RE: Elitist attitude
 

Matt pretty much covered my perspective on page 18, except I can't say for sure that I'd hunt with a crossbow if I was no longer able to shoot a trad bow. As far as that goes, I can't say I'd hunt with a compound either. Art covered that very well, but I'm not going to get into that part right now.

Again, for my part I don't think crossbows or the people that use them are evil--they just aren't bows IMO. Sure they have ancient roots--so does gunpowder.

Chad

RE: Elitist attitude
 

How is weapon choice going to effect the number of deer taken. I believe the number of deer needed to be culled is calculated by the state and afforded through bag limits.





So, what is the goal of this post??????

RE: Elitist attitude
 

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bring crossbows in and I will guarantee you that the number of people in archery season doubles in 1 season. You want to see it affect seasons, bag limits and the quality of the experience that is archery season , then bring them to PA.

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So you don't want more archers ? You think we're "good" with the numbers we have ? Or you think we need more hunters, you just don't want them to use any weapons you don't deem "bows" ? Also, you are guessing what would happen, again, look at Arkansas, Ohio, Canadian provinces ..... never have crossbows been a negative on seasons/ bag limits. ever


Wow. You don't know that we're losing hunters as a whole ? That the age of hunters is going up ? That new people hunting is going down ? That doesn't bother you ? Or it does, you just want them to shoot bows that you consider "bows" ? Who's the elitist here now ?

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To ME a bow needs to be hand drawn and held for a finite amount of time by human power.

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Most all compounds nowdays do not fit that definition you know that, right ? They're mechanically drawn with triggers- not hand drawn.

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you will never convince me, I know what I want, I know what I believe, and I know how I define things. If you don't like it or it doesn't fit YOUR definitions then tough crap.

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My point is, you have the same elitist attitude I have. We both think our wepaons are better, that we're doing it a harder way, we don't want others using "easier" weapons in "our" season.

W're elitists, we snub our noses at what others use. I snub my nose at compounds, you snub yours at crossbows.

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These guys don't UNDERSTAND bows

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LOL I would say compounders don't know what bows really are and they don't know what bowhunting is either.

Admit Matt/PA that your bowhunting has been changed 180 degrees since shooting trad. Its unliked compound hunting in so many ways, its hard to even compare the two.

Isn't it ?












ranger56528 we'd all hunt with crossbows if that was our only choice, I truely believe that


no way, I don't believe that Matt / PA. Are you saying it or have you truly DONE IT ? LBR is known as a he-man in pulling bows and I bet he can't draw and hold for 25 seconds. Unless you are like a strong man or something ? If you can do that with a recurve, you can hold a compound back for 10 minutes.

Matt / PA

I don't think it is. Crossbows & compounds have the same accuracy levels, and as stated before compounds shoot higher 3D scores. You can shoot a crossbow in a minute, or a compound in 10 minutes - shooting trad gear takes a long long time to be accurate with. You know this, you've shot all of them.

You're trying to define what a bow is simply by how long you can hold it back, or the way its held back ? C'mon, a 0% letoff, 100% you hold the poundage back, can't hold for more than a few seconds recurve vs a very high % letoff you can hold back for minutes compound - thats radically different, and the compound uses a triggered release too ! A crossbow is a compound you can hold even longer, but compounds and crossbows share the holding back at high % factors



The above is 100% true.

In PA if you get 2 buck tags, kill both with archery, kill both with rifle, one with each ...... what does it matter as long as the G&F harvest goals are met ?




I'm becoming more and more the believer in one of two things.

#1 allow everything in archery season. We've got that right now in Arkansas. We've got good bag limits, 5 months of bow season and an expanding deer herd.

#2 restrict compounds and turn them BACK into a primitive weapon, maybe even so far as to ban them from general archery season. Why ? Because the spirit of what bowhunting is has been lost. There are arguments on that too and having shot compounds, crossbows and now trad bows, I better understand what seperates all 3 and its not about how long you can hold draw either.


Traditional bowhunters ARE DIFFERENT in the way they hunt, the way they approach the hunt, their ethics, comraderie etc. I believe this more and more.

