Safe or Stupid?
11-11-2016, 08:29 AM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 3,813
Safe or Stupid?
Hello all. As we all know powder is first poured into a measure and then from the measure down the barrel - never poured down the barrel directly from a can or horn.
What I am wondering: In the case of a powder flask when using a measuring spout, after filling the spout with powder and releasing the dispense button, is it safe to then pour the powder from the spout down the barrel? Or should the powder in the spout go into a measure first before going down the barrel? The flask I am talking about is this type:
What I am wondering: In the case of a powder flask when using a measuring spout, after filling the spout with powder and releasing the dispense button, is it safe to then pour the powder from the spout down the barrel? Or should the powder in the spout go into a measure first before going down the barrel? The flask I am talking about is this type:
11-11-2016, 08:47 AM
#4
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 12,747
Unlike the other two posters IMO that is what the measuring spout is for to dispense the correct amount of powder. I have spouts that measure 35, 70, 80, 90 and 100 grains of powder.
The valve is shut so there is no need to pour it into another container to pour it down the barrel. But there are precautions you need to take.
If you plan on loading immediately after firing a round you can force air down the barrel to burn off any hot embers. You see guys blowing directly into the barrel. This is a common practice but not very safe and is frowned upon my many range officers which may result in a stern warning or removal from the range. It is much better to carry a foot or so of about 3/8" flexible tubing so you can place one end into the muzzle and the other into your mouth and blow into it. This serves the same purpose.
The valve is shut so there is no need to pour it into another container to pour it down the barrel. But there are precautions you need to take.
If you plan on loading immediately after firing a round you can force air down the barrel to burn off any hot embers. You see guys blowing directly into the barrel. This is a common practice but not very safe and is frowned upon my many range officers which may result in a stern warning or removal from the range. It is much better to carry a foot or so of about 3/8" flexible tubing so you can place one end into the muzzle and the other into your mouth and blow into it. This serves the same purpose.
Last edited by bronko22000; 11-11-2016 at 08:50 AM.
11-11-2016, 09:41 AM
#5
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
Keep an eye on your valve and make sure its not leaking. Sometimes you have to take the measure apart and clean the valve as they start to "Drizzle" on the cheaper ones. An easy test is if the nose is empty, take a white piece of paper towel and lightly tap the nose on it. If the valve is solid, there should not be any power on the towel.
I have a number of those kind of loading flasks, 20, 30, and the big one is a 50. My cheaper ones will Drizzle from time to time and have to be cleaned so they tighten up. (you can also tell when you have one in your pocket and when you reach in, your pocket has powder in it)
But I load my black powder revolvers out of them. And I carry the 50 for hunting when I want to throw two charges in a gun to reload.
I will say, its not recommended, I know that. But I do it. That is not to mean you should.
I have a number of those kind of loading flasks, 20, 30, and the big one is a 50. My cheaper ones will Drizzle from time to time and have to be cleaned so they tighten up. (you can also tell when you have one in your pocket and when you reach in, your pocket has powder in it)
But I load my black powder revolvers out of them. And I carry the 50 for hunting when I want to throw two charges in a gun to reload.
I will say, its not recommended, I know that. But I do it. That is not to mean you should.
11-13-2016, 03:17 PM
#6
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: River Ridge, LA (Suburb of New Orleans)
Posts: 10,917
Those who say never load directly from a flask of that type have a point. If there's a live ember in the bore it could ignite the charge and the flask could blow up. No one would want to experience that. And I generally load from a stand alone powder measure. Yet, in 50+ years of muzzleloader shooting I have never had a charge ignite as I poured it down the bore. Nor has that happened to anyone I know.
Could it happen? Yeah, I guess so. And I've seen claims that it happened with some frequency on the battlefield and on occasion at reenactment events. But those circumstances are a far cry from the norm. Would I use a flask measure to drop the first load of the day into a gun that hasn't been fired? Sure, why not. Would I use a flask measure when I'm wiping the bore between shots with a moistened patch. Sure, why not. Would I sue a flask measure to load shortly after shooting the gun without wiping the bore. NOPE! Chance of ignition is small. But it's there. Why risk it.
Could it happen? Yeah, I guess so. And I've seen claims that it happened with some frequency on the battlefield and on occasion at reenactment events. But those circumstances are a far cry from the norm. Would I use a flask measure to drop the first load of the day into a gun that hasn't been fired? Sure, why not. Would I use a flask measure when I'm wiping the bore between shots with a moistened patch. Sure, why not. Would I sue a flask measure to load shortly after shooting the gun without wiping the bore. NOPE! Chance of ignition is small. But it's there. Why risk it.
11-13-2016, 04:10 PM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Illinois
Posts: 3,695
Those who say never load directly from a flask of that type have a point. If there's a live ember in the bore it could ignite the charge and the flask could blow up. No one would want to experience that. And I generally load from a stand alone powder measure. Yet, in 50+ years of muzzleloader shooting I have never had a charge ignite as I poured it down the bore. Nor has that happened to anyone I know.
Could it happen? Yeah, I guess so. And I've seen claims that it happened with some frequency on the battlefield and on occasion at reenactment events. But those circumstances are a far cry from the norm. Would I use a flask measure to drop the first load of the day into a gun that hasn't been fired? Sure, why not. Would I use a flask measure when I'm wiping the bore between shots with a moistened patch. Sure, why not. Would I sue a flask measure to load shortly after shooting the gun without wiping the bore. NOPE! Chance of ignition is small. But it's there. Why risk it.
