New Dog ~ Time to start training!
 

I'm new to the HN.com forums and thought this would be a great time to introduce myself and become an active member of the community.

I'm 26, Single, and live on a small farm on the western plains of colorado. The bird hunting is suppose to be pretty good around the area. We have multiple hunt clubs and game ranches around for hunting opportunities as well as some decent public crop land access.

I received a German Shorthaired Pointer for christmas from my family and am starting to progress into training her to be my bird dog. The main goal is to teach her basic pointing and retrieving, She will be mostly used for hunting pheasant,quail, grouse, and waterfowl.

She is now almost 15 weeks old and is showing great potential and already picking up on the training basics. I named her "Bella"

I have never trained a pointer before, And this is my first dog other than that as a kid growing up. I am an avid hunter and have hunted waterfowl in the past but never really got involved in the upland game bird scene until now.

I have been focusing on obedience training as of now, and teaching her basic commands like sit, stay, and to retrieve. I have recently started her on the "wing on a string" and trying to get her to trail pheasant wings in the brush around my farm.

I have found a few resources online to help train her to become a great hunting dog but I would be interested to see what others think on the best approach to getting her training efficiently.

I do not have the extra $$ to pay for training lessons, So I will be doing all the work myself. I have a ton of free time this spring and summer to focus on getting this done right.

I would love to hear from others on the subject and see what everyone thinks the best approach would be.

I will be ordering some live quail and chukar chicks to raise along with the dog as soon as they are available locally. Live birds early on in the training program are suppose to help significantly.

Thanks for reading through all my ranting~ I will keep everyone updated on her progress throughout the season.:wink:

EDIT:Fixed the pics~:biggrin:

First off - Realy nice looking pup

Second ~ do look at the link I gave you as the North American Versatile Hunting Dog Assoc is just your ticket for people who want to learn to train their own versatile pointing dog. That is NAVHDA's grass roots! People helping people train their own versatile pointing dog. There is a Colorado chapter.

http://www.rmc-navhda.com/


Let me know how I can help as I know a few out that way.

JW

I second the "good looking pup" comment.

Best advise; keep it fun...........after all it's already breed into her !!!


Mostly, you need birds to train a bird dog.

Bella looks like she's gonna be one hella of a hunter.

I would recommend you get their (NAVHDA) blue book (or whatever color) and read it first. Then when you're training, you have something to reference to. Another good book is Joan Bailey, "How to Train Your Gundog to Train Themselves." Sorta a pre-sequel to the blue book only this book starts is for young puppies to formal training. The only problem I see is her banging pots recommendation.

Is Bella your first dog? I'm asking because there are alot of tips out there, some good and alot of bad.

RMH

Be careful of what you are teaching now (before you get on a good training program).
Many Pointer dog folks don't teach SIT or they wait until after WHOA to teach SIT.
Wing on a String might be useful for testing young puppies, but it isn't recommended for actual training.
Teaching SIT/STAY is redundant. SIT means sit until given another command (no need for STAY).



.

Thanks for the replies guys. I will be purchasing a book or two in the near future when I get my finances caught up.

Bella is my first personal dog, But I grew up around dogs. We had beagles growing up that were trained to be deer and hog dogs, So I understand the basics of making a decent working dog out of a pet.

Bella is already trained to "sit" before almost every other task. She doesn't eat, get the bird tossed for a retrieve, Release the bird, or receive any treats or praise until she sits.

Because I do alot of waterfowl hunting, instead of "stay" I have been teaching her "hold" until the command is given to fetch the bird. The last thing I want is bella to be running around outside the blind every time a bird falls out of the sky. I guess "hold" is just another word for "whoa" in the long run.

I've been using the wing to just get her use to the bird scent and being gentle while retrieving them. She initially would chew and eat the wings but she seems to be picking it up really fast and no longer tries to eat it every time I toss it out in the field. I attached a couple of the wings to a training dummy so she is use to retrieving a bird like object.

