HuntingNet.com Forums - Regret the Whisker Bisquit

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ORIGINAL: doughboysigep

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ORIGINAL: zrexpilot

It causes fletching damage, it freezes, and you have aloss of 5 to 17 fps, it wears out very quickly, but at 11 bucks you can have new fibers.
they did say it was accurate, but this was with a pro and I'm sure perfectly tuned. they also say it's a quiet rest, but fail to say how noisy it iswhen being shot, or what kind of vibration it creates.
no way would I rate it 4.5 stars.

just checking - zrex, you have used the WB extensively and know that all these things happen??? Curious, because i've never had these problems????

PS - this horse is still dead!!!!! ;)

did you read the test I copied and pasted ? thats what their results were, not mine.
let me paste it again.

Whisker Biscuit: Truth in Advertising!
By Staff Writer
Bob Peck

Archers are a fiercely loyal and independent bunch. One quick look at any given subject in our ArcheryWorld.com forums shows that lots of debates and heated discussions are digitally waged on a daily basis. We accept this. The controversy comes with the product test turf. None of us on the ArcheryWorld.com test team wear white lab coats and carry physics degrees. The white lab coats stick out sitting in the tree stand and the physics degree isn't as valuable to us as our doctorates in the school of hard knocks! No pain, no gain right?
To prove or disprove manufacturer claims we utilize quasi-scientific testing methods that attempt to simulate real world conditions and experiences. We always use chronographs and other instrumentation when it's appropriate. We try hard to get it right the first time around. Often though, we are left to a subjective collection of staff shooter opinions. We're not trying to dictate anything to anybody and we certainly aren't the last word on any given topic, or product! Our opinions on how well or poorly equipment performs are just that, opinions. Some products like bows are easier to evaluate and compare than other more subjective products like scents or boots. In the end analysis, we do what we do because a huge majority of our site visitors demanded we provide our input and cut through the hype. Still, no matter what we do or say there are those skeptics that read our reviews and scoff. These same people claim we are paid off to say what we say (we are not) and scream we are biased. Please. We are human. Humans are imperfect and make mistakes. We're no different but one thing is a given, here at ArcheryWorld.com, we take extra care to assemble the opinions and provide a balanced view of the products we test. Still, the arguments and flames continue. It' s part of the job and we gladly accept it because we all learn from the experience. Besides, we find that for every whiner there are three archers who thank us for our efforts.

