Then I got you Chad

What "makes" a weapon archery is how your state defines it. Compounds are "archery" right ? Yet at one time, they were not because the rules didn't say they were. Crossbows are legal archery in my state of Arkansas - the rules say they are.

I know what you were saying, that the states don't allow them, but where they ARE allowed, they ARE archery, and IF they become legal in MS they will be archery there too.

And here is where I tie all that in - they ARE considered legal in MS, aren't they ? Handicap people can use them, they ARE considered legal in general archery season for some people.

What makes it LEGAL to use during archery season depends on the state's definition--that doesn't make it a different weapon.

For instance, in MS it's legal to use several different centerfire rifle cartridges during primitive weapons/muzzleloader season. Is a centerfire rifle primitive? Is it a muzzleloader because it's legal in that season?

Regardless though, most states do not recognize a crossbow as standard archery equipment. As I keep saying--if it were, then no special permit would be required.

Tell me what I'm talking about here. A weapon with a stock and trigger that fires a projectile using energy stored by the person cocking the weapon............................................ ................................
.................................................. .....................................
.................................................. ......................................
.................................................. .......................................
.................................................. .......................................
.................................................. .....................................
.................................................. .................................
.................................................. ...............................
Crossbow? Could be......could also be a pellet rifle. Rig a pellet rifle so it can fire a bolt--is it then transformed into a bow? A spear, javalin, atlatl dart, etc. all "arch" in flight--are those archery equipment?


For the most part the argument is obvious. "I like it, I want to use it during archery season, it has a string and limbs and fires a kind of arrow,so it's a bow.", or "I don't like them, a bow doesn't sit loaded, a bow doesn't have a stock and forearm, a bow has to be drawn in the presence of game--that's the primary challenge of bowhunting to begin with--so a crossbow is not a bow.".

My opinion is crossbows and their advocates had little to no role to play in getting archery seasons established, and they remove one of the main challenges of bowhunting (drawing and/or holdingin the presence of game).

I will add, the extra challenge, that in most circumstances, you have to stand up to shoot a bow.I say most. But I notice most do not with a crossbow. I know I have had deer come on me plenty of times, and that extra challenge of having to stand and draw, was too much to take the shot. A crossbow would have been fairly easy.

"I don't recall the folks that fought and lobbied for separate archery seasons to have included crossbows in that battle."

At the time, there were not very many. The vast majority of crossbow hunters USED to be vertical bowhunters and cannot anymore. The problem now is that the missinformation and the "its not a bow" comments are what is holding it back now that it is becoming more popular. In many instances these same people who fought hard for an archery season are now finding that not including crossbows was a mistake. If the ability to draw and hold a loaded bow is the definition of "archery" then I will gladly stand right next to anyone with a ultralight modern compound with 80% let off with my 9lb modern crossbow and see who wavers off target and has to lower their weapon first. Hate to tell ya...my arms are gonna get pretty tired MUCH quicker than the compound guy and even after only a few minutes the compound will be MUCH more accurate than I will due to me being less steady holding up this extra weight. So THAT argument is lost.

"I will add, the extra challenge, that in most circumstances, you have to stand up to shoot a bow.I say most. But I notice most do not with a crossbow. I know I have had deer come on me plenty of times, and that extra challenge of having to stand and draw, was too much to take the shot. A crossbow would have been fairly easy. "

So what do you have to say about the button buck I took with my long bow this season from a folding chair that I popped behind some brush??? You want challenge??? Try moving a crossbow from your lap to your shoulder unnoticed....I see very few tree sitting archers get up before taking a shot. One of the reason short axle to axle compounds are so popular. again, a crossbow is not any easier.

Wyvern

Wyvern

"Regardless though, most states do not recognize a crossbow as standard archery equipment. As I keep saying--if it were, then no special permit would be required"

The ONLY reason a special permit is required is because some very vocal and ignorant special interest groups made up a bunch of lies about crossbows and their performance capabilities. "you can kill a deer at 100yrds", "They are unsafe", "they will decimate the deer herds", and my all time favorite "they are a poaching weapon". What poacher in their right mind wants to wait 20 minutes for the animal they just illegaly shot to die and then track it in the dark using flash lights???? Come on...

Till someone can come up with something other than "I dont want them in my season" or " They are not a bow because "I" dont think they are a bow" this conversation is going nowhere....

Wyvern

Wyvern, my point was just the fact that most states don't recognize them as standard archery equipment. I don't stand on that definition as the reason I don't consider them a bow--states can come up with some screwy rules--but the fact remains that in most states they are not considered legal for archery season under normal circumstances.

Sure, they weigh a lot--that's why stands have shooting rails.

Isn't that the same basic argument that is used for crossbows? "I like them, I want to use one in archery season, therefore I say it's a bow."

Why call it a bow? Here's my take on it. A bow doesn't have a stock, it doesn't have a forearm, it can't be propped up to steady the shot, it can't sit at ready for hours on end but rather must be drawn in the presence of game.....personally I'm not too fond of trigger releases and 80+% let-off, but that's a different discussion.

If a crossbow can be considered a bow, then why can't a slingshot that fires arrows be a bow? Or a converted rifle that fires bolts? I see it as a slippery slope, possibly leading to one season for all.

Chad

OK...now that I calmed down a tad, I want to apologize for that last rant. I respect everyones opinions, but coming from a traditional background and moving into the other forms of archery I have a hard time seeing where this concept of what a bow comes from. It tends to set me off because we are arguing about emotions and not facts. We draw facts into that argument, but it is still comes down to your opinion and perspective is contrary to mine. Everyone is entitled to their perspectives and my slamming on them is not called for. I would like to see if I can calm this thread down abit and again appologize for ranting rather than discussing...

Wyvern

Ok, I was willing to have an intelligent conversation with you until this statement. Anyone that has been in archery at any length, knows this is not the norm.

A rifle that shoots a arrow can not be conciderd a bow,now way no how.........aint going to happen read definition of BOW......A recurve crossbow does fall under the BOW clasification.......
Myself I chose compound when in a tree and recurve,longbow,compound when stalk/still hunting but when it comes to sitting in a groundblind I like to use one of my crossbows....Ive tried tree stand and stalking with crossbow and they get too heavy after a short amount of time ......

"Anyone that has been in archery at any length, knows this is not the norm."

OK, I willfurther define my statement as"open style"tree or ladder stands. Any with the bar across the front, you are correct...

Wyvern