I am not going to be too critical on following a "program" to train my dog. I will teach her the basic obedience commands and then add live birds to the mix will be the first steps I will be taking. Birds are a must to get her to be a "bird dog".

I have been hiding the bird wings in the brush along the ditch outside prior to letting her out. She finds the wings every time! We make a game out of running the ditch along the property a few times a day and locating the wings. I also add some fetch in the mix just to get her use to bringing it back to me.

Last night we scared a rabbit up and she immediately chased after it until it hid in some thick brush. She sniffed around for awhile but never flushed him back out.

Thanks for the replies and advice again! I will definitely be needing some help along the way.

RMH,

Try to keep her from running rabbits with the command, "leave it".

BTW - sounds like you are well underway........................


Make sure to keep it fun for you both - always finish on a positive note !

I don't often see people training bird dogs to track down scent. A winged pheasant running through the bush will outrun a dog easy. Better to let the bird go then to let the dog RUN. Stuff can happen when dogs run out of range. A dog's natural desire to get at the bird is usually enough.

What a great pup and you are getting good advice and both you and the dog will be fine.

great looking dog!....I can't really give you any sound advice but I can tell you that once i learned to relax a little we were both learning more than I ever thought posible!..She taught me ALOT!!!!:biggrin:
Again, that is beautiful GSP...

I raised this breed for many years in the 70's and you will have a blast with that little dog. You have already gotten some great advise and you and the dog will be just fine.
Keep it fun .

Thanks for the kind words everyone, Me and the pup have been having alot of fun lately.

She gets to be a handful sometimes, This breed really is hyper compared to some of the other dogs ive been around.

The main thing I need to remember is that shes just a puppy, and to keep the training fun. She is doing great so far and has the retrieve bit down. I picked up a training dummy dove and she loves playing with it!

I'll be picking up some live birds whenever the local agriculture supply store is in stock.

Don't push too hard when yard training. Too much pressure, especially on a pup, and you will see some indication, an out, of the begining of the dog shutting down. In field training, the dog should really be enjoying itself, so you are only limited by the time and finances.

I picked up some dog training supplies while I was at the Cabelas store this past weekend. I got a few training dummies, birds scents, new collar and lead to start "whoa" training her when its time, whistle, and all the works.

I also picked up a couple Dvd's on pointing dogs and pheasant dog training. I cant remember the titles off hand but the first movie I watched was pretty helpfull.

She is really starting to get big now and is showing real progress in the field. The other evening she was pointed up at a brush pile out on the ditch line, I figured she was after a stick or mouse as usual but decided to walk over and investigate... Right as I walked up 4 or 5 dove flushed out of the sage brush and bella was on chase after them!:happy0001:


This is the first real interest in birds she has shown so far, And must say she did an excellent job.



until next time ~ :)

*smile*

I remember when I first took my dog to a game farm. First real exposure to game birds. The next day, I took her out, she went 'hunting' alone when she normally stuck close.

Looks like you have access to a large amount of land. Just make sure you keep your pup in sight. When they start 'hunting', nothing will stop them. Enjoy.

Bella is turning out to be an excellent dog and companion :)

She loves to get out and run in the fields, and cant get enough of fetching up the bird dummies. She is right at about 5 months now and is getting very big! looks like she is going to be a larger size gsp, My brother picked up a pup from a different breeder about the same time as me and it isn't nearly as large as mine.

The pup is starting to mellow out a bit, but I can still hardly keep up with her sometimes.

Can't wait till this fall :party0005:

On a side note, My hunting rig is starting to come together, I will be slapping a lift kit on it this week some time. So far I've invested a little under $500 on this truck, including the purchase price!







:happy0001:

great looking dog!....I can't really give you any sound advice but I can tell you that once i learned to relax a little we were both learning more than I ever thought posible!..She taught me ALOT!!!!
Again, that is beautiful GSP...