This review of the Whisker Biscuit could easily be a short one. All you need to do is read the materials made available by the manufacturer, Carolina Archery Products, either on their website or their packaging material. There isn't a single word in their literature that we consider to be hype, misleading in any way, or marketing hooey. Without a single doubt in our minds, Carolina Archery Products is fully committed to "Truth in Advertising!" Not only are the pros and cons of their product presented, but the criticisms are headed off at the pass. Misinformation about the Whisker Biscuit is trounced with facts and perhaps most important, the message is clear; the product is not all things to all archers and doesn't pretend to be. Co-founder Ike Branthwaite is as straightforward as the available Whisker Biscuit printed material. Ike actually sought us out and within days of speaking to him, a box of six (6) Whisker Biscuits arrived just as he promised. Two (2) of each model, The Original ($34.99), The Drop Tine ($44.99) and The Deluxe ($62.95) arrived as did a can of "No Snow" ($8.99) which is used to prevent the Whiskers from freezing. More on No Snow later.
Before we get too far into this product review let's get something straight from the beginning. The Whisker Biscuit is a hunting arrow rest. Can it be used for 3D or competitive shooting? Sure. No problem but realize the design is meant to go into the woods. Ethical bow hunters shake down their equipment months before the season starts and make certain their equipment is dialed in BEFORE the season starts. There are many archers though who pick up their bow few weeks before the season shoot a few hundred shots and are good to go. It' s not so much that this particular group is unethical as their idea of preparation is, how shall we say, streamlined? How you prepare for your archery season is your business and not something we need to debate. To each his or her own! One thing that is hard to debate is this philosophy; anytime you can incorporate equipment into your line up that removes variables is a good thing. Gore Tex, for example, removes the variable of wondering if you'll get wet. You won't. The Whisker Biscuit removes the variable of your arrow clinking off your arrow rest and spooking game. For some, including this author, it's a welcome variable gone for good! The Whisker Biscuit isn't the only rest on the market that successfully removes this variable. Golden Key and BoDoodle to name a few have their own designs. In short, there is simply no way your arrow is going to fall off when it's encircled 360 degrees with black fibers. The fibers are not nylon. The exact material is proprietary. We're told it is an advanced polymer selected for abrasion resistance, strength, and flexibility. Since this proprietary material doesn't have some catchy name and that was a mouthful, let's just say the fibers in the Whisker Biscuit are synthetic fibers.
Imagine if you will that a small 2" inch circle of black synthetic fibers pointing inward with a hole in the middle for your arrow shaft. This circle of synthetic fibers is held together around it's perimeter with a metal hoop that securely crimps down on the outside edges of the fibers. The arrow enters the center of this hoop from behind and rests lightly on the bottom half of the hole in the center of the fiber halo. There are 3 different Whisker Biscuit inserts to accommodate a variety of shafts, aluminum, insert carbon, and outsert carbon. The outsert carbon can be used for small diameter children's arrows or the smaller ACC arrows. There is also a fishing biscuit with a different type of stiffer fibers, only used with heavy, unfletched, bowfishing arrows.
The only difference that we could see is the diameter of the arrow hole in the center of the insert. The thickness and the density of synthetic fibers that make up the "Biscuit" appear to be identical. The really cool thing for those of you who shoot different types of arrows is interchanging the biscuits with zero rest adjustments! The biscuit and its bracket have a 2" diameter milled slot that automatically centers the biscuit and allows you to replace the biscuit without having to re-tune. Remove one biscuit, replace it with another and poof! It just works! A beautiful thing!
The Biscuit locks into a receiver block which is identical for the "Original" and the "Drop Tine" model Whisker Biscuit. The difference between these two models is the extension arm that attaches to bow riser-mounting bracket. The Original is round extension arm and the Drop Tine is square. The Original is O.K but for the few extra bucks you'll appreciate the peace of mind of the square extension arm. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that square will not twist, round can twist off position. The "Deluxe" has a different and better-oriented biscuit receiver and has very convenient laser etched micro adjustment markings to help fine-tune the vertical gang adjustment. The chamfered square extension arm of the Deluxe nests securely into the riser mounting bracket which also uses laser etched micro markings to get your lateral adjustment just right. All models utilize the same small set screws to securely lock down the Biscuit. The real difference between the three Whisker Biscuit models is in how the Biscuit receiver places the Biscuit in the sighting window, how the extension arm (square or round) prevents twisting and how the extension arm attaches to your riser. In our minds how these three variables are integrated into each model is distinct in design and function.
