You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
07-12-2004 | 10:22 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Fork Horn
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 382
Likes: 0
From: Vernon Hills IL USA
07-12-2004 | 10:49 PM
#2
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 382
Likes: 0
From: Washington State
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
Interesting 'test' and fun to read but not inspiring.
Since Jon Silks conducted (or at least oversaw) this test I am skeptical. He has written for Petersen's Bowhunting which we all know as a magazine that has never met a bow they didn't love.
At least Silks had a few politely negative comments about some of the bows in this blind test so maybe he hasn't prostituted himself to the major bow makers like some other well known archery writers.
Since Jon Silks conducted (or at least oversaw) this test I am skeptical. He has written for Petersen's Bowhunting which we all know as a magazine that has never met a bow they didn't love.
At least Silks had a few politely negative comments about some of the bows in this blind test so maybe he hasn't prostituted himself to the major bow makers like some other well known archery writers.
07-13-2004 | 05:46 AM
#3
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,413
Likes: 0
From:
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
Looks like a decent subjective test. A couple things I don't like about the scoring. The categories are all rated as equal in importance, which is never the case. and even if the number eight rated bow was very close to the number one bow in a category, the score would not reflect it, because number eight gets almost no score even though it may be only slightly worse. The overall ending score is very misleading. I really hate speed tests and this one was no better than any of the others I've seen. They're comparing bows with a 7" brace height against bows with an 8" brace and not taking into account the more forgiving brace height, but negatively marking the slower 8" brace height bow - duh!
Another thing, is there anyone here that couldn't identify at least a few of the popular bows by their grips? I would have liked a test where throughout the whole test, no evaluator ever saw a single bow and did not know what brands were even in the test. Whether this was the case here, wasn't made clear.
Entertaining reading, but not very relevant.
Another thing, is there anyone here that couldn't identify at least a few of the popular bows by their grips? I would have liked a test where throughout the whole test, no evaluator ever saw a single bow and did not know what brands were even in the test. Whether this was the case here, wasn't made clear.
Entertaining reading, but not very relevant.
07-13-2004 | 06:52 AM
#4
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
Likes: 0
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
Yeah, what about accuracy and 'forgiveness'? Two very important things I take into account when I'm choosing a bow, actually things I consider to be far more important than raw speed, but go unmentioned in their tests.
Of course, I reckon it'd be kinda hard to to an accuracy test while blindfolded. [8D]
Of course, I reckon it'd be kinda hard to to an accuracy test while blindfolded. [8D]
07-13-2004 | 06:41 PM
#6
Thread Starter
Fork Horn
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 382
Likes: 0
From: Vernon Hills IL USA
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
I think that they could have tested accuracy by having each tester shoot groups with each bow at say 30 yards and objectively measuring or scoring the groups.
07-14-2004 | 05:55 AM
#8
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,434
Likes: 0
From: SC USA
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
They didn't have to do all that extensive testing..............I knew my bow would win !!! [8D]
Just kiddin' !!
The Melrin Max Extreme was the biggest surprise to me.......wow.....I was kinda fired up to look at one of those !! Bet ole Pinwheel has some stuff to say about that test !! [
]
Just kiddin' !!
The Melrin Max Extreme was the biggest surprise to me.......wow.....I was kinda fired up to look at one of those !! Bet ole Pinwheel has some stuff to say about that test !! [
]
07-14-2004 | 07:52 AM
#9
Typical Buck
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 970
Likes: 0
From: .. NH USA
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
Believe what you will as it is a free country, but I strongly suggest to everyone to shoot all bows for yourself before you decide on which bow is best for you. You may be very surprised at YOUR results.
JMHO . Pinwheel 12
JMHO . Pinwheel 12
07-14-2004 | 08:36 AM
#10
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: NM USA
RE: You guys see this blind test @ Bowsite?
I'm going to have to call Sugarland Archery to see if they have a MaxExtreme and some of the other bows tested in stock for me to try out. This test does show us things to be aware of and what to look for on each bow model that was tested and I feel that it was done as best as they could do.
You can't be serious. Had this test come out with your Merlins on top we wound't hear the end of it for weeks. btw, I remember you saying that all these bow mags and repuatble techs were going to be publishing tests, what ever happened to them or was this one of them that backfired?
What all 17 US dealers, that's not much to compare to.
It seemed to me that they were comparing bows that were simliar and it would be next to impossible to have every bow set up with the exact same everything including brace heights. I woud think they should just compare speeds and such to what their advertised specs are versus what they are in real life.