I'll echo the advice of most others to keep it fun.
When you said the dog was hyper at times it reminded me of my first dog that we had to put down about a year ago. He was a lab/springer cross. Hyper as anything. One thing that worked for me was to give him some exercise before starting the training session. I would ride my bike and he would run along side me. Not a grueling run, just a nice jog for him for about 15-20 minutes. This would calm him down and get us both some exercise.

great looking dog!....I can't really give you any sound advice but I can tell you that once i learned to relax a little we were both learning more than I ever thought posible!..
:fighting0007:

Looks like you have access to a large amount of land. Just make sure you keep your pup in sight

Great looking pup! Reminds me of my dad's 2nd GSP, when I was around the age of 3! lol Keep us updated on the progress! I trained my first one when I was 13 and the 2nd by the time I was 18. I'm itching to get back into GSP's but my deer hunting has taken over with the lack of (wild) birds. My dad's dog is still around (the black one in my avatar)...turning 10 this year, big couch potato, and over weight now. lol We didn't hunt him last year and it killed me but I also know it would have killed him (had some health issues at the time)...he never had much stamina and by the age of 8 he would go 30 min. tops so we knew better than push him. Anymore, he'd rather be in the A/C or heat but that's his mentality though. My old dog would have preferred to die chasing birds...that was his mentality! LOL Good Luck!

New Dog
 

I grew up hunting birddogs my father had (pointers) and bought my first dog in the sixties, a Britany. I bought the book by Richard A Wolters, Gun Dog. I have used that book for years to train pointers, flushers, retrievers, duck, quail, and doves. I truly believe in most of the techniques it talks about. I no longer quail hunt and have no bird dogs for that reason. I have a lab mix that retrieves doves and ducks. I honestly believe this is one of the best books on the market for training a dog. You might want to look into it.

dog1

Here's my input.

Just make sure she enjoys your company foremost while being out, like she always seem to know where you are and will come in a whistle.This part is what makes them hunt close to you and makes them want to hunt with you, and not for themselves.
Bring some snacks with you and give a call every time she wanders off plus a treat.

She is first of all a pointer and a pointer has to be steady on point at all times.
Always encourage her to be steady and calm her down on point.
Barn pigeons are good for this.

Make sure you properly break her on the sound of gun fire.You have to be very careful with this as I have seen many good hunting dogs become gun shy because of misinformed owners.

The fetching of game should be a lot later when she has already mastered the steady on point first.

Work on a lot of flushed birds not shot over for a long time so she understands that every time you call her and goes with you to another spot she is going to find another one to point and flush.

Finish every training session with play. Just fuzz with her and she'll always be your friend for a lifetime.

Here's my input.

Just make sure she enjoys your company foremost while being out, like she always seem to know where you are and will come in a whistle.This part is what makes them hunt close to you and makes them want to hunt with you, and not for themselves.
Bring some snacks with you and give a call every time she wanders off plus a treat.

She is first of all a pointer and a pointer has to be steady on point at all times.
Always encourage her to be steady and calm her down on point.
Barn pigeons are good for this.

Make sure you properly break her on the sound of gun fire.You have to be very careful with this as I have seen many good hunting dogs become gun shy because of misinformed owners.

The fetching of game should be a lot later when she has already mastered the steady on point first.

Work on a lot of flushed birds not shot over for a long time so she understands that every time you call her and goes with you to another spot she is going to find another one to point and flush.

Finish every training session with play. Just fuzz with her and she'll always be your friend for a lifetime.

Just wanted to post a quik update while I had some time and was thinking about it.

She has grown up very fast in this past 10 months or so I have had her. The training is going well, mostly because of such great natural instinct bella turned out to have. She weighs about 65 pounds the last time she visited the vet and is still very lanky and has some more growing to do.

They say this breed is very active and high strung but man this girl needs a lot of attention! I expected a very active dog but she wants to run all day long, which is good when it comes to the days we get to go into the field. Anyone considering this breed really should think about it more than twice.

