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RE: Deer Drives...
opinion is opinion. After scouting for most of the year. I am pretty sure I know some butof the patterns the deer are running but definitely not all. Especially as the rut approaches. I know guys whose scouting, and they may have done lots, has been waisted due to the wrong times to scout and hunt. This is why, I believe that most of us become more successful , as I like to say, "time in" occurs. This is definitely true after not spending years but decades hunting the same hunting locations. For Bow and ML I always track and stalk if I'm not in a tree stand. I have done this to assist both mychildren to learn the signs of the woods as well as to familiarize them with this the very yarge area that they are hunting. Yes there have been a couple of times where I have made a couple mile treck to get down wind and walk slowly in a push towards them. I had blaze taped their max. shooting distance and I had marked an are where I would becoming from as a no shoot zone. Has this system been successful? Just a couple of times out of manybut we have harvested a couple of does. Now that they are older we do not do this practise.Iwas trying to teach them to be sight hunters and not sound hunters (I've seen too many in my day that shoot on a break of a twig). This is easy to teach when they are at your side but comes a time when they will be on their own. As to full scale bush pushing...It is very dangerous and I would not be part of it. There have been people whom have invited me to go, (and I've seen some large groups of 15 or more) but this is not the hunting that I enjoy. I've seen numerous hunters get hurt using this method. I believe that if you put the time in, use both bow as well as ML seasons to assist you with further scouting, for rifle season you should never have to use a drive method. Some may say that in their area it is a nessecity but I could not comment for I am ignorant to their hunting location and I would be incorrect to make judgement on a situation where I am not familiar. What I do know is that it takes less skill and effort to pound through a bush than stealthly scout, locate, set up, and then harvest a deer clean and humainly by tracking and stalking a deer. I hope I have have not offended any one with my opinions.
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RE: Deer Drives...
In the hardwoods of Pennsylvania, the best way to hunt deer after the first day is by putting on a drive and having posters and drivers.
Just that most people here do not understand the principals of posting and driving. When you become a driver, you give up your right to be a poster. Your job is to move deer into the other hunters. When I put on a drive, I start at one end of the woods and I push deer until I get to where the posters are at. My problem with my family members is that when they see deer they quit driving because they want to shoot deer too. When you quit moving the deer, they will go in what ever direction that they want to go because there is nobody forcing them to move in your direction. So here you are standing in one place waiting for the drivers to come out of the woods and waiting to see the deer, and the drivers are standing 1/2 a mile away because they saw a deer and they wanted to shoot it and it got away and you thought that they were going to put on a drive and the whole time - all they wanted to do was shoot a deer. Driving deer only works when you have co operation from all the hunters in the party. If you have 5 - 10 people, you can get 5 - 10 deer a day - if you do it right. |
RE: Deer Drives...
I wouldn't hunt any other way. Ya do mean drive up to ah deer and shot it?
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: The Rifleman In the hardwoods of Pennsylvania, the best way to hunt deer after the first day is by putting on a drive and having posters and drivers. Just that most people here do not understand the principals of posting and driving. When you become a driver, you give up your right to be a poster. Your job is to move deer into the other hunters. When I put on a drive, I start at one end of the woods and I push deer until I get to where the posters are at. My problem with my family members is that when they see deer they quit driving because they want to shoot deer too. When you quit moving the deer, they will go in what ever direction that they want to go because there is nobody forcing them to move in your direction. So here you are standing in one place waiting for the drivers to come out of the woods and waiting to see the deer, and the drivers are standing 1/2 a mile away because they saw a deer and they wanted to shoot it and it got away and you thought that they were going to put on a drive and the whole time - all they wanted to do was shoot a deer. Driving deer only works when you have co operation from all the hunters in the party. If you have 5 - 10 people, you can get 5 - 10 deer a day - if you do it right. Yea, I don't blame ya for coming up with a new profile just yesterday. |
RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: The Rifleman If you have 5 - 10 people, you can get 5 - 10 deer a day - if you do it right. |
RE: Deer Drives...
How can I put this - so that you will understand?