How many strands does Merlin use? I"m pretty sure Matthews and Hoyt uses 18 and Bowtech uses 20 but I've never heard what the rest use.
You say the testing isn't truly comparitive because of silencing gear on some of the others but no other company uses the limb laminates either so how can they be directly compared even if it was done by a testing machine? Shound't the laminates have helped it in this test?
All in all it sounds to me like sour grapes.
ORIGINAL: Pinwheel 12
I feel they were definately trying to "railroad" a couple of the bows that are trying hard to gain market share.
I feel they were definately trying to "railroad" a couple of the bows that are trying hard to gain market share.
Even tho I work for the Merlin company, if the Merlin Max Xtreme were to obviously rate that much lower than some of the other bows in that test we would have already heard about it from dealers, techs, and customers and I would say so if it honestly did when compared fairly.
For instance the speed test--- Max X is slower when compared to most of the bows in the test as it sits, no arguement---- however as correctly and astutely stated above by others they are NOT comparing apples to apples with comparable brace heights (some over an inch different![:@]) so therefore in "real life" the bows are much much closer that the test suggests--- look at the numbers for instance and add 7-12 feet to make up for the brace differential of 1/2" to an inch--- closer you see, especially with hunting weight shafts.......
It seemed to me that they were comparing bows that were simliar and it would be next to impossible to have every bow set up with the exact same everything including brace heights. I woud think they should just compare speeds and such to what their advertised specs are versus what they are in real life.
Plus I'd like to see string strand count for each company, as I know certain companies use lesser strands to gain 5-10 fps....(5fps per strand) and they were not quite on the mark either when testing all of the bows for quiet and vibration when some are fully rigged up with leeches, dampeners, cable silencers, and other sims stuff sticking out from every orifice and then comparing them to others that were basically bare. To me this is not true comparative testing . "Real-world testing" is when you set two bows of equal configurations (ata, brace height, poundage) side-by side with the same amount of comparable vibration dampeners, string stand count, and whatnot, and start from there and use PROPER EQUIPMENT for testing, not "let's blindfold Bubba and then shoot bows behind him to see which one is louder."
You say the testing isn't truly comparitive because of silencing gear on some of the others but no other company uses the limb laminates either so how can they be directly compared even if it was done by a testing machine? Shound't the laminates have helped it in this test?
Sheesh....
One cannot compare all of the bows in that test fairly simply because of these reasons alone, nevermind anything else even more technical that I'm not even going to bother to get into here.
Seeing as Jon, his testers, Keystone Country Store, and the Bowsite are either heavily sponsored by, or have other definitive motive for promotion of certain products, I personally feel an independent test by those who have no friendships , sponsorships, or affiliations with any manufacturer, website, or retail outlet would've been done WAY more fairly. Having shot all of these bows myself this year, while certainly all capable hunting performers the two winners claimed here are IMHO NOT heads and shoulders above the rest of the crowd tested, no matter what this group of testers (or anyone else for that matter) wants one to believe-- they much closer. Savvy archers and true techs who take true technical comparative testing seriously all know that all of these bows are much closer when fairly compared than that test would ever suggest.
Believe what you will as it is a free country, but I strongly suggest to everyone to shoot all bows for yourself before you decide on which bow is best for you. You may be very surprised at YOUR results.
JMHO . Pinwheel 12
One cannot compare all of the bows in that test fairly simply because of these reasons alone, nevermind anything else even more technical that I'm not even going to bother to get into here.Seeing as Jon, his testers, Keystone Country Store, and the Bowsite are either heavily sponsored by, or have other definitive motive for promotion of certain products, I personally feel an independent test by those who have no friendships , sponsorships, or affiliations with any manufacturer, website, or retail outlet would've been done WAY more fairly. Having shot all of these bows myself this year, while certainly all capable hunting performers the two winners claimed here are IMHO NOT heads and shoulders above the rest of the crowd tested, no matter what this group of testers (or anyone else for that matter) wants one to believe-- they much closer. Savvy archers and true techs who take true technical comparative testing seriously all know that all of these bows are much closer when fairly compared than that test would ever suggest.
Believe what you will as it is a free country, but I strongly suggest to everyone to shoot all bows for yourself before you decide on which bow is best for you. You may be very surprised at YOUR results.
JMHO . Pinwheel 12
All in all it sounds to me like sour grapes.