Run and Gun
02-04-2008 | 09:34 PM
#21
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,420
Likes: 0
From: Where the ducks don't come no more
RE: Run and Gun
ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx
if you know what your doing, this wouldnt happen, and if this happend you would also probably be overhunting it
if you know what your doing, this wouldnt happen, and if this happend you would also probably be overhunting it
What I pieced together over those ten years was that I had to do more homework. I had to learn when to hold'em and when to fold'em. When to sit tight and when to make something happen.
Most hunters who try and "run and gun" have no idea what they are doing. The rest of them honest to God think that they never bump birds by "sneaking" up to within 100 yards of a gobbling bird and then turning on the calls with all the stops lashed down. Doesn't work that way. For a run and gun to be successful, you have to know the layout of your property very well. You need to understand the turkey's in your area, and understand their habits. You cannot blindly charge like Teddy up San Juan Hill and expect your bird to be posing for you broadside at 25 paces when you arrive.
02-04-2008 | 09:48 PM
#22
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,441
Likes: 0
From: down in a hole
RE: Run and Gun
ORIGINAL: SwampCollie
See... thats not really running and gunning. That is just moving to find a hot bird. Thats totally normal activity for turkey hunting. And true, you will run in to one every now and then.
Let me give my definition of run and gun hunting, just to clear up some of the bickering and what not. I don't honestly think I even really explained it any how.
Run and gun hunting is when you have a bird gobbling, and often when you have a bird responding to your calls... but rather than letting him come to you... you decide to go to him. You make the bird gobble... then you "run" to the bird, set up fast in a likely area somewhere between where you were and where he was... then you hopefully "gun" him.... hence run and gun. It more accurately immulates what really goes on in nature... but it is also risky because you run the chance of having a bird meet you in the middle. Part of turkey courtship is the tom strutting for the hen... and he has to have a place to strutt. He won't do it in the briars or the water... he prefers open woods, roads or fields. Makes sense. Toms usually have a spot they like to strutt in, and they are not hard to find.. writing is on the ground. If he is not in his strutting area, and has responded to your calls... you have to beat him there. Thats when your decoys... and your hustle (hence RUN) pays off.
What you and a few others are describing Hobbes is not what I consider run and gun hunting. All that is what I consider "prospecting"... just looking for one to sound off. There are in my opinion right and wrong ways of doing this.. and any time I acctually MAKE a turkey noise... I will stay where I'm at for at least 20 minutes... because birds will come in quiet. I have learned never to run that call unless I am ready for a bird to gobble 100 yards away and come charging to be in gun range in less than 30 seconds. I have been burned too many times just walking and calling randomly in semi-suspect areas.
ORIGINAL: Hobbes
I also like to "run and gun". If I don't have a bird roosted and don't hear any from the roost or a bird I've roosted doesn't cooperate after he flys down then I'll move to another area to find a bird that does want to gobble. I may come back to the area later to see if he's lost his hens or another bird has showed up, but I won't sit on my but for 4 hours without hearing a sound making the occasional yelp with the impression that is the only way to kill a limbhanger.
I also like to "run and gun". If I don't have a bird roosted and don't hear any from the roost or a bird I've roosted doesn't cooperate after he flys down then I'll move to another area to find a bird that does want to gobble. I may come back to the area later to see if he's lost his hens or another bird has showed up, but I won't sit on my but for 4 hours without hearing a sound making the occasional yelp with the impression that is the only way to kill a limbhanger.
Let me give my definition of run and gun hunting, just to clear up some of the bickering and what not. I don't honestly think I even really explained it any how.
Run and gun hunting is when you have a bird gobbling, and often when you have a bird responding to your calls... but rather than letting him come to you... you decide to go to him. You make the bird gobble... then you "run" to the bird, set up fast in a likely area somewhere between where you were and where he was... then you hopefully "gun" him.... hence run and gun. It more accurately immulates what really goes on in nature... but it is also risky because you run the chance of having a bird meet you in the middle. Part of turkey courtship is the tom strutting for the hen... and he has to have a place to strutt. He won't do it in the briars or the water... he prefers open woods, roads or fields. Makes sense. Toms usually have a spot they like to strutt in, and they are not hard to find.. writing is on the ground. If he is not in his strutting area, and has responded to your calls... you have to beat him there. Thats when your decoys... and your hustle (hence RUN) pays off.
What you and a few others are describing Hobbes is not what I consider run and gun hunting. All that is what I consider "prospecting"... just looking for one to sound off. There are in my opinion right and wrong ways of doing this.. and any time I acctually MAKE a turkey noise... I will stay where I'm at for at least 20 minutes... because birds will come in quiet. I have learned never to run that call unless I am ready for a bird to gobble 100 yards away and come charging to be in gun range in less than 30 seconds. I have been burned too many times just walking and calling randomly in semi-suspect areas.
By the way, when I said "how do you know that you arespooking birds if you don't know that you are," I was just joking... not being serious. It just sounded funny the way you worded it.
02-05-2008 | 07:53 AM
#23
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 174
Likes: 0
From: Brookport IL now in Colorado
RE: Run and Gun
I think were all talking the same talk we just aren't all carrying the same set of definitions (as if there are any). Definitely nothing toget too worked upover. There is a time and place for setting patiently and a time and place for a more mobile effort. I've done both and been successful, I've also done both and in hind sight should have done the other. I've sat when I should have ran and I've ran when I should have sat, but I learned a lot in the process. I by no means can get it right every time but I enjoy every minute I spend trying.