I am a forum moderator at another site. While doing a goggle search for information for an article that I was writing I came across this site. It seemed like a pretty nice site so I joined. I made3 or 4posts and left. A day goes by and instead of people saying "Hi and Welcome to the Forum" You said look at his post - he must be somebody else and changed his name or something. What a bunch of bungholes. I live in Pennsylvania;most of the land in Pennsylvania is public property. There is no way that you can control who shoots what. They can go wherever they please, as long as they stay off posted property. People can shoot anything they want - as long as it has the right amount of points. There are an almost unlimited number of doe tags ( 1 Buck tag + 1 doe tag + a bonus tag if you applied and your application was picked ) + DMAP tags and RedTag Farms - with free antlerless permits, and very few deer left because of it. You got to shoot them when you see them, and if you shoot it - you gut it. This is not hunting on a farm or a game preserve or a lease like you must be doing. I live in a 4-point area. That means that unless the BUCK has 4 points on one antler, a point beingmore than 1 inch long - you cannot shoot it. It could be a MONSTER 6 point - 3 x 3 and you cannot shoot it unless you are a disabled hunter or a youth - below the age of 18! The problem with leaving does walk is that even if you let it go, the next hunter down the trailwill probablyshoot it anyways. Our Rifle season is only 2 weeks long and you cannot hunt on Sundays. That means that you have no more than 12 days to get your deer and there is no exceptions for the weather. That means that if you have a job, do not have any vacation, the only time you can hunt is the first day and the two Saturdays. 3 days to get a deer. My family takes off the whole first week. The first day of Rilfe Deer Seasonin Pennsylvaniais a State Holiday. The Steel Mills and the Coal Mines and the Timber Industry all close down for the day, along with most of the factories and the manufacturing industries. In my section of woods, I heardabout 400 shots the first day of Rifle season and only saw 3 deer. The second day I heard about 150 shots before noon and only saw 2 deer. The third day I heard 40 shots and only saw 1 deer. When I went to the grocery store, the bank, Church: -everyone was bragging how they shot a doe right off the bat on the first day so they would have some meat in the freezer. Then if they wanted to - they could go out and hunt bucks the rest of the season. All they wanted was the meat. Funny thing was as soon as it got cold or wet or windy - they were the same people that stayed home. My family will not shoot a doe until the first Saturday and will not shoot one unless the person is going to use the meat and it is cold enough to put it in storage or take it to a processor that can cut it for us. Our processor is Amish and he does not have refrigeration - so if it gets above 50* outside - chances are that you are going to loose your deer. This Amish mancuts a deer for $25 and he makes jerky and bologna and wieners and kielbasa and pepper sticks for $1.50 a pound. So the next time you buy that little 4 oz bag of jerky at Wal Mart for $5 - you can just remember that I got 3 pounds of meat for the same amount of money. I had whole deer cut up and processed for $80! Thanks for welcoming me to your forum! |
RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: The Rifleman How can I put this - so that you will understand? I am a forum moderator at another site. While doing a goggle search for information for an article that I was writing I came across this site. It seemed like a pretty nice site so I joined. I made3 or 4posts and left. A day goes by and instead of people saying "Hi and Welcome to the Forum" You said look at his post - he must be somebody else and changed his name or something. What a bunch of bungholes. I live in Pennsylvania;most of the land in Pennsylvania is public property. There is no way that you can control who shoots what. They can go wherever they please, as long as they stay off posted property. People can shoot anything they want - as long as it has the right amount of points. There are an almost unlimited number of doe tags ( 1 Buck tag + 1 doe tag + a bonus tag if you applied and your application was picked ) + DMAP tags and RedTag Farms - with free antlerless permits, and very few deer left because of it. You got to shoot them when you see them, and if you shoot it - you gut it. This is not hunting on a farm or a game preserve or a lease like you must be doing. I live in a 4-point area. That means that unless the BUCK has 4 points on one antler, a point beingmore than 1 inch long - you cannot shoot it. It could be a MONSTER 6 point - 3 x 3 and you cannot shoot it unless you are a disabled hunter or a youth - below the age of 18! The problem with leaving does walk is that even if you let it go, the next hunter down the trailwill probablyshoot it anyways. Our Rifle season is only 2 weeks long and you cannot hunt on Sundays. That means that you have no more than 12 days to get your deer and there is no exceptions for the weather. That means that if you have a job, do not have any vacation, the only time you can hunt is the first day and the two Saturdays. 