What stops me from deciding on #1 or #2 is that DOES IT MATTER ? Thats a very complex question it really is, one I've not an answer for, but whats come out in this thread is something quite amazing to me.

Compound shooters are more high and mighty than trad shooters and they've got almost no reason to be. I had forgotten that. They're high and mighty, and they look down on crossbow shooters PLUS they look at traditional shooters as weird elitists too when they themselves have every bit the same attitude.

Ironically, they can't even see it

RE: Elitist attitude
 

I'm at a loss to figure out some of the logic in this thread. Since when is wanting to use the most efficient hunting technology that is legally allowed such a sin. That's kind of like some goose hunters insisting on using a single shot .410 and calling them into within 10 yards, but then raising hell because someone using a 10 gauge is unsportsmanlike and will kill more geese. I'm also at a loss to understand what part of crossBOW people can't understand [8D]

The ultimate name of the game is to kill a deer. If you are so jealous that some 65 year old disabled veteran is gonna get that big buck instead of you, then maybe you need to trade that Compound-BOW or Recurve-BOW off for a cross-BOW.

RE: Elitist attitude
 

Schultzy,
You have to remember Ive hunted with compound and recurve(Iam getting back into) for 24yrs this being my 25 and will be my 2nd owning 2 CB's...
I like my CB's just as I do my other bows,I dont hunt with rifle even tho I own several and couldnt hunt last yr with trad or compound due to my sergery but I will buy a tag durring rifle and use my CB from a ground blind,being that is is legal now......
I will tell everyone that stalking and tree hunting with a CB is no fun in my book due to the fact they are heavy and you have to make sure there is enough room all around you so the limbs dont hit anything and they are loud,I can also re-arrow 5 times faster with trad or compound then with a CB.
Even in a ground blind you have to be carfull with the limbs,not unless you have a BIG blind.....
In my open book of thoughtI consider any weapon with limbs,string and propels a arrow to bea bow and have no problem with any bow a person uses as long as they know how to use it and dont take un-ethical shots......

RE: Elitist attitude
 

We got bow seasons for the simple reason that bows - crossbows either, for that matter - ARE NOT the most effective hunting technology. Rifles are the most effective hunting technology, so poo on your logic. ;)

RE: Elitist attitude
 

an excellent question - difficult to answer it seems

A G&F has to balance things, resources available vs maximum opportunity for the sportsman. Archery season gives maximum enjoyment with relatively low resource impact.

Thats what it USE to be. Success rates increase, animals killed certainly increase, every year, because more archers take the field, and the equipment makes guys more apt to kill animals.

And thats fine, up to a point, then saturation is going to happen. Maybe. IF that happens ...... then what ? Split archery ? How fair is that to the traditional archer ? What if its crossbows that make it so, and compounders lose season because of them ..... is that fair ?

RE: Elitist attitude
 

Arthur,

Look at my post again. It was in reference to what is legally allowed. If guns are not allowed during some archery seasons, they would not be the most effective hunting technology legally allowed in that cirrcumstance. Now do you get it[&:]

RE: Elitist attitude
 

"And thats fine, up to a point, then saturation is going to happen. Maybe. IF that happens ...... then what ? Split archery ? How fair is that to the traditional archer ? What if its crossbows that make it so, and compounders lose season because of them ..... is that fair ?"

Saturation of what??? the amount of bowhunters that get tags every year??? The numbers are dropping, everywhere, so that "saturation" is not happening and what we see is more deer, and less land to hunt on. The only thing I see happening around my area isthat I spend more time in the woods listening to somewoman yelling at herkids in the yards around my hunting area and less time listening to what should be peace and quiet. You want a challenge...try truurban hunting like I do...and like alot of us are nowhaving to
Wyvern

RE: Elitist attitude
 

Yeah, I dont see saturation as a problem either. I don't see that lumping all bows in the same season is a big issue. You certainly don't see people that hunt with firearms arguing for a special season for circa-1580 matchlock muskets because they are afraid to compete with people using centerline muzzle loaders.