The "Original" model is exactly that. The price point $34.99 allows you to have the fundamental of the Whisker Biscuit arrow holding design without the price tag of the other two models or the adjustability. We think that that it's worth the extra money to either go with the Drop Tine or Deluxe model. Clearly, at least from consumers prospective, this is the typical base price/feature trade off. However, if you own an older bow with shallow riser cutouts and need more centershot adjustment, the Original is a good choice when your choices for updating your equipment are limited. The round extension arm and very basic (aka not precise) adjustments makes the "Original" a reasonable product for most bows. We found that extension arm just kind of hangs out there in space and does not provide that "lock down, no can move" confidence most of us want when it comes to our arrow rests. The other major difference in the "Original" is the way in which the horizontal left/right rest adjustment works. It is basically a round shaped rod that clamps down with set screws. You'll need to keep an eye on this. After about 100 shots we found the force of the arrows and fletching passing through the "Biscuit" tended to slightly push the whole assembly forward in the direction of arrow travel, which, of course, changed the arrow level adjustment and subsequent shots. When we removed the Biscuit receiver block from the round extension shaft, twist marks were clearly visible on the extension shaft. Brass washers have since been added to the pinch bolts on all models to increase the holding force. The "Original" is only available in anodized black. We found the fit and finish of this model to be exemplary and without flaws.
The "Drop Tine" sits in the middle of the product line and as you would expect is priced in between the "Original" and the "Deluxe" at $44.99. There is no fancy name brand camo available, which only adds cost, but we found the pattern used to be more than acceptable. There is precious little surface area exposed to the wary eyes of the white tail in this relatively compact rest design anyway. The horizontal receiver arm is a square shaft that eliminates the possibility of the forward twisting we found in the "Original". Four hundred shots and a micrometer showed the rest didn't move a micron! We all felt the Drop Tine was easier to deal with and instilled more confidence than the straight-arm design of the Original. Call it a psychological thing, but dropping the mounting arm down and towards the archer's eye seemed a more ergonomic design as it tucked the whole rest into a more comfortable position. If you must have camo you must buy the "Drop Tine". For some weird and unexplained reason the "Drop Tine" is the only Whisker Biscuit available in camo. The "Original" and the "Deluxe" only come in anodized black.
The "Deluxe" is the way to go! Employing the same basic design as the "Drop Tine" this version of the Whisker Biscuit adds independent elevation adjustment, laser etched match marks, a two point anchoring system and cleaner lines. A while back in this review we said contemplating which model to go with is the classic "base price versus feature" trade off. Your wallet may need to be the determining factor but if it isn't, go past the "Original" and the "Drop Tine" and go straight for the "Deluxe". Is it worth the extra bucks? In our opinion the answer is an unequivocal yes! There is more fletching clearance with the "Deluxe" and it incorporates a unique mounting system that appears to be designed to fit most bows. The Biscuit receiver block is a sleeker design and the square chamfered extension shaft serves to adequately prevent twisting. Again, the "Deluxe" is only available in anodized black and no camo patterns are available.
For our test we used a Parker Ultra-Lite 31, a PSE Nova, and a Buckmasters G-2 XL. All three bows were set and tuned to AMO standards. Because Ike and his crew at Carolina Archery Products sent us two of each Whisker Biscuit model and included the carbon insert "Biscuit", we were able to interchange parts and rests on all our test bows quite easily. Each bow had a minimum of 300 arrows shot through them and in some instances 500 arrows. Each rest found a home on each of our three test bows. We used a professionally calibrated "Speed Tach" chronograph to measure arrow speed differentials and a Hooter Shooter to eliminate the human variable. We used Easton ACC's, Easton XX75 2513 tree trunks and Carbon Xpress carbons. Fletching ranged from feathers to Duravanes to stock Easton urethane vanes. Finally, all three (3) rests made it out into the field for several whitetail hunts in conditions that ranged from driving rain to snow to 40 degree autumn days.
Fletching Damage
Are you going to experience fletching damage after you've launched 300+ arrows through a Whisker Biscuit? Yes! But that will entirely depend on what kind of vanes you prefer. Vanes with rubber in them are easy to fletch since they accept the cyanoacrylic "crazy glues". They will snap back up when bent over but they will become wavy and eventually tear because they can stretch beyond the elastic range. You can tear them in half with your hands. The most wear resistant vanes recommended by Carolina Archery Products are Bohning and Flex-Fletch brands. These are urethane and they do not stretch or wrinkle. They last a real long time and you can't tear them apart. If you roll one over on a fletched arrow, they slowly bend back straight. They require more arrow and vane prep to get proper adhesion.