3 days to get a deer. My family takes off the whole first week. The first day of Rilfe Deer Seasonin Pennsylvaniais a State Holiday. The Steel Mills and the Coal Mines and the Timber Industry all close down for the day, along with most of the factories and the manufacturing industries. In my section of woods, I heardabout 400 shots the first day of Rifle season and only saw 3 deer. The second day I heard about 150 shots before noon and only saw 2 deer. The third day I heard 40 shots and only saw 1 deer. When I went to the grocery store, the bank, Church: -everyone was bragging how they shot a doe right off the bat on the first day so they would have some meat in the freezer. Then if they wanted to - they could go out and hunt bucks the rest of the season. All they wanted was the meat. Funny thing was as soon as it got cold or wet or windy - they were the same people that stayed home. My family will not shoot a doe until the first Saturday and will not shoot one unless the person is going to use the meat and it is cold enough to put it in storage or take it to a processor that can cut it for us. Our processor is Amish and he does not have refrigeration - so if it gets above 50* outside - chances are that you are going to loose your deer. This Amish mancuts a deer for $25 and he makes jerky and bologna and wieners and kielbasa and pepper sticks for $1.50 a pound. So the next time you buy that little 4 oz bag of jerky at Wal Mart for $5 - you can just remember that I got 3 pounds of meat for the same amount of money. I had whole deer cut up and processed for $80! Thanks for welcoming me to your forum! If you are who I think you are from the site that I think you are from, I hope you take offense to everything posted here and leave. You are not in a position on this site to ban someone for no reason. You are better off staying where the members think you are somebody (and take wolfhound with you). By the way, I process my own deer and make my own sausage and jerky, so $80 per deer sounds high to me. Between my son and I, we killed 11 deer in 2 states, and by my math, that is $880. I can use that savings to justify my $750 taxidermy bill to my wife. Thanks for the help. |
RE: Deer Drives...
We do them up in Northern Wisconsin after opening weekend of gun season. I hate the groups that do them
during the opening weekend. But I understand some can only hunt that weekend but what about the other guy that likes his solitude. Almost all of the opening weekends I have hunted up there since 1984 they were moving anyways on opening weekend. Starting Monday it usually gets quiet until Thanksgiving then it seems like a mini opener again with lots of movement. Yes we have gotten plenty of deer during drives. |
RE: Deer Drives...
I don't like deer drives. I used to be involved in them, but it just seemed like rapeing the woods.
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RE: Deer Drives...
Raping the woods.Yall must have been so good at driving deer that you killed every deer that came by.In that case you did the right thing by stoping.
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RE: Deer Drives...
I hunt in South Carolina and we do deer drives on the last weekend to clear out does off the land and to get meat in the freezer.
And also, Rfleman, if its 70 degrees out and you kill a monster 10 point what happens to the meat? you said that amish guy has no refigeration so how does that work? Does it just go to waste? |
RE: Deer Drives...
I am pretty sure they are illegal in Indiana. I would much rather sit in a tree and enjoy nature anyways...:D
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: indianahunter83 I am pretty sure they are illegal in Indiana. I would much rather sit in a tree and enjoy nature anyways...:D |
RE: Deer Drives...
I never said there wasn't a lot of skll involved in deer drives! I get a lot of my thinking done when I am outside alone up in a tree. I do think doing drives would be a lot of fun but for now I will stick with the relaxation of my summit
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RE: Deer Drives...
bone, It has nothing to do with killing all of the deer! It has to do with harassing the deer all day. Im not talking about putting on one drive and thats it. I am talking about chasing them from one patch of woods to the next and back.
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RE: Deer Drives...
So say harrassing and not raping there is a big difference.
