PRB over powder wad
 

I have T/C Renegades and Hawkens which I normally shoot PRB out of them. I read someplace that a over powder wad would provide better accuracy. Anyone with experience with this good or bad and also is the wad pushed down alone or together with the PRB?

There are many who claim this is an extra step that really isn't needed if you are doing everything right.

However there are quite a few, myself included, who have found that their groups, off the bench, leave something to be desired, in spite of all they've tried, or their patches are all torn to shreds, that adding an overpowder wad, of some sort, really does make a difference. That wad can be your last swabing patch bunched up & shoved in on top of your powder, a felt wad, probably lightly lubricated, or my choice, a lubricated leather wad that I punch out myself.
My .58 cal. Rice barrel just wouldn't group well, so I tried my leather wad & things tightened right up. It may have just protected my patches, because instead of being all shredded, they looked re-usable.
YRMV, but it's worth a try. Others may chime in with different wad ideas I haven't mentioned.
Paul

I've a .40, .50 and .54 that all shoot tighter groups using a wad. Felt in the .40 and .50, cardboard in the .54 cal. As for loading them...they're seated separately. When I'm hunting with the little .40 I usually don't take the extra step cause it still shoots minute of squirrel/rabbit head without them ;)

I use an extra patch on my .32 upto my .58. I find it improves the accuracy of my rifles. The felt wads are ok but it's just one more thing to carry, so I prefer the patches.

I've used the felt wad under conicals for improved accuracy but never tried them under PRBs.
As for patches tearing apart I had a GPR that would do that. I did some hand lapping with some J-B compound. Many strokes. And that solved the problem. Sometimes if your patches are burning its just that your patches are too dry. Tearing is likely either burrs in the corners or on the lands of the rifling.

First off, what do your patches look like after they are shot??? Put a tarp, 20 feet or so in front of your muzzle and look at the patches, if they look like they can be shot again then your gun should group well without an over the powder wad and the correct powder charge...

An over the powder wad is typically used to hid another problem that is going on...The most common reasons for patch shredding or tearing are a sharp crown, sharp rifling, using something other than real black powder, patches that are too thin, too small a ball, a pitted or a rough bore, patches not made of linen or cotton, old patches that are lubed so the fibers have broken down or an excessive powder charge....

By putting a wad, patch or hornets nesting over the powder the gun might shoot better but you have not corrected the problem...

Find the real problem and you won't need the wad... ;)

I agree. A wad is a band-aid.

Your rifle will answer that. Some rifles shoot better with a wad and some with out. Also the brand of powder you shoot makes a difference. I find that when I shoot T-7 with PRB, a wad increases accuracy because it protects the patch. T-7 can tend to eat patches in rifles. The wad gives it and you that little extra add.

Before you try the wad, remember the load of powder might need to be adjusted too. With a wad I tend to shoot 5 grains more powder then with out. But all rifles are different.

If you have no wads, just take some old T shirt. Tear off a strip and push that down on top of the powder, then set your patch and ball. Old timers used to also use Corn Meal. 20 grains of Corn Meal poured on top of the powder, then the patch and ball also protect the patch. Mountain Men they claim also used paper wasp hive. I actually tried that once. It was fun to try, but made no difference.

So all you can do is try. And let us know your results.

I agree nc...

I have used felt over powder wads when shooting conicals for a number of years for improved accuracy but never subscribed to that for a PRB. The only time I tried it was one time I was getting burn through on my patch so my first thought was that I needed a little more lube. After still getting burnt through patches with a greasier patch, I then suspected too thin of patch material or not a tight enough weave to the material. I tried a few shots with a wad and the same patching without the excess lube and got no burn through so my suspicions were confirmed that it was improper patch material to begin with.

I have heard of some using a dry felt or fiber wad between powder and patch to keep lube from contaminating a portion of the powder charge if the rifle is going to remain loaded for a lengthy period of time while hunting, but I don't follow that practice.

If you're getting shredded patches with good patch material it's usually a sign of burrs at the crown or on the edges of the lands. Otherwise it's probably just poor patch material that doesn't have a good tight weave, same as with burnt through patches.

And I always inspect my shot patches when I shoot. No matter if I know they're made from good material.

BPS

OK: Thanks for the info. My patches are fine; no holes; shredding and only are slightly blackened. Probably could use them again but I never do. I was just trying to see if I could get a little better accuracy.

zeek...

There's nothing that says you can't try them. You may get better accuracy but if you're getting good looking patches then you've probably got a good bore and proper patching/load combo so I doubt it would be significant. But experimentation can be fun as well!

Do you wipe your bore with a dry patch or very lightly moistened alcohol or spit patch between shots? That can help improve accuracy by reducing fouling buildup shot to shot.

BPS

My patches are .018 pillow ticking lubed with Ox-Yoke Wonder lube. The ticking is cut in strips and soaked in melted wonder lube and wrung out between 2 dowels about 2-3 times and let dry. It will leave you with a very lightly lubed patch that is almost dry to touch depending on how well you ring them out. I run a moist alcohol patch about every 4-5 shots. Powder is Goex & load is 60grn in 50cal & 54cal. Works good for me; just ask the guys in the club I shoot with.

I was using wonder lube too. but don't laugh cause in a couple of my rifles my groups tightened up considerably when I switched to olive oil as a patch lube. a lot in here scoff at that but I know a couple guys who use it with good results.
I cut strips of ticking and apply the oil, roll it up tight and wring it out as best I can, then cut into squares and store in a plastic ziplock bag. I only make about 100 at a time.

Then why the original question???

My guess would be that "works good" and "works GREAT" would be in the mix there hawk. We all look for that little bit of improvement.

And the only way to know that is to actually try it... ;)

I have only used wads in my New Englander 12 ga. so I can't say about PRB's. I have used wads/wafers in my BPCR .38-55 and .45-70 and also .45-55 (TD carbine).

The shotgun is understandable on using wads, but not sure why it helps anymore for the BPCR rounds. That was the recipe that I followed. I must admit that the BP cartridges are a hoot to shoot. Playing with the accuracy is interesting. Never did try using rounds with no wads/wafers.