PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Here is a link to a PGC news release that says our harvest is down by about 17%. The PGC blames weather and poor mast crop.

What do you guys think?

http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/v...?Q=160660&A=11

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

i believe it.....i dont think it was a god rifle season....up north in the mountains where many hunters go the first week was horrible weather wise.....second day about everyone stayed in....freezing cold windy and snow made it tough....deer werent moving much at all....and if deer were killed alot were does..guys just getting meat and getting out of the cold.....i hunted clear till the last day of flintlock season and seen a ton of deer....an actuall herd of 12 walked by me in range...no antlers....alot of bucks dropped already....i know there was a buck or 2...bodys alot bigger then the other deer....mature does were visible as well as fawns....2 stood out that were bigger....i got 2 does this year so i was waiting for antlers after the first saturday in rifle season.....tough hunting......i believe the stats would be low.....everyones going to say oh they are fixed so we kill more next year blah blah blah.......not to many people got deer this year....noone wanted to hunt and if they did most wouldnt hunt how they had to to get the deer....we did drives from the first weekend on and did great.....about 20 deer killed by our groupd of 15 or so.....14 were bucks...thats the way to hunt these conditions.....we passed 100s of hunters sitting on their stands in their trees swaying back and forth from the wind..and the frezzing cold and snow made the deer lay up long.....most hunters just said oh well theres no deer left from last year........i am on who will never believe it....i seen 100s of deer this year

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I guess I can see how the weather would have affected the harvest. I know there is a long season but the majority of the hunters only have the first 2 or three days to hunt and if they aren't going to stick out the wind and the snow then they aren't going to get too many deer. Of course you will always have those people who will find faults in everything the pgc says. If PA became one of the best whitetail states in the nation people would still b^%$#. I for one am going to stick with Alt. I think the antler restrictions are working and that there are a ton of does in the state compared to bucks. I don't know about anyone else but I get tired of seeing 30 deer the first day with 29 of them being does and one with 2" spikes.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I don't think the first two days of the season could have been worse:eek:

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I know the year was a bad one but are the deer out there in PA?

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

The deer are here! I saw over 50 on the last day of late archery/muzzleloader alone! First two days of gun were HORRIBLE. Unfortunately a lot of hunters only hunt that day or two and I think that had a lot to do with the low kill. I hunted all the seasons in three different management units and had a very good year both in seeing deer and harvesting deer.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Depends on where you hunt. Many of those who are reporting great success are located in western/southwest/south central part of state. Big difference for most part her in east/northeast/northcentral.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I think a little bit of the low harvest is due to the weather, and a little is due to the lack of deer in certain places. Fortunately my hunting areas have good deer numbers, but there are places I go and hunters I trust know what they are talking about who say deer numbers are down in some areas.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

The weather was bad, but Ive been out all archery too and didnt see much.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

quote]but there are places I go and hunters I trust know what they are talking about who say deer numbers are down in some areas. [/quote]

Thank you, as there are many on this board who do not believe those reports.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I believe the weather had a small role in the harvest.

I think the bigger reason why there is a decline is due to the aggressive herd reductions over the past few years. I feel that public land is hurting in many areas. Lower deer numbers = lower harvest.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

The deer population is hurting at least on the gamelands it is.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I have not read the article yet but I am gonna be ticked if Alt uses the "17%" lower harvest as a reason for increasing doe tag allocations or just the potential for an increased doe harvest next year....especially if it is a blanket policy across the state.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Face it: we are creatures of habit. Not everyone can scout 24/7/365. We go to the same places every year. We go to where we had luck. We will always go to the honey hole even if it does'nt produce in a few years. We always hear "this is a good spot, Joe Shmoe shot a big 14 point here one year."

So many hunters near camp that are B!tch!ng don't shoot deer anyways. Not even in the "golden days."

"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always be where you've always been."-author unknown.

This past season proved that.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I hear that, yup its time to go and find some new hunting land.
2 years in a row now for me with a tag at the end of the season [:'(]

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

We went down the first week of Bow season before the deer even knew what was going on, and for the first time in over 15 years came home empty. We saw a couple of nicer bucks but none that offered a shot, but the kicker was that the overall population was WAY down from previous years, even when shining we saw less than 1/3 of what we normally had seen in years past.