Heres the bottom line.If you like setting in a stand thats great I fully support your right to do so.If you like to drive deer thats great also it can be very exciting.I like both tactics and am guilty of employing both.For me its like using the right tool for the job. All I'm saying is this.We need to understand that different people do things different ways.United we stand and divided we fall.Another web site I visit has been attacked by a virus planted by (PETA).If you think we are not under survalence by forces that would take our way of life away your sadly mistaken. |
RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: findinbone So say harrassing and not raping there is a big difference. Heres the bottom line.If you like setting in a stand thats great I fully support your right to do so.If you like to drive deer thats great also it can be very exciting.I like both tactics and am guilty of employing both.For me its like using the right tool for the job. All I'm saying is this.We need to understand that different people do things different ways.United we stand and divided we fall.Another web site I visit has been attacked by a virus planted by (PETA).If you think we are not under survalence by forces that would take our way of life away your sadly mistaken. |
RE: Deer Drives...
I have the same opinion weather peta is watching or not. You think they don't know about deer drives? I am just stating my opinion just as everyone else is. I used to think deer drives were cool when I was young. Do deer drives if you want, I don't care! I just had my fill of them.
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: findinbone All I'm saying is this.We need to understand that different people do things different ways.United we stand and divided we fall.Another web site I visit has been attacked by a virus planted by (PETA).If you think we are not under survalence by forces that would take our way of life away your sadly mistaken. |
RE: Deer Drives...
No Mr Big the gest of what im saying is why cant we all just get along.Feel free to twist those words however you feel you need to.
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: NEW61375 ORIGINAL: findinbone All I'm saying is this.We need to understand that different people do things different ways.United we stand and divided we fall.Another web site I visit has been attacked by a virus planted by (PETA).If you think we are not under survalence by forces that would take our way of life away your sadly mistaken. |
RE: Deer Drives...
as montgomoery gentry says" you do your thing ill do mine" ill hunt my way you hunt yours an at the end of the day hopefully we'll all be cleanin deer an fryin some tenderloin!!!!!!
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: MdDave as montgomoery gentry says" you do your thing ill do mine" ill hunt my way you hunt yours an at the end of the day hopefully we'll all be cleanin deer an fryin some tenderloin!!!!!! |
RE: Deer Drives...
Deer drives can be productive, especially after a week or so of rifle season. But I would rather not do them, especially during the rut because the deer tend to go nocturnal. My Dad always wants to do them, but over time we got him to limit them to the second weekend of rifle season, for the most part. I think over all you will be a lot more productive if hunt the deer with them knowing they are being hunted, especially the big bucks we all want to kill.
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: ben673 Deer drives can be productive, especially after a week or so of rifle season. But I would rather not do them, especially during the rut because the deer tend to go nocturnal. My Dad always wants to do them, but over time we got him to limit them to the second weekend of rifle season, for the most part. I think over all you will be a lot more productive if hunt the deer with them knowing they are being hunted, especially the big bucks we all want to kill. I am not a tree hugger by any stretch, but when I see deer drove, they look haggard. I have been hunting in WV in the early 90's and PA drivers come down first morning on public land, and I see does foaming at the mouth, wounded (can't shoot does that time), and find other does left because they accidentally shot them. Also hear bullets whizzing thru the air.Yea, it put a permenant bad taste in my mouth for driving. In fact, I won't hunt GW forest in WV anymore because of the Pa hunters who drive down there. |
RE: Deer Drives...
we did one this past season (normally do o a couple every season) but this year was successful we got 2 bucks and a doea 8 pointwas shot by my uncle and on the last drive of the day a buddy from Canada shot a doe and while he was gettin ready to gut it a 8 point came running by and he was lucky enough to pick up the gun fast enough to shot him before he broke down over the hill so yea the deer drives have been successful for us this past year
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RE: Deer Drives...
Last season on the opening weekend of muzzleloader season me and 11 friends took 14 deer in two days while doing deer drives. I think this is very impressive for single shots. The hunt was done on land with a very high deer population(we counted around 96 deer that we saw that weekend). we took 12 does, a spike, and I shot a 5 point out of pitty, He had been hit by a car(this is my guess, he had a broken leg and when i skined him his entire front 1/4 was all bruised)and could hardly walk.
