A/C or All Carbon?
 

I wanted to know what, in your opinion, is better and why. Alum./Carbon or Full carbon..


Mat

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

AC is better imo because you can get a more consistant spine.They will also hold that spine longer and most have a better nock system.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I agree with TFOX. Before anyone chimes in about durability, I've been shooting and hunting with A/C Superslims for two years now and I must say they are the toughest arrow I've ever shot.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I was thining of getting the axis full metal jacket what do you think of those?

Mat

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

They are great arrows as well.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

My only issue with them is the nock system isn't as good as some of the other ac arrows(no bushings).

But other than that,great arrows.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Will i have to change my rest if i use lightspeeds for target and axis full metal jacket for hunting?


Mat

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Anyone?


Mat

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Probably the setting of it but the arrows are close to the same diameter.Only about .05 difference.

If you use a prong rest,it may need to be readjusted.If you use a trophy taker style fallaway,then all that will be needed then is to retune ,that would probally require a little adjustment to the rest.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Well I'll tell ya. I shot ACC's for 2 years, and they are incredible. You won't ever hear me say a negative word about them. Yes, the nock system is really good, spine/weight consistency and tolerances are beautiful.

Having said that, I changed to Carbon Express Maxima Hunters, and noticed an immediate improvement. These things shoot like nothing I've ever seen before. I've literally watched people at the shop change absolutely nothing w/ the bow, change to these arrows, and watch their groups shrink. I can't explain why exactly, I just know they are awesome. I've robinhooded more than I care to mention.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

SPINE,is why that happens,the spine more closely matches their bow setup OR the difference in diameter was a positive one for the tune they had.

ACC's do have a tighter spine range and all carbon shafts have a wider spine range.Meaning,the ACC's won't handle the variation in poundage/draw lengththat an all carbon shaft will.


That is if you are comparing to ACC's.other arrows may have many other factors involved.

AND,10 years from now,those ACC's will still be shooting the same,that doesn't USUALLY happen with all carbon shafts.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

They are consistant. Bought a six pack and all but one flew true. I just don't like the rough finish of them. Trophyridge is shipping out some new carbons .0008 Like to see them.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Which ones are consistant?


I have checked my Acc's after a few years and most don't even move
a .0001 indicator needle.The few that do are probably the ones that have gone through deer and/or stuck in logs.[8D]

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

It's true that an all carbon arrow will most likely get the spine shot out of it eventually. BUT, I don't normally have arrows that long anyway. For a variety of reasons, so I'm not necessarily interested in an arrow that will retain it's spine for years. You're certainly right though, the spine on an ACC will be there for an awful long time.

I guess another part of it is the built in FOC of the Maxima. Like I said, you'll never hear a cross word from me about ACC's....Both the ACC and Maxima measure straightness over the entire length of the arrow, not the standard 8" of most other shafts. That makes them inherantly straighter than every shaft out there. I'm not sure yet as to how Trophy Ridge measure the straightness of theirs, be it the length of the shaft or 8".

I guess the only downside I can think of w/ the ACC is that aluminum bends, dinks, dents......yes, carbon does break, the spine gets shot out of them...and smacking them together CAN hurt them. But it's not as likely as w/ an aluminum arrow.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I've only had them for a few months. Bought some of the black 340's and they were good. I like them except the finish. Kept a few and sent some to my brother. Before the season I bought the hunters in 340 thinking the finish would be better; not much.

Just saying that shooting them to see how they flew 5 of them went to the same hole, one never would. Spining the nock just changed the impact spot around the others. Refletching did nothing. Bad shaft. The Maxima's flew well, but I did loose one and my brother 2; busted on game. Not a big fan, they just flew true and it was noticable like mobow said.

I don't often keep arrows more than a season,

I like the acc, just not the price. If they would've had them in the six pack I'd of tried them. I know the finish is better.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I'm kinda on the other side of this one. I tried a dozen ST Axis this spring and liked them so well I got three dozen more. Planning to shoot this arrow for many years to come. Still have some CE Terminators, A/C Super Slims, ST Excels, and Blackhawk Vapors - but they are going to stay parked in the arrow locker until these Axis are all gone.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I used Full Metal Jackets on my recent trip to NE. They are a super arrow. I built these arrows with 20% FOC. The ACC's I have are great arrows also but I take pains to get my FOC where I want it. The CX Maxima Hunters are about the only all carbon shaft I will shoot. I think the built in FOC is a big boost for a lot of archers that are trying to shoot too little FOC unknowingly. Iwould saythe average Bowhunter has no idea what the FOC on his arrows even are. Also the new weight forward Kevlar shaft by CX to be released very soonought to be awesome;)

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I've never used the a/c/c's but can vouch for the Maxima Hunter's. Been using them for two years now and no complaints whatsoever. Six deer with the same six arrows. Finally broke two this year. One went through a deer I had been tracking for my brother, stuck about 10 inches in the ground after passing through the deer and, as the deer jumped up and ran, the arrow broke.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Like to try them sometime. Their weight kind of bothers me. I've also seen them forsale and a slow mover over at AT.Says tome othersdon't care much for them for some reason.Been holding offto hear why. Maybe this summer I'll find some to try at agood price.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Does this mean that the spine of an arrow measured the full length is actually stiffer than one that only measures 8"?