Could it happen? Yeah, I guess so. And I've seen claims that it happened with some frequency on the battlefield and on occasion at reenactment events. But those circumstances are a far cry from the norm. Would I use a flask measure to drop the first load of the day into a gun that hasn't been fired? Sure, why not. Would I use a flask measure when I'm wiping the bore between shots with a moistened patch. Sure, why not. Would I sue a flask measure to load shortly after shooting the gun without wiping the bore. NOPE! Chance of ignition is small. But it's there. Why risk it.
11-13-2016, 06:40 PM
#8
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Comance county, OK
Posts: 11,408
Somewhere in my attic is a book published in England in 1839. Title is something like Safety With Firearms. It recounts numerous accidents while loading from a powder horn or flask.
At a gun shop in WV i met a man missing a couple fingers who claimed he had an accident while loading from a flask.
From the blackpowderjournal:
Quote:
While writing this segment, I was reminded of two historical stories relating to black powder safety. One is taken from The American Daily Advertiser a Philadelphia newspaper dated December 28, 1839. It reads as follows:
Serious Gunning Accident -- Mr. Joseph Askew, of Burlington, N.J., in company with his brother, Mr. Peter Askew, and Mr. Joseph Haines, were out shooting partridges recently. A covey was raised and Mr. A. discharged both barrels at them. While re-loading, an explosion of the contents of his powder flask took place, lacerating in a dreadful manner his right hand, destroying, it is feared, his right eye, and fracturing the bones of the nose and upper jaw. It is said that experienced sportsmen always put the powder into the hand, and thence into the barrel, but never pour direct from the flask.
http://www.blackpowderjournal.com/ar...s/blackmag.htm
BTW: Another common wreck back in the day was caused by the wedge falling out of shotguns. Seems like the capped nipples often hit rocks, etc. when the barrels fell off.
At a gun shop in WV i met a man missing a couple fingers who claimed he had an accident while loading from a flask.
From the blackpowderjournal:
Quote:
While writing this segment, I was reminded of two historical stories relating to black powder safety. One is taken from The American Daily Advertiser a Philadelphia newspaper dated December 28, 1839. It reads as follows:
Serious Gunning Accident -- Mr. Joseph Askew, of Burlington, N.J., in company with his brother, Mr. Peter Askew, and Mr. Joseph Haines, were out shooting partridges recently. A covey was raised and Mr. A. discharged both barrels at them. While re-loading, an explosion of the contents of his powder flask took place, lacerating in a dreadful manner his right hand, destroying, it is feared, his right eye, and fracturing the bones of the nose and upper jaw. It is said that experienced sportsmen always put the powder into the hand, and thence into the barrel, but never pour direct from the flask.
http://www.blackpowderjournal.com/ar...s/blackmag.htm
BTW: Another common wreck back in the day was caused by the wedge falling out of shotguns. Seems like the capped nipples often hit rocks, etc. when the barrels fell off.
11-13-2016, 07:11 PM
#9
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: River Ridge, LA (Suburb of New Orleans)
Posts: 10,917
OK, I'm going to go to confession with a funny story.
My very first muzzle loader was an original Belgian made 16 GA double barrel that I bought at a gun show when I was 16 years old. The table had a stack of rusty smooth bore doubles at something like $35 each, which was a lot for me at the time.
I picked the best of the lot to my eye and ended up getting it restored to shooting condition with the help of a friendly gunsmith - a real old gentleman (probably in his early 60's
). That's another story.
Well anyway. Over the next few years I shot a lot of doves, blackbirds and bunnies with that gun. About five years later, hunting rabbits in front of beagles with a guy who would become my brother in law, I had a snatch shot at a running bunny on a long going away shot.
When I pulled the front trigger both hammers fell and both barrels went off. The recoil broke the solder holding the under lug for the single barrel wedge key. The barrels jumped out of the stock and fell to the ground.
In shock, I looked down at the barrel laying there at my feet. Then looked up to see that rabbit dragging itself along the ground by its front feet. I picked up the barrel, ran to the rabbit, and dispatched it with a blow to the head with the barrel.
My brother in law, who was by this time sitting on the ground holding his stomach and laughing his butt off, has never let me forget that day.
My very first muzzle loader was an original Belgian made 16 GA double barrel that I bought at a gun show when I was 16 years old. The table had a stack of rusty smooth bore doubles at something like $35 each, which was a lot for me at the time.
I picked the best of the lot to my eye and ended up getting it restored to shooting condition with the help of a friendly gunsmith - a real old gentleman (probably in his early 60's
). That's another story.Well anyway. Over the next few years I shot a lot of doves, blackbirds and bunnies with that gun. About five years later, hunting rabbits in front of beagles with a guy who would become my brother in law, I had a snatch shot at a running bunny on a long going away shot.
When I pulled the front trigger both hammers fell and both barrels went off. The recoil broke the solder holding the under lug for the single barrel wedge key. The barrels jumped out of the stock and fell to the ground.
In shock, I looked down at the barrel laying there at my feet. Then looked up to see that rabbit dragging itself along the ground by its front feet. I picked up the barrel, ran to the rabbit, and dispatched it with a blow to the head with the barrel.
My brother in law, who was by this time sitting on the ground holding his stomach and laughing his butt off, has never let me forget that day.