We'll be going to the midwest this coming year. I think PA royally screwed up a good thing just for egos and cash--you may get a few decent deer out of it, but they are going to lose a boatload of revenue in the process and substantially hurt their overall herd in the process if it continues as is. This 1 million doe tag stuff isn't cutting it either--IMHO each person should buy their license with an either-sex tag--have the PGC charge whatever they wish to gain their revenue-- but once you harvest A deer, you are done. None of this multiple deer stuff each year-- to me that is in a nutshell what is killing our hunting to begin with. I remember back when it was an HONOR to shoot a deer, ANY deer, in a given state. Now it is just nothing more than a big killing field and the end result is big money for the State governments.. Very sad. JMHO. Pinhweel 12

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

PABowhntr

That is EXACTLY what I see happening. Since the harvest this year is lower - I see them increasing the allocations next year.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Heck, I had a 25% increase in harvest over last year! [8D]
Heck, I had 3 tags left at the end of the season. But then... I could take 7 deer this year. LOL

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Well you know they will, Dr Alt was all ready to lengthen doe season to three weeks.:(

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Topped ya, went 6 seasons without filling a tag. Some years there were misses, other years just bad luck, like the buck I shot on SGL 217 which died in the arms of a private land hunter.:(

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

That sucks![:@]

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

It was the weather in rifle season that was bad. I think it was a matter of fewer people out the second day as well as lots of snow for the first saturday. I saw about as many deer as I normally do. Our group of 8 usually end up with at least 6-8 deer from archery, rifle and muzzle loader this year we only harvested 3.
Chalk it up to weather and over confidence in our case we didn't hunt as hard during rifle season figuring muzzleloader would bring us at least 2 deer. Well 20 shots and a bunch of misfires later no one managed any luck with the smoke poles either. Had a hell of a time and lots of chances just no success.

Late season I saw some of the most intersting things in the last 5 years. We saw normal herd of doe 20-25, 2 bucks with them, one spike, one shooter, then on the other side of the property we had another group of 4 bucks, 3 of which were 6 or more points (one 10 pointer in the bunch that is a bruiser). It is very rare for us to see more than a buck or two let alone that many shooter bucks. We can't wait for next year and had a great time regardless of no success.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I think Gary needs to lengthen the bow season to 4 months....

;):)

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I like it Frank!

Lets start bow season sept 1 and go till the end of February;)

And give the muzzleloaders a whack at a buck early (flintlocks only)
After all, we have seen that we shouldnt depend on a huge kill from the rifle guys who only go out a day or two if the weather is a little nasty.

BTW I saw 52 deer on the last day of the late season including 3 bucks, two of which were AR legal. Not one hunter outside of my gang! Wasnt a matter of no deer to shoot around here. Juat a matter of fair weather hunters.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Yeah, but BT, even some "foul weather" hunters were daunted by -10 degree temps on that last day. I made it out but only for about 2 hours...before my fingers about fell off. Ofcourse, sitting 20 feet off the ground in a treestand did not help matters much....:)

For what it is worth I saw 4 deer on the walk in....:D

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I live and hunt in Bucks,and have not seen a decrease in deer pop.But have seen a decrease in hunters,even on nice days.I think the new doe tag thing is whats hurting .They say tags are unlimited but they where sold out the by the 1 week of the 2nd mailing,well thats not unlimited.And who has time to travel all around 5c and chase down tags? I think the old way was alot better.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

hey PABOWHUNTER, i hate to break it to you, but you stand a very good chance of seeing an increase in you doe tags. the best reason that i can give to you as to why, is something that i read about a good qdm plan( like there ever could be such a thing, can youtell i don't like the idea) anyway, let's say your herd is at 80% carrying capacity,, does and bucks , you have to take that number down to somewhere between 50-60%, and then maintain it at the level, with whatever means is necessary to do so, usually be an increase in your anterless harvest. and also, don't be fooled by this often neglected fact, your overall buck harvest will decrease because you are no longer shooting the 1.5 year old bucks, and will never reach what youhave seen in the past, not even close to it, and by definition, according to one qdma biologist i spoke with, never will. it can't!. don't let them tell you the drop is only temorary, if you have to, contact some bilogist in other states that currently have a qdm program, they will confirm what i wrote above,

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Experts?? We don't need no stinkin' experts, we got Dr Alt!;)

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

And the problem is?????

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

The amount of deer there is, is way down, and dont get to excited about seeing a lot of deer the last week of muzzleloader season, at that time of the year the deer heard up and some drives you see nothing and then you hit the motherload and there will sometimes be 25 or 30 deer in it, but they all gathered together then. You just cant keep shooting off the doe and expect to see deer,,,!!!!!Bottom line!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

vtbuckrulrss,

You are not breaking any new news to me. If I did not think that Dr. Alt or the Game Commission would use the decreased harvest as a reason to increase doe license allocations or gun season extensions then I would not have mentioned it in the first place....;)

I understand QDM and herd management but disagree with the way it is being approached at this point. The key focus should be on the herd distribution on private/public land as well as the proportion of deer hunters on private vs. public land in comparison to it.

What good is increasing doe license allocations if a majority of hunters that get the increased tags are hunting public land and the deer are on private, unaccessible, or only moderately hunted private land??

