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Sabatage? Looks that way...

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Old 06-08-2018, 05:38 AM
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Nontypical Buck
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Default Sabatage? Looks that way...

Well, The Affordable care act is still with us. But I think everyone agrees that it's not hale and hardy as laws go. Who's to blame you ask? It's looking like the light is falling on the GOP. I'm sure the well read members have already seen these articles. But I'll post a few to help those who may have missed it.

Steven Waldman for Fortune magazine:
"Obamacare is hurting my family, and I blame…the Republicans.

Allow me to unpack that sentiment. The Schoolhouse Rock version of policy progress is: Congress passes law. Congress passes “technical fix” bill a year two later. Congress does more substantial changes a through a reauthorization a few years later. Ok maybe the “technical fix” part didn’t make the Schoolhouse Rock cartoon song but the point is that the normal, expected legislative process assumed constant refinement. That a law needed changes was not a sign of its failure; it was a sign of it being a law.

Today’s Republicans have taken the position that since the Affordable Care Act must be repealed, it must not be fixed. Why repair the car you’re about to send to the scrapyard? The problem of course is that six years have passed, and there has been no repeal nor major fixes.
Sadly, we’ve all gotten used to this. Ah these wacky partisan times! But it’s worth repeating: to try to damage Barack Obama, Republicans have intentionally made Americans suffer more. The target has always been the president; the victims turn out to be millions of families."
http://fortune.com/2016/10/04/obamacare-exchanges/

Abbe R. Gluck writing into the New York times had this to say:

How the G.O.P. Sabotaged Obamacare
"Obamacare is not “collapsing under its own weight,” as Republicans are so fond of saying. It was sabotaged from the day it was enacted. And now the Republican Party should be held accountable not only for any potential replacement of the law, but also for having tried to starve it to death.

The Congressional Budget Office on Wednesday released its accounting of the House Republicans’ replacement bill for the Affordable Care Act, and the numbers are not pretty: It is projected to leave 23 million more Americans uninsured over 10 years, through deep cuts to insurance subsidies and Medicaid. The report underscores how the bill would cut taxes for the rich to take health care away from the less well-off.

The A.C.A. is not perfect, and improvements to it would be welcome. But it worked in many respects and would have worked much better had Congress been a faithful guardian of the law."
http://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/25/op...acare-aca.html

The peculiar drama that has underscored this legislation began at it's inception. Maybe had the Democrats engaged in more bi-partisan debate it might have faired better? I don't think so myself and if the Democrats ever have full power again my theory will be upheld or dumped depending. The GOP was powerless to stop the law and we heard the classic "elections have consequences" remark. Well low and behold, next time around the GOP regained both the house and Senate and began to fight back. Sadly this time also saw the rise of the TEA Party. Sociopathic politics entered the scene. As they moved to disrupt the entire political process (the last thing we needed at that time) trenches were deepened and as with every war the non-combatants suffered the most.

The bi-partisan warfare we have been watching since G.H. Bush held office is not going to end on it's own.

Last edited by Mickey Finn; 06-08-2018 at 05:40 AM.
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Old 06-08-2018, 05:49 AM
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Lol, you must post someone else's opinion because you just don't know enough about the program to discuss it no surprise there.

thanks to Obamacare, my family's own health care plan went from $600/mo to over 2k/ mo in just three years. That had nothing to do with Republicans and everything to do with the Democrats.
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Old 06-08-2018, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Fieldmouse View Post
Lol, you must post someone else's opinion because you just don't know enough about the program to discuss it no surprise there.

thanks to Obamacare, my family's own health care plan went from $600/mo to over 2k/ mo in just three years. That had nothing to do with Republicans and everything to do with the Democrats.
Fieldmouse, I did include my own opinion and if you look at the facts you'll it was the GOP who hurt your family. Loyalty is a fine thing, blind allegiance is not.
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Old 06-08-2018, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Mickey Finn View Post
Fieldmouse, I did include my own opinion and if you look at the facts you'll it was the GOP who hurt your family. Loyalty is a fine thing, blind allegiance is not.
please, the GOP didn't put government in charge of my plan I was allowed to buy. The GOP didn't make my current private contract I was happy with illegal. Is that correct?
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Old 06-08-2018, 06:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Mickey Finn View Post
Fieldmouse, I did include my own opinion and if you look at the facts you'll it was the GOP who hurt your family. Loyalty is a fine thing, blind allegiance is not.
please, the GOP didn't put government in charge of my plan I was allowed to buy. The GOP didn't make my current private contract I was happy with illegal. Is that correct?
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Old 06-08-2018, 06:11 AM
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Chief Obamacare architect and current advisor to President Donald Trump on health care reform Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel is on record admitting that the true purpose of the Affordable Care Act is to destroy private insurance companies and make single-payer unavoidable.
https://amp-dailycaller-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/amp.dailycaller.com/2017/03/20/flashback-obamacare-architect-aca-designed-to-implode-destroy-insurance-companies/?amp_js_v=a1&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCCAE%3D#amp_tf= From%20%251%24s&ampshare=http%3A%2F%2Fdailycaller. com%2F2017%2F03%2F20%2Fflashback-obamacare-architect-aca-designed-to-implode-destroy-insurance-companies%2F
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Old 06-08-2018, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Fieldmouse View Post
please, the GOP didn't put government in charge of my plan I was allowed to buy. The GOP didn't make my current private contract I was happy with illegal. Is that correct?
Fieldmouse, we know you don't like the ACA. We also know that any plan that was not deemed adequate to meet the standard established by law was made unavailable. What we are exploring here is the sabotage of this healthcare reform act.

