RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

Hmmm...The only reason I tinkered w/ my BKII is because I wanted to, not because I had to.

The issues that were in vogue to gripe about so much in the past 6-8 years are no more an issue today than they are with the designs that were supposed to eliminate the "problem".... fact is the problem was not the cam system, but the string and cabling.

That being said, I think the rise of the onecam was a good thing, as the trend brought us back from the sub 6" 35" bows that were coming out...comfort aspects became more important (lack of recoil, shock, noise, etc) than they had been in a few years.

Now it's time to stir things up again in the industry. Get off the "I can do that too", and get on the " Look how mine is better!" train.

JeffB <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>





Edited by - JeffB on 10/23/2002 13:47:46

Edited by - JeffB on 10/23/2002 13:50:05

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

&quot;fact is the problem was not the cam system, but the string and cabling.&quot;

That is a good point, maybe some discussion regarding the type of cam timing issues a fella would deal with in the case of a DC Patriot, would be helpful. Because with a one cam you shoot it in and for the most part you twist the cable and rotate the cam to proper position and you're good to go for a good bit. And so with the types of string and cable systems today how much more is it to set a dual cam and keep it good for a good bit? Doesn't seem like it would be such a big deal anymore. So you look at the DC Patriot performance #s and you think why not a two cam again? And then this little thought creeps in of wonder what the nock travel would look like....

Anyways you boys that know better maybe could chime in here with some comments, educate me a bit. Thanks.

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
&quot;fact is the problem was not the cam system, but the string and cabling.&quot;

That is a good point, maybe some discussion regarding the type of cam timing issues a fella would deal with in the case of a DC Patriot, would be helpful. Because with a one cam you shoot it in and for the most part you twist the cable and rotate the cam to proper position and you're good to go for a good bit. And so with the types of string and cable systems today how much more is it to set a dual cam and keep it good for a good bit? Doesn't seem like it would be such a big deal anymore. So you look at the DC Patriot performance #s and you think why not a two cam again? And then this little thought creeps in of wonder what the nock travel would look like....

Anyways you boys that know better maybe could chime in here with some comments, educate me a bit. Thanks.

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

I'm not real certain exactly what you're asking but I'll try.

What I think JeffB was saying is with a lot of todays string and cable materials and methods used to build a good system won't effect the tuning of a Dual much or any more than a single cam bow.

The 2003 Duallys are also going to have cable tuners on them that will make timing and fine tuning them much easier.

What do you mean about the nock travel though? You lost me there...
Auise-guy did ask about cable slide travel if that's what you're reffering to.

I hope that was understandable....

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

Fevr,

I can say this: With the Strings and cables that Bowtech uses cam synch is pretty much a non-issue. I know that I put several hundred arrows through my BKII without touching a thing...NOTHING.

With the onecam bows I have owned from Bowtech that use the same string and cabling, the most I perosnally have EVER had to do was put ONE twist in my first Mighty Mite.

Being that the string and cable on the dual cam models will be shorter or the same size as the onecam models, I don't see how anyone would ever need to do more than that.

With a good dual cam design having a cable one twist &quot;out&quot; usually does not make enough difference to effect point of impact more than slightly at normal ranges as long as one pulls solidly into the wall. In fact if the &quot;correct&quot; cable creeps that One twist, it could actually be beneficial (it will lift the arrow slightly off the rest). If it's the &quot;wrong&quot; cable, then you likely will not see much difference if your bow-tune was good to begin with and you pull into the wall..in addition utilizing a drop away rest would likely make it inconsequential.

I think that the strings and cables have finally caught up, and we will begin to see much of the market drift away from the &quot;mainstream&quot; one-cam design..either back to duals, or to hybrids such as Darton and Hoyt use.

JeffB <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>






Edited by - jeffb on 10/23/2002 16:08:16

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

&quot;I think that the strings and cables have finally caught up, and we will begin to see much of the market drift away from the &quot;mainstream&quot; one-cam design..either back to duals, or to hybrids such as Darton and Hoyt use.&quot;

I think you're right about that and coupled with the performance of a DC Patriot and the Long BH BKII, there's going to be interest. How quiet are these bows compared to a one cam?

I'll tell you, I do wonder if Mathews is feeling the pressure to step up in terms of performance here. It will be interesting to see how they position their product offerings going forward.

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

Buckfevr,
I can tell you that my DC Pro38 (which is essentially the 2002 BKII) was very quiet......almost astonishingly quiet for the speeds it produces.
My local dealer one night indoors couldn't beleive how quiet it was......epecially when I lit his chronograph up at 336fps for him! :)
I can tell you that it was just slightly louder than a Patriot set-up the same, and made my dual cam Hoyt Ultratec seem LOUD. It makes the Darton Rampage my best friend has sound like a rifle. Its on par noise wise with my Hoyt Defiant Redline which is a very quiet bow.
Its really amazing and that's no smoke.
I would think that the extra sweep of the VFT limbs on the Patriot would even lessen an already low noise level.

And as far as timing?.......same as Jeff, I didn't have to touch a thing since January. Nothing.
People need not fear the dual cam anymore.......the average person doesn't want to be tinkering with a twist here and twist there......here a twist there a twist everywhere a twist twist. <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> And rightfully so because the average person doesn't own a press, they don't want to be heading to the dealer every week etc etc to have them get things in synch.
Well the new string materials and manufacturing have now made the dual cam just as user friendly as the single cam, if not more so because if you want to you can REALLy tweak a dual cam.
A person with a BowTech dual cam can sleep well at night knowing their bow hasn't done anything goofy on them from day to day.
That's more than I can say for the stock strings and cables on the Mathews, Hoyt, and PSE bows I've owned in the last few years......even the 2002's. I've watched my peep go round and round like a Merry-Go-Round on a few of them and every single one has needed much more attention that my dual cam BowTech with the Winner's Choice stuff.
I am 100% just as secure with the duallys as the singles with the string and cable advances.

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

Remind me not to post any more 1 or 2 line comments anymore. They get more attention than when I type a 3000 word review.....

<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

All of you folks need to stop using those nasty &quot;M-words&quot;. I have a young son now and he is very impressionable. I can't imagine him hanging out with those crowds....<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

<img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

Remind me not to post any more 1 or 2 line comments anymore. They get more attention than when I type a 3000 word review.....

<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

All of you folks need to stop using those nasty &quot;M-words&quot;. I have a young son now and he is very impressionable. I can't imagine him hanging out with those crowds....<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>




Frank, We all know there's more than one &quot;M-word&quot; but only one &quot;Nasty&quot; M-word...LOL... I just had to do it...<img src=icon_smile_evil.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>


















Edited by - BowTech_Shooter on 10/23/2002 18:21:27

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

BowTech Shooter....I just can't pass this by! I just have to say it....ok I can't hold back anymore! Frank you know the words about to come from my typing fingers......here it goes.....

<font size=6>Mathews</font id=size6>

<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

I just had to do it! sorry <img src=icon_smile_evil.gif border=0 align=middle> A few of us out here still like those M words!

Can't wait to see the new Bowtechs....I am sure they will be very cool....maybe not as cool as the new ....... ok I won't say it again!

RE: Well, here's what's new from BowTech for 2003...
 

Moonage, Sorry but how am I supposed to pass that over. Christ it about knocked my eyes out...LOL...

You know what I think is one of the funniest things about (some) Mathews shooters is the fact that they spell it wrong. Heck if ya don't know how go look at your bow (not you Moonage)
...LOL...Matthews...