Reason for asking is the weight of each. Might be able to shoot a lighter arrow if the spin is truer.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I've never thought of it that way, but yeah, I guess that could be the case. I don't know though.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Spine is measured over a 28" span.That is a standard that all shafts are supposed to adhere to.

Mobowas speaking of straightness and I am not sure what the standard for measuing straightness is.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Exactly!!:D

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I think that nodog was asking if there was an interaction between spine characteristics and straightness.

I.e., the dynamic spine of a less straight arrow might be less than that of a perfectly straight arrow.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I view it this way. If an arrow is "loose" on straightness tolerance, how "loose" are they on the rest of the specs?? Probably just as....Which is I why I always say get the best arrows you can afford.

I know it's difficult dropping cash on arrows, but it really, truely, is well worth it.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Cheaper is cheaper for a reason!;)

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

The aluminum guys would beg to differ.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I honestly don't know how they do any of it. You'd think they use the same standard and one machine. Hard to believe they check everyone. Really don't think they do. It's not like they're returnable. I some what tried with a maxima. Contacted them and told them I had a bad arrow that wouldn't group with the others, it was a flyer. They return my response with. I don't understand what you mean. Please call meat ...:D Too funny. An arrow company not knowing what that means. Never did. Not worth the time. They were nice about it.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Ok put it like this, cheaper Aluminum arrows are cheaper for a reason, and Cheaper carbon arrows are cheaper for a reason.

Wasn't trying to compare apples and oranges;)

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Fair enough. Some of us have been talking about going back to them because of the price these days. They're not in therange, yet. When carbons started out they were cheaper than aluminums. For some reason other than the cost of making them apparently, they have sky rocketed.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

No complaints here. The weight is one of the main selling points with me though, I like heavy arrows. I've been shooting them for 2 years and have no complaints with them. No plans to change any time soon.

They are as durable as anything I have shot, easy to remove from targets, heavy:D, and accurate. I don't think you would be disappointed with them.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Good to know!

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

nodog, with the FMJ's I built weight was not going to be an issue as I was looking for a little heavier arrow than I normally shoot. I knew this was a short range setup and wanted and got 20%+ FOC. All that said they grouped excellent out to 45+ yards (that's as far as I shot them) I also killed my Nebraska Mulie with them at 36 yards.If I am looking for light weight arrows I use the ACC's or CX Maxima's
The Full Metal Jackets will be a part of my arsenal for a few years to come at least;)

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Thanks. I'm wondering about the drop of the arrow. I'm not all that good at judging distance. What kind of pin setup are you using with the FMJ? I was hopping to use the 400's, the bow's around 70 pounds with a 29.25" arrow. What do you think?

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I really think the 400's might be a little soft at 70# and 29 1/4" Some of the guys that run the programs will tell you I'm sure:DI'm shooting 400's at 27.5" with a broadhead and insert that weighs 225 grains out of a 60# Guardian. I am using the HHA Optimizer-Lite Ultra sight.I also always use a rangefinder. Like I said I knew this setup would be ashort range setup but I would still not be afraid to shoot itat 45+ yards. My Mulie Buck was at 36 yards;)

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I'm shooting a 340, 70#'s and 28 inch shaft. I think the 400's would be soft as well.

I don't get much drop. Bought a new sight this year and went form .019 to .029 pins. With the bigger pins they were close to touching when I got it sighted in. Ialso shoot 125gr heads.

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I figured the 340 but with the composite construction I thought it might go for the 400. You guys really like the weight. Since I shoot a 100grn. head the 400 still might cut it?

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

a 400 spine is a 400 spine regardless of what materials the arrows is made of. I shot a 400 spinedarrow out of my 70# Allegiance with a 100 grain head and was able to tune it and attain good groups. it was pretty borderline, also they were only 27.25" long and 2" makes quite a difference in overall spine requirements of an arrow;)

Dan

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

Someof the arrows I've shot didn't seem to be the same but were labeled the same. GT's always seemed week, Beman's on the stiff side, CX right in the middle. These sound as if they would be on the stiff side. How do they hit compared with the Maxima's, left of, right of, or the same place?

RE: A/C or All Carbon?
 

I think you will find Eastons are very consistent in spine, won't argue about other brands but if they are spined and manufactured correctly a .400 spine should deflect.400:D My FMJ's just hit lower than my CX Maximas, neither left nor right. I have shot 5 arrows of varying brands out of my Guardian and shot pretty decent groups. I was actually surprised, although it was at only 20 yards.;)

Dan