they are not allowed on. If dogs can't be controlled to stay on legal property, they shouldn't be allowed off the leash. Period. The way it is apparently set up in VA gives the dog owners Carte Blanche to do whatever they want whenever they want, with no consequences. "Hey, my dog can't read. What do you want me to do? Sorry they chased off that 180" 10 point that you were about to shoot. Tough sh#$. Nothing you can do about it. Hey, tell you what... since they chased him over here by me, and I shot him, I'll let you come over to my place and look at the mount once a year..."

Thank God they don't allow dog hunting in Texas.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

For those straying off topic, remember that lonewolf is talking about dogs chasing deer in Illinois. Let's stay on topic. Not anything about driving deer with dogs or using them in any other manner. In Illinois it is simply illegal to use a dog in any manner while hunting. Tracking? Well that is entirely different.

Where (county) are you talking about lonewolf?

Also let's not forget for one red second that if a deer is run by dogs in a particular area - it isn't going to forget and will make itself scarce around there in the future. And since deer group, that one deer shying away will almost certainly encourage others to stay away.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

And folks...keep this topic decent or it will find its way to never never land.......there is more than enough on this subject in the archives, or if one just does a search. If it has not been deleted cause it got out of hand. Not trying to be a hard butt, just do not need to give Anti's any fuel for their fire here at HNI. Please keep that in mind when posting.
Thanks folks ;):)
[/quote]

You tried your best Christine B. Hey Lonewolf, I missed the part of your post where you mentioned folks hunting deer with dogs?? :eek:

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Uncle,
Actually we are on topic as this is the original post and sinceI happen to have had "situations like this" and dealt with dog owners herein VA I would say my input applies. Furthermore, it would appear that Lonewolf was talking about another location initially as he then referred to having had dogs raid his camp in illinois "too" (which means also, in addition to, as well as).

Here is some law for you though from your states (Illinois) regulations on animal cruelty. Just thought you should know in case you decide to serve up some antifreeze dog chow. There is also about 40 pages describing all of the laws in regards to killing or maming dogs, which is illegal by the way.

(510 ILCS 70/6)

Sec. 6. Poisoning prohibited. No person may knowingly poison or cause to

be poisoned any dog or other domestic animal. The only exception will be

by written permit from the Department for the purpose of controlling

25

diseases transmissible to humans or other animals and only when all other

methods and means have been exhausted. Such a written permit shall

name the person or persons conducting the poisoning, specify the

products to be used, give the boundaries of the area involved, and specify

the precautionary measures to be employed to insure the safety of humans

and other animals.

This Section does not prohibit the use of a euthanasia drug by a

euthanasia agency for the purpose of animal euthanasia, provided that the

euthanasia drug is used by or under the direction of a licensed veterinarian

or certified euthanasia technician, all as defined in and subject to the

Humane Euthanasia in Animal Shelters Act.

A person convicted of violating this Section or any rule, regulation, or

order of the Department pursuant thereto is guilty of a Class A

misdemeanor. A second or subsequent violation is a Class 4 felony.

I would like to say I understand but killing dogs because they mess up your hunting is illegal in most cases, so I guess I would say I understand your prediciment just don't agree with your actions. Lets all start disregarding the laws we don't like or agree with, that will show them how ethical we are.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

I've had problems in the past where people let their dogs run loose and refused to pen them up. We asked them twice to keep them on their own property and when they refused we shot one of them. Their attitude was they could do whatever they wanted and there was nothing anybody could do about it. After the first one was shot the locked up the other ones.My uncle had problems with dogs getting in packs and killing his calves. Most of them were feral dogs though a few were from the neighbors and when he caught them he told the neighbor about it and they refused to believe their dog would do something like that. He ended upkilling over 20 dogs on his propertykilling hiscalves. They would kill them and leave them lay and never try to eat them.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

its ok here to shot them if they are runing deer an thats just what i do

RE: Dogs running deer
 

Not in the state of Ky its not.

RE: Dogs running deer
 

MAN THIS IS A TUFF TUFF QUESTION ....A HUNTERS FIRST RE-ACTION WOULD BE TO SHHOT THE DOG ...BUT ITS REALLY NOT THE DOGS FAULT HE'S DOING WHATS NATURAL FOR A DOG TO DO AND LIKE US HE WANTS TO HUNT ...I FAULT THE OWNER OF THE DOGWHO LETS THAT DOG RUN WILD WHICH A LOT DO OUT IN THE COUNTRY ...I WOULD TRY A WARNING SHOT TO SEE IF I COULD SCARE HIM OFF BECAUSE MOST LIKELY HE HAS RUINED YOUR HUNT ANYWAY ...AND IF I COULD I WOULD TRY TO FIND THE OWNER AND REASON WITH HIM ...IF THAT DIDNT WORK AND THE DOG CAME BACK I MIGHT TRY SHOOTING HIM WITH SOME ROCKSALT ...I JUST DO NOT HAVE THE HEART TO SHOOT A DOG ...SPECALLY WHEN THEY KNOW NO BETTER ... IF ITS A PACK OF DOGS THEN I MOST LIKELY WOULD TRY TO SCARE THEM OFF BUT IF THEY KEPT COMING BACK I WOULD LIGHT THEM UP

dd