I've been very fortunate that I've got a lot of buddies and several family members that I love to hunt with, so if I'm not up to bat with a tag I can always find one of them that are. I was the first of our bunch to try this in 1990 and it only took a few of my stories and a couple gobbles and I had the whole bunch buying calls and vests and whatever else. When I look back I'm glad everyone of them started it up, the ride could have never been as much fun on my own. This is all fun man, I'd hunt with most any of you.
Good Luck this Spring.
I've been very fortunate that I've got a lot of buddies and several family members that I love to hunt with, so if I'm not up to bat with a tag I can always find one of them that are. I was the first of our bunch to try this in 1990 and it only took a few of my stories and a couple gobbles and I had the whole bunch buying calls and vests and whatever else. When I look back I'm glad everyone of them started it up, the ride could have never been as much fun on my own. This is all fun man, I'd hunt with most any of you.
Good Luck this Spring.
02-05-2008 | 03:37 PM
#24
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,684
Likes: 0
From: Jefferson County, Missouri
RE: Run and Gun
ORIGINAL: SwampCollie
Thats the point. Rory you were obviously born the perfect turkey hunter who can sneak in amongest them like a theif in the night and kill them with your own bare hands wearing nothing but a sleeveless cardnials shirt and cut off jeans. All the rest of us had to learn the hard way. And believe me when I tell you that I have bumped some birds in my life learning what not to do. For ten straight springs, I fumbled through the woods on my own learning the game. From the age of 8, until I finally killed a bird on my 18th birthday I probably spooked close to 40 or 50 birds, but there were 12 I vividly remember and likely another 10 I don't recall exactly. The birds got wise to me. And looking back, the writing on the wall is clear, I was moving around too much, calling in too many places too often, and letting the birds read me. Once I figured that much out, and with maturity got more patient and reflective, I started being successful.
What I pieced together over those ten years was that I had to do more homework. I had to learn when to hold'em and when to fold'em. When to sit tight and when to make something happen.
Most hunters who try and "run and gun" have no idea what they are doing. The rest of them honest to God think that they never bump birds by "sneaking" up to within 100 yards of a gobbling bird and then turning on the calls with all the stops lashed down. Doesn't work that way. For a run and gun to be successful, you have to know the layout of your property very well. You need to understand the turkey's in your area, and understand their habits. You cannot blindly charge like Teddy up San Juan Hill and expect your bird to be posing for you broadside at 25 paces when you arrive.
ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx
if you know what your doing, this wouldnt happen, and if this happend you would also probably be overhunting it
if you know what your doing, this wouldnt happen, and if this happend you would also probably be overhunting it
What I pieced together over those ten years was that I had to do more homework. I had to learn when to hold'em and when to fold'em. When to sit tight and when to make something happen.
Most hunters who try and "run and gun" have no idea what they are doing. The rest of them honest to God think that they never bump birds by "sneaking" up to within 100 yards of a gobbling bird and then turning on the calls with all the stops lashed down. Doesn't work that way. For a run and gun to be successful, you have to know the layout of your property very well. You need to understand the turkey's in your area, and understand their habits. You cannot blindly charge like Teddy up San Juan Hill and expect your bird to be posing for you broadside at 25 paces when you arrive.
we study and scout 12 months of the year, my family knows the properties we hunt very well, and we know what the turkeys like to do on the properties. and its not like we run around, we walk quietly to however close the situation lets us (woods not having any leaves you obviously cant get as close), set up quietly, and sit and wait for about an hour on the same tree, only moving to call. if you know what your doing, its a very effective way to hunt, without bumping any more birds than the "sitters" bump. when its rainy or very windy, well go set up in a part of a field that the turkeys like, cause thats what they do, they go in the fields during a rain, or bad winds. the "sitters" a lot of times tend to think that theyre not bumping birds when they get bored or get an itch, and "have to" move. when your running and gunning, you dont get as bored, and you cover much, much more ground.
if you know what your doing, whether you sitting or running and gunning, you can be very effective.
02-05-2008 | 05:55 PM
#25
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,894
Likes: 0
From: Calif
RE: Run and Gun
Great stuff Swamper,your preachin to the quire on how to kill call-shy,high pressured birds.Dont really undertand some folk's idea of a "sitter".I just dont plop myself down anywhere throw out a couple decoys and hope. Alot moregoes intothe reasoningI would choose to sit in any given area.Just because you dont hear a bird doesn't mean there isn't one there,preseason scouting,being able to read sign,history and knowledge of the area,all have a role to play as far as my confidence in my decision to sit and wait in a particular spot.Even how much pressure an area gets has alot to do with how long I'll sit in an area.Pressured birds and even gobblers that are henned-up alot of times just dont gobble,isn't it interesting how many times the woods were lit-up at dawn on the roost but at fly-down the woods go silent,a classic henned-up bird.Just because a gobbler is tight lipped doesn't mean he cant be killed and still be receptive to a call.Satellite gobblers,and even some monarchs can and will come in silent without gobbling at all.I cant tell you how many times as I've positioned myself in an area I know has birds and called blind,to suddenly be put on alerthearing a bird displaying(spitting and drumming) or walking in the leaves.Yes I've been busted too.Ya you may not get all the gobblingand soforth action,but to me boring its not.I've killed far to many birds this way when those mouthy birds are for some reason or another have quited down.Its great way to hunt when you cant (strike a bird)my term for prospecting Swamper.