On another note: my hunting buddies and I also like to do deer drives with our bows, this is much harder and we are lucky to get 1 or 2 when we go out. |
RE: Deer Drives...
Wow I was surprised to see the strong opposing opinions about this. I can't agree with driving being slob hunting. I hunt several pieces of private land usually in groups of 4 or less. During ealy season we gerally sit in stands or ground blinds and wait for the deer to come to us. Sometimes the hunters on adjacent land do the work for us and drive the deer off their property and to us waiting on ours. That's how I got my 10 pt opening day last season (a hunter on the adjacent state land shot very near our land border and 5 minutes later the buck showed up and walked to within 15 ft of my stand). Now as the season goes on deer go very nocturnal and tend to find some thick brush to lay down in here in NY. We generally still stand/blind hunt the mornings but after half a day standing in one spot and seeing nothing you do get a bit anixous to move around a bit. So we do some stalking and driving. The one property we hunt has a few areas so thick you would never be able to harvest a deer in (walking through them to drive is even near impossible) As the day wears on we usually sit one or two people and drive one or two through these areas and we've been pretty successful in occasionally poping a deer out of these areas. I personally wouldn't do a drive with tons of people for safety reasons and wouldn't do one with people I ddin't know very well and trust. We have strict rules about the posters not shooting at the deer untill they continue past you and are close to 180 degrees in the opposite direction of where drivers are walking in from. Also Drivers should not be firing at deer. Drivers should be wearing orange, and nobody I hunt with will shoot at sound (if they do I guarentee I'm never inviting them to hunt with me again).
I can understand people being annoyed by drivers when they are both on state land, I wouldn't be happy if someone came walking right past my stand either, but just think that same person may scare a deer right to you just as easily as scare one off. It bothers me that some would call for deer driving to be outlawed, if you don't like hunting that way then don't do it, but I don't care for someone to tell me I can't hunt that waybecause you don't likethat method. I find deer drive hunting to be quitechallenging especially with small groups as we use to do them. Trying to find and push a deer in the direction you want and prevent them from looping you is far more difficult then you can imagine with such a small band of people. At the same time fun and challenging (or I guess you could even call it sporting). On the other hand sitting30-40 feet up in a tree and deer walkingpast with little chance to see or scent you in some cases I find to be perhaps less of a challenge, especially in areas where people claim to see dozens of deer a day from their stands and basicaly you can take your pick. Our areas are not so thick with deer that we are afforded that luxury of sitting in one place and seeingtons of deer consitently. Think about it how would you like it ifa bunch of drive hunters started clamoring for stand hunting to be illegal because maybe it's not as sporting because the deerwon't bust you as easy as ground hunters. Just be careful what you wish for otherwise next thing you know your way of hunting will be outlawed. |
RE: Deer Drives...
I hunt some land where the deer pop. is very low, but its a great bunch of guys so I always return for the opening week. In Ontario you get one antlered tag when you buy your lisence, its a lottery system to see if you can use it for antlerless. Besides sightings and sign a sure way to know if you are in a good area is by how easy it is to get an antlerless tag, good areas have a 100% success rate, poor areas its tough to get them.
Bottom line is I've hunted there with twelve guys and 2 doe tags between us, if we didn't push the bush we'd probably take home less than 1/2 the meat we usually do, and as it is we have many unused tags every year. |
RE: Deer Drives...
I thought Montgomery Gentry said "you put that bear in the cage and I'll shoot him"
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: bigcountry Yea, I have been on deer drives. Yea, they work. I find them annoying and basic slob hunting. I do not call it hunting, but driving. Hunting to me is learning deer sign, and how to read it, doing your homework, and it paying off. Hunting is sneaking in that critters home and him not knowing it. Driving is basically stranding an animal, giving him very little way out. I would love to see it banned, myself. I killed a large 8 point 10 years ago on a drive. And I was never proud of that kill. |
RE: Deer Drives...