Originally Posted by Fieldmouse View Post
please, the GOP didn't put government in charge of my plan I was allowed to buy. The GOP didn't make my current private contract I was happy with illegal. Is that correct?
As above.

Originally Posted by Fieldmouse View Post
https://amp-dailycaller-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/amp.dailycaller.com/2017/03/20/flashback-obamacare-architect-aca-designed-to-implode-destroy-insurance-companies/?amp_js_v=a1&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCCAE%3D#amp_tf= From%20%251%24s&ampshare=http%3A%2F%2Fdailycaller. com%2F2017%2F03%2F20%2Fflashback-obamacare-architect-aca-designed-to-implode-destroy-insurance-companies%2F
Paranoia? Maybe not. But I will point out the insurance companies were 100% behind the ACA when it looked like they were going to make a killing.

Last edited by Mickey Finn; 06-08-2018 at 08:07 AM. Reason: post, read, edit, re-post....
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Old 06-08-2018, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Mickey Finn View Post
Fieldmouse, we know you don't like the ACA. We also know that any plan that was not deemed adequate to meet the standard established by law was made unavailable. What we are exploring here is the sabotage of this healthcare reform act.



As above.
Don't hide behind the law the law your party created behind closed doors and over the objections of the American people. When they were faced with rejection by the American people, what did they do? Changed the rules of the game and pushed it through anyway. I noticed you're not saying a 3x increase in my monthly payment for an insurance plan which covered less and costs more out of pocket falls under the description of affordable healthcare. Why aren't you? I notice you're not acknowledging the lies Obama repeated over and over again like you can keep you doctor you can keep your plan. You will see a $2500 reduction in healthcare costs. Yet, you still claim the Republicans sabotaged Obamacare?

Paranoia? Maybe not. But I will point out the insurance companies were 100% behind the ACA when it looked like they were going to make a killing.
You're right, they were. They were promised and finally received guaranteed profits. Now they are guaranteed to earn at least 15% profit. If not, the taxpayers will make up the difference. I know you're union and never had to rely on your own intellect to run your own company but even you could open a business and be profitable if government guarantees your profitability.

Last edited by Fieldmouse; 06-08-2018 at 12:16 PM.
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Old 06-08-2018, 11:08 AM
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The democrats passed a law that was designed to collapse the system.
What is your beef Mickey?

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Old 06-09-2018, 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by C. Davis View Post
The democrats passed a law that was designed to collapse the system.
What is your beef Mickey?

C. Davis
My beef? I'd guess it's the GOP's taking axes to the damaged ship when they should have patched the leaks, righted the rigging, and got her sailing in a useful direction. As it is she has limped into the wrong harbor and is about to run aground.

Originally Posted by Fieldmouse View Post
Don't hide behind the law the law your party created behind closed doors and over the objections of the American people. When they were faced with rejection by the American people, what did they do? Changed the rules of the game and pushed it through anyway. I noticed you're not saying a 3x increase in my monthly payment for an insurance plan which covered less and costs more out of pocket falls under the description of affordable healthcare. Why aren't you? I notice you're not acknowledging the lies Obama repeated over and over again like you can keep you doctor you can keep your plan. You will see a $2500 reduction in healthcare costs. Yet, you still claim the Republicans sabotaged Obamacare?

You're right, they were. They were promised and finally received guaranteed profits. Now they are guaranteed to earn at least 15% profit. If not, the taxpayers will make up the difference. I know you're union and never had to rely on your own intellect to run your own company but even you could open a business and be profitable if government guarantees your profitability.
I'd never say the Democrats did the right thing passing this legislation. Anymore than I'd say that about how the GOP reacted once they regained power. Both parties forgot the reason they were there and sought to carry out their own self-serving agenda's. I would suggest the GOP moved to sabotage the affordable care act. Pointing out it is still there, leaning on crutches maybe, but still standing. The point being, all they have done is hurt people who rely on them for representation.

You said something at first about "hiding behind the law". I'd remind you we are a nation of laws and we don't just acknowledge the laws we like.
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