Here's where truth in advertising comes in handy. In the Whisker Biscuit Technical Product Guide, Carolina Archery Products says:
"Vanes will show wear after substantial use. Some brands more than others. Urethane vanes seem to be the most durable. After 30-50 shots a scalloped wear pattern will appear on the outer 1/8 inch of the die cut edge of feather fletching. This does not affect arrow flight. Nor does it progress beyond the initial wear in period."
Our exact findings! However, some notable exceptions should be mentioned. Prefabricated Easton arrows and vanes did get progressively worse as we approached the 300 shot mark. The scalloped edges got pretty wavy by the end of the test period. Some will argue the appearance of the fletching affects arrow flight. We concede there are probably subtle aerodynamic effects introduced when fletching is wavy versus perfectly straight, but, honestly, our findings suggest, out to 40 yards that this is not so.
Here's an important point: We ruined more fletching from arrows colliding with each other and tearing the fletching than we did using the Whisker Biscuit. The fletching damage is way overblown by competitors. Are vanes affected by the product? Sure. How could they not be? You are launching arrows through a device just big enough for the shaft. The synthetic fibers bristles are just flexible enough to let the vanes pass through but stiff enough to support the weight of the arrow and broadhead.
We found the break-in period of the Biscuit to be important to a more consistent shot. The synthetic fibers bristles of the biscuit seem to have a memory in the beginning of the break-in period. They bounce back into their original position more quickly when the product is brand new out of the box. After the 100 shot mark the bristles began to take on a visible set or a loss of memory. Think about the fibers in the bristle broom you use to sweep the floor. After a while the bristles are curved. Same thing happens with the Whisker Biscuit. Not to sound like a broken record but CAP (Carolina Archery Products) understands this and points this out in their literature. What's the worst-case scenario? The bristle wear bothers you and for $10.99 you buy another "Biscuit" insert. Whoop dee do! Once again, we found very little difference in arrow flight or accuracy out to 40 yards as this bristle wear set in. The key with the biscuit is making sure there is sufficient shaft to biscuit clearance. You want it more loose than tight. When we shot the 2315 tree trunks, shaft clearance became a problem. CAP anticipates the problem and has rest tuning instructions we followed. Problem solved. There is a misconception that the hole through the Whisker Biscuit touches the entire surface of the arrow shaft all the way around. Not true. At best, a properly tuned Whisker Biscuit actually only touches the bottom half of the arrow. You can and should see some daylight through the Biscuit opening on the top half of the arrow. The reason this is important to mention relates directly to that weird angle tree stand shot where your bow is twisting at an odd angle. Proper form goes out the window in order to get the shot off. The arrow shaft actually, ever so gently, rolls against the inside of the Biscuit hole and generally orients the arrow into the same relative pre-shot position. With a standard prong style rest you either don't take the shot or you use your index finger to stabilize the arrow.
Again, consider the fact this is a hunting rest. Consider how much preparation you do to prepare for your season and put things in perspective. The average archer will most likely never experience any of the observations we discovered unless you are specifically looking for them. The aggressive archer who spends months preparing and shoots hundreds of arrows has solutions available before he even gets started.
Noise
If there is sufficient shaft clearance, meaning you can see daylight at the top of the Biscuit hole, there is no noise. We really mean no noise! The only caveat that is true with all rests and all arrow shafts is that noise characteristics vary widely from shaft to shaft depending on coloration and composition. Large diameter aluminum camo shafts are the worst because the surface is very sensitive to dust and abrasion. Pull any shaft out of a target a few times and the problem gets better as the shaft surface abrades and gets worn smoother. Carbon shafts with a smooth semi-gloss finish are the quietest, but we all know even carbon shafts can be noisy depending on the carbon porosity. Adjusting the Biscuit to various shaft diameters is a 30 second adjustment. The Biscuit ring has a break designed into it. Remove the Biscuit from the receiver bracket, gently pull the Biscuit apart at this separation in the ring and you're in business. Once again, the competition wants you to believe the Whisker Biscuit is a noisy rest. Sorry, not so!
Freezing Biscuits
And no we don't mean the part of your body sitting on the tree stand seat!