The answer is that it does no good at all.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I can't speek for the rest of the state, but at our property in Clinton county over the last 10 years just seeing a deer is considered a good day of hunting. At one time on our 900 acre spot you would see 40 to 50 deer a day. Granted the bucks are much better quality these days however finding them is tuff and in the big woods they don't follow patterns as much as in more open country. I think this is the area in PA that suffers the most lately where deer are concerned.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Herein lies the problem. I have feared (and stated) that we are becoming a have/have not hunting state. If you have access to private land, your hunting's great. The majority of hunters do not. So you must do one of two things, either regulate the number of deer hunters on public lands (like Arizona does), or make separate doe tags for "public" and "private land only". The WMU's have failed misserably in regulating either of those options. I have no objection on AR's. I could care less. However, seeing deer is a concern. The area between Allentown north to I - 84, from I - 81 to the NJ border has seen too much pressure and way too much killing. And I know other parts of this state are of the same status. So where are the deer in PA? Go to the following link and find out. Highest densities are SE and SW, areas high in population and private land.
http://www.i-maps.com/Qdma/frame/def...10100&MF=11000

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Michigan issues their antlerless tags this way.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Hey mike, haven't we listened enough about your whining about the lack of deer??????????? How many deer will you have to have before you are happy? A deer behind every tree like there was years ago. Perhaps thats the reason why your area is so deer poor today.


Give it up already or get off your lazy butt and go scout a new area. There are PLENTY of deer around here (NEPA) and I for one CANT WAIT until next year. The decreased harvest around here will only mean more BIGGER BUCKS next year!!!!!! For us archery hunters the weather during Rifle season could not have been better (except if it was rain/fog for two weeks).

Numbers were down......no question but its not from lack of deer its due to hunting pressure, no one hunts anymore.

For god sakes i saw another 4 new ones dead on the highway today, and I saw 7 more live ones driving around today.

You are starting to sound like the 70 year old guys in the wilkes-barre times leader who are whining every weekend about ALT and the PGC every day.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

You mentioned the area east of 81 and north of allentown. Just looking at the area adjacent to the PA turnpike I can tell you that it does not look like prime deer country. I was down there this weekend going to Cabelas. Man there is NO FOOD there for the deer!!!! All the trees are mature and there is little browse by the looks of it. As i stated before no food=no deer, you need a new area to hunt.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I suggest you read the rules about posting on this board. They are at the head of every category.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

Sorry guys but I am with Mike on this one. His last post is very accurate in relation to my own personal experiences and, not to pick on you ilbback, but I do scout new areas on a regular basis. The problem is that public land is few and far between in Lehigh, Northampton and Bucks counties. Getting access to areas with good deer concentrations is difficult because with the large population in this area most private land already has some hunters on it and other landowners are unwilling to allow more hunters because of past "bad experiences". I can't tell you how many times I have walked up to a landowner to get permission to hunt snow geese only to hear "You can go right ahead and shoot as many geese as you like but no deer hunting as I allowed this guy on my property last season and....."

Again, I don't mean to pick on ya ilbback but that area off of the Turnpike just south of the Blue Mountain in Lehigh County is where the PA state record non-typical by bow was taken from. You could probably see the specific spot while you were driving by. :) I can understand how it might look somewhat "barren" during this time of the year but I suggest driving through at the end of spring/summer. You will see that there are no browse lines, several clearcuts along the mountain and a plentitude (is that a word?) of farms/crop fields just about everywhere you look.

So, how was Cabelas? I live about 20 minutes from there and always enjoy my visits. :)

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

I'm w/ PA and Mike on this. I have already started scounting new places for next year. The issue isn't that I am afraid to try new places - scout hard - knock on doors.

I believe that the majority of the public land is hurting for deer. Private land is a different story and access to private land isn't always easy.

Just because a few guys have some spots on public land that are good - you can't say that all public land is good. If you go back and read previous posts about sightings and such - I think the majority of guys reporting seeing less deer and harvesting less deer.

I still think HR on public land is too drastic and not enough is being done on private. Until you can find a way to balance this - I don't think there will be any improvements.

RE: PA deer harvest down 17%
 

PA I would beg to differ with you on the area above the tunnel, i saw a browse line from the Bear creek exit most of the way till down off the hill, specially just below and above rt 80. (ITs mostly big timber with alot of laurel which is less than ideal habitat). Not really sure where blue Mtn is.

You guys have to realize that the lack of deer is not an entire state of PA problem. I am sorry about the lack of deer in your area. Maybe If my area was void of deer i would be crying too. I just find it very hard to believe that your problem has not been a long time in the making, and not just due to increased doe tags. You cant tell me that your hunting has dwindled to nothing in two years. I would believe its more habitat related than doe tag related.


Cabelas was OK........very crowded....and they did not stock everything the catalog sells which was dissapointing. But the mounts were worth the trip.........(Noticed they did not have any from PA.......YET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

PS: Sorry if i offended you mike