I am really busy with work and life in general and havn't had a lot of time to get into upland game hunting or some of the clubs in my area, so we have mainly been focusing on water retrieves for the upcoming teal and duck season. We still do pointing and woe training but I want her to be comfortable to retrieve a bird out of the water before this fall approaches, which is only a few more weeks. She does great and has really been a natural when it comes most of the training.

Thanks for all of the helpful tips, I have checked out some of the books mentioned and actually have been following the gun dog book for a few months now after receiving a copy from a friend. I will be sure to check back in when we get to drop some birds for teal and early waterfowl season.





:)

Second that . It is a great book for any dog owner, not just a hunter. I used it for all my Shorthairs.

You would find if you got around serious pointing dog people that have done a lot of dogs that they will not recommend Wolter's book. I had it years ago and threw it away. Wolter's was a retriever guy as I understand it, probably true as Gene Hill spent a lot of time with him on the book and Gene was a retriever man. The story I've heard most about it is that he got a setter to train and write a book on training pointing dogs, would not suprize me. My guru is Delmar Smith. "The Best Way to Train Your Bird, The Delmar Smith Method x Bill Tarrent. I think it's still avaliable on his site or maybe on his sons, Rick Smith. I got his book and followed it all the way thru with my first pointing dog, a Shorthair. That was years ago and though I still use the basic system I have made changes here and there that work for me.

You have a very nice looking dog there and sounds like she's coming along fine. She is pretty big, do you know the blood line? The biggest ones I had made 60#, they were males. My females all ran around 45#. Mine were Moesgarrd Breeding with a bit of Radback blood.

I've had some pretty nice pointer's but they were horseback dogs except for one "Double Cross Slim" dog. Started pointing dogs with Shorthairs though. At this time I have two setter's and just finished working with a rescue shorthair for a friend.

Rescue shorthair, "Duke"


Squirt, my oldest by two weeks


Bodie is my super star.


A couple other books that get good marks are George Hickox book and Maurice Lindsey's book. I've never read either but know a little of Maurice thru Pointing Dog Journal, he is a member there. I know people that swear by the Perfection Videos and they aren't real bad, I have seen them and they will work. There's also a big following for the "Huntsmith" stuff. That would be Rick Smith, Delmar's son. I have not seen any of his stuff. He does a lot of seminars around the country.

Don't worry about teaching your dog to sit. I teach all of mine to sit long before I whoa train them. If your dog is sitting on whoa training, it's confused and sit is a safe posture to take, generally means your not doing whoa work right. Be cautious of the wing on a string game. Nobody can resist that but it could lead to a dog wanting to sight point. If you keep doing it I would suggest you use a small rag rather than a wing, no bird scent on the rag. And speaking of scent, not many, most agree that they do little good. They claim they don't really smell like the bird their supposed to smell like. I have used bird scent but gave it up years ago.

In my opinion, the best money you can spend is on a pigeon loft and a few pigeons and on a remote release trap. The traps are relatively expensive but Lion Country Supply sells one in their own name that you can get a single trap set up for right at $200. Over the years I have had the Wag Ag set, out of business now, a set made by R&R Farms in the south east, they lasted me a bit over 20yrs. I recently gave them away as they were getting pretty old and not working well any more. I've also used the E-Z traps and found they didn't have near enough range. Could be the set I used was a bad set as that is the trap Perfection Kennels uses. You will see in their video where for some reason it does not work! They left it in hoping no one would notice. Not a big thing, just goes to prove you can make mistakes and over come them.

Try to keep her from running rabbits with the command, "leave it".

BTW - sounds like you are well underway........................


Make sure to keep it fun for you both - always finish on a positive note !

great looking dog!....I can't really give you any sound advice but I can tell you that once i learned to relax a little we were both learning more than I ever thought posible!..She taught me ALOT!!!!