Let's see, get out and actually tromp the brush and have to take challenging shots at running animals. Yeah, what a bunch of slobs. I prefer the pure sport of sitting in a stand taking a 20 yard broadside shot at a still animal.
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: Lanse couche couche and have to take challenging shots at running animals. Yeah, what a bunch of slobs. |
RE: Deer Drives...
12 gauge, 3 1/2", 00 buckshot. Cancel Christmas Mr. & Mrs. Whitetail.
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RE: Deer Drives...
tromp the brush and have to take challenging shots at running animals |
RE: Deer Drives...
In our deer drives we don't shoot at running deer. The people posted are far enough back from the area being pushed out that they aren't shooting at a deer running full steam. I know for a fact I'm not good enough shot to guarentee a humane kill in a deer running full speed. The last time I sat a drive I waited till the deer had gone past me and stopped before taking a shot at it. I consider myselfan accurate shot and the two deer I've harvested in my 2 years of hunting were both perfect heart shots, the one time I goose hunted the one goose that came in I dropped like a stone with a head shot from almost out of range. My personal ethics still prevent me from taking that unsure running shot though and risk wounding an animal that I won't be able to harvest. Before I get flack about being young because I stated I've only been hunting for 2 years I am not some 18 year old kid I started hunting at age 28 and will be turning 30 this october. There are also effective ways to stop a running deer with a quick shout that may give you that still broadside shot. Yea my buck I took last season waiting for it to walk within 15 feet of my stand was exciting but as far as skill was involved other then some startegy in my stand location and knowing how to sit quietly that was about it. If I didn't blow the bucks heart apart when it stood like a statue at 15 feet broadside to me with my 12 gauge, or at least have a good vital hit I should give up hunting. A shot at a bear in a cage as some of you like to joke was probably just as difficult and sporting as that shot I took from my tree stand.
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RE: Deer Drives...
i have for doe, i don't think its a way to go after big bucks. its not challanging at all
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RE: Deer Drives...
ORIGINAL: Lanse couche couche Let's see, get out and actually tromp the brush and have to take challenging shots at running animals. I will edit my above statement by saying if you are proficient enough to cleanly kill a running deer. More power to you, BUT the average hunter does good to hit the 20 yard broadside deer when the adrenalin starts flowing. There in lies the problem. |
RE: Deer Drives...
The late part of gun season we do some drives and rarely do I see a deer running full steam. From my experience they don't generally do that unless pushed very hard or they are crossing fairly open ground. Most of the deer I see and all of the ones shot this past seasonhave been slipping out, they may run or bound a little but then they stop or slow to afast walkand scan ahead or listen then start moving again. Just like any other style of hunting, you set up where you anticipate getting a good/closeshot on the deer and take the best shot presented, sometimes there isn't any shot presented. I'm sure there are guys that don't do it that way, or shoot at anyting moving, and have questionable ethics / practices. But it definitely is not everyone that does deer drives.
As far as it is not being challenging for bucks or any deer for that matter, I guess you are right to a point but realistically it is no more or less challenging than killing deer from a stand or blind or most other methods, if you have some decent land to hunt and a reasonably healthy deer herd itshouldn't be a question ofif you are going to kill a deer, it should be more like when and how many and what kind, it ain't rocket science,with all of the advantages we as hunters have it isn't that challenging to begin with unless you strictly pursue big, mature bucks and I would say statistically speaking drives probably produce less trophy bucks than anyother method mentioned and based on that opinion I would say that makes it more challenging to kill a big buck with a drive(their too smart for the most part). That is just a guessbased onwhat I have seen and my experiences. As far as wounding deer or taking shots that shouldn't be taken, doesn't that happen in every season with every weapon? Thathas more to do with the shooter than his chosen method/tactic of hunting. How many wounded deer threads will we see this upcoming season in the Bowhunting Forum? |
RE: Deer Drives...
I guess my point is that to generalize all "drive hunters"as slob hunting is a very poor stereotype. Ethical hunting is important no matter what techniques you use to get to the deer. You can have unethical huntersin any type of hunting method. Unethical hunting is a problem, I don't see driving and posting as one.
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