We submerged the Biscuits in water, shook off the excess water and stuck them in a freezer for about 3 hours and then pulled them out. Not exactly scientific but certainly representative of the worst nature might throw at you. The Biscuit was frozen nearly solid. It's important to remember that since the bristles in the Biscuit are synthetic fibers they don't absorb water like nylon can. All we did to break the ice-free was gently push on the whiskers and out came all the ice. Let's face it; common sense plays a large part in the hunting experience. If you experienced an ice storm or freezing rain would you pay attention to the arrow shaft being coated in ice? If you didn't check your peep before a shot or worse your arrow shafts were coated with ice, you'd be in just as much in trouble as making sure your rest (whatever you use) was also unobstructed.
If you are worried about the Biscuit's performance in such late season conditions buy a can of "No Snow". According to the Material Safety Data Sheet provided by CAP, "No Snow" is an aerosol concoction of Heptane, Isobutane, Propane, Isopropanol (rubbing alcohol) and mineral spirits. Does it work? Hell yeah!
We repeated the same "soak the Biscuit in water" experiment. This time we liberally doused the Biscuit with "No Snow" prior to the deep freeze. After three hours there was surface frost on the eternal edges of the biscuit fibers but no ice. We pressed the biscuit fibers and a dusting of frost came out. "No Snow", by the way, is a great product for those of you who shoot feathers. Whatever you do don't soak the feathers in this spray but rather just lightly coat them. You'll find that in severe conditions of soaking rain and snow your feathers will tolerate the weather better.
Speed
Unless you're utilizing a drop away rest, whether you realize it or not, you're losing speed at the arrow rest. It's that simple. Some rests cost you more in speed than others but anytime the arrow comes in contact with a pre-launch surface the physics of friction and drag take over.
In the case of the Whisker Biscuit you lose more speed because not only is the arrow shaft coming in contact with a pre-launch surface, but the vanes at the tail end of the projectile are being restricted momentarily as they pass through the rest. It's all about the vane length, amount of helical twist, and vane composition when it comes to exactly how much speed you'll lose.
We used a BoDoodle TimberDoodle as our benchmark prong style rest. 3" urethane vanes lost a negligible 1-2 feet per second regardless of the bow. Four-inch vanes or feathers with a standard 1 to 2 degree helical lost about the same. We compared this benchmark with the Deluxe Whisker Biscuit. Our findings were precisely consistent with the CAP literature. Five inch fletching cost us 5 to 7 feet per second. Up the helical to 6 degrees and this is not the product for you! We lost a whopping 12 to 17 feet per second! It's only when you start lengthening the fletching to 5" that you really start to see an appreciable drop in arrow speed. This makes sense if you think about it, because the more of the fletching surface to come in contact with a drag-inducing surface, like the bristles of the Biscuit, the more likely you are to lose speed.
Once again, truth in advertising becomes important. No one at CAP or ArcheryWorld.com pretends you won't lose speed. You will! If speed is a big factor in your style of shooting you'll need to be aware of the limitations of this design when compared to the arrow set up you shoot. The Whisker Biscuit is not a product for everyone, but then again, nothing in the archery industry is!
Accuracy
With a Hooter Shooter as our guide, we tested all three rests at 20, 30 and 40 yards in our indoor test facility. With the exception of the "Original" which crept out of alignment after 100 shots, the "Drop Tine" and the "Deluxe" delivered bullet hole performance. We were shooting into the same holes from 40 yards, no problem. We found the competition claims that vane contact with the Biscuit affects flight to be bogus. Removing the human variable by using the Hooter Shooter disproved this claim.
Summary
When all things were considered we gave the Whisker Biscuit a 4.5 stars out of a possible 5 for a number of reasons. The company that manufactures the product is as honest as the day is long. That's got to count for something in this rough and tumble cut throat industry. The Whisker Biscuit is notably not a product that is all things to all archers. The product's perceived shortcomings are addressed openly, honestly, and factually by the manufacturer, Carolina Archery Products. If you want a no nonsense hunting rest that won't fail you at that moment of truth and removes an important anxiety inducing factor, then this is a product we feel confident won't let you down. If you are a speed freak versus an accuracy freak you'll need to pay attention to your arrow set up before you consider buying this rest.
There are no commercially available camo patterns available for any of the CAP product line. We're not big matching camo fanatics but for some this is a big deal. The "Original" is lacking in adjustment and we felt barely worthy of your consideration except the price does allow you to experience the Whisker Biscuit design. Solutions and options to these concerns would have meant a perfect 5.
When you balance all this against versatility, cost, function and the fact you can use the same rest to shoot your carbons or aluminum arrows we feel this is a solid product!
Visit the Carolina Archery Products website at www.carolinaarcheryprod.com