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RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
I was looking for some answers on 2 A when I found out most of the state is in real trouble as far as forest health goes.[:-]
I guess I better quit cutting trees down before the deer get the blame for 1B regeneration problems.:eek: Maybe PA just isn't supposed to have both trees, and doe deer.:eek: |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
Better be careful telling about cutting those trees Jim. DCNR will be calling for an allocation of BAWANADMAP tags in 1B!;)
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RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
"Just one more example of why you can't take part in a civil objective discussion. I suppose the WCO just made it all up?"
No. They didnt know what the hell they were talking about.Plain and simple. Ilived through this crap up to my neck in it and listened to the foremost experts on the topic from pgc, not some obscure wco. Its been stated in pgc articles in magazines aswell as at presentation in Greene county. Its alsobeen discussionsonhpa and other place with"insiders" explaning the situation. The statements and knowledge on the topic that is 100% counterto what you have said which I have heard, read and seen thru several venues, doesnt even allow for the possibilty of that wco being right. I explained the situation, and if none of what Ive told you is believable or makes 1000% sense, than your a dang fool and would most likely argue if you were told by Jesus christ himself. |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
ORIGINAL: Cornelius08 "Not according to our local WCO. They did say that the number of survivors that were later killed by hunters had surpised them though." Your wco had no idea what he was talking about. PGC biologists stated it was a especially caustic strain apparently. They said they determined this because in some localized areas it hit it wiped out 80+%. That wouldnt be possible if itdidnt kill a higher percentage of thoseineffected. Judging by the body count around here at the time, Id agree 100%. Luckily there were areas not at all infected and others with few deer infected.Even if 100% of the deer in those worst areas were infected that would be a 80% mortality rate among those infected. I dont believe 100% were infected so the mortality rate of those infected could theoretically have been much higher than 80%. One way to determine a survivor is by looking at the hooves which would appear wrinkled or cracked. Noone I know has havested a deer that displayed the symptoms, nor have I heard of any taken. Not to say none where, but seems a very very low number. "The geographic extent of it was much larger than first thought as well. Mine was in NE Allegheny co and the other was in Westmoreland and as I understand it, cases were confirmed ad far north as Cambria. " YEs very few and far between isolated incidents. By far the huge majority of it hit right here in 2A. "Also, the 2007 outbreak would not be in the data but the earlier outbreak, which was not as severe would be. Although the exact year escapes me right now." YEs, and I too cannot recall...2002 maybe? Around there i believe...anyway there were just a small handful of confirmed deaths that year. Hemorrhagic disease is common in the southeastern United States and outbreaks have been documented in Pennsylvania and many other states. Losses due to EHD have occurred in Pennsylvania in 1996, 2002, and 2007. While mortality associated with EHD may seem dramatic, local populations rebound quickly after an outbreak. Many infected deer live and show only mild signs of disease or no signs at all. And animals that survive an EHD infection develop antibodies that protect them from future outbreaks. More information, including a brochure, can be found on our EHD webpage. |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
"I was looking for some answers on 2 A when I found out most of the state is in real trouble as far as forest health goes"
Yeah. LOL good one. Funny thing is we just got in trouble NOW after already having cut our ow herd in half, and the trend was increasing until last year! LOL Naa my friend, I answered my own question. I reread the report and found something id missed by reading quickly. More pgc 100% unadulterated b.s. You'll be tickled pink to hear apparently the bar has been raised. "DATA ARE BASED ON SAMPLES COLLECTED FROM 2003-2007, PENNSYLVANIA. RESULTS CANNOT BE COMPARED TO PREVIOUS REPORTS BECAUSE OF CHANGES IN METHODS!" Another change surprise surprise. And not one that is gonna benefit the hunters of Pa. After looking at the charts from the 06 report and this one, i see SEVERAL wmus are now rated LOWER thanks to this new "bio-vegetation nut" derived system. |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
@#$@@ double post!
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RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
Yes btb, I thought it was 2002. But as for this comment "Many infected deer live and show only mild signs of disease or no signs at all." Is common in some strains. Differing strainshavedifferent levels of mortality, as well as harsher effect where the disease doesnt normally occur and deer have little immunity. The last bout was a real slobber knocker.
And those who develop a degree of resistence still arent 100% immune. And also is only temporary. |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
No. They didnt know what the hell they were talking about.Plain and simple. Ilived through this crap up to my neck in it and listened to the foremost experts on the topic from pgc, not some obscure wco. Its been stated in pgc articles in magazines aswell as at presentation in Greene county. Its alsobeen discussionsonhpa and other place with"insiders" explaning the situation. The statements and knowledge on the topic that is 100% counterto what you have said which I have heard, read and seen thru several venues, doesnt even allow for the possibilty of that wco being right. I explained the situation, and if none of what Ive told you is believable or makes 1000% sense, than your a dang fool and would most likely argue if you were told by Jesus christ himself. Gee, it seems the experts disagree..... http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/view.asp?a=465&Q=174681&PM=1 Epizootic Hemorrhagic Disease got the attention of many people in 2007. This disease is caused by a virus. The first documented outbreak of hemorrhagic disease was in 1955 in New Jersey. In its acute form, it causes sudden loss of appetite, disorientation, weakness, respiratory distress, and rapid death. Die-offs occur suddenly and almost exclusively in late summer and early fall, coinciding with peak populations of the insects, called midges or “no-see-ums” that transmit the disease. Hemorrhagic disease is common in the southeastern United States and outbreaks have been documented in Pennsylvania and many other states. Losses due to EHD have occurred in Pennsylvania in 1996, 2002, and 2007. While mortality associated with EHD may seem dramatic, local populations rebound quickly after an outbreak. Many infected deer live and show only mild signs of disease or no signs at all. And animals that survive an EHD infection develop antibodies that protect them from future outbreaks. More information, including a brochure, can be found on our EHD webpage. . It would seem to me that only a "dang fool" would claim to know that every deer who contracted EHD in 2007 died. |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
Thats speaking of the disease in general. The effects of differing strains vary. We got as bad as they come in 2007. ITs agreed upon by all experts who evalutated the situation. Nothing you posted disagrees with me. Im not giving an opinion. Im speaking of the experts have said on our 2007 outbreak. A general statement not even pertainly particularly to The Pa 2007 outbreak is meaningless in refuting anything Ive said.
I suggest you send and email to the "ask the biologist" feature on the pgc website and ask if it was not a particularly bad strain that killed a very high percentage of those infected. I already know these things. I made it a point to know when it hit and spent as much time as possible finding out what the story really was. Now its 2 years later and the topic is a bit boring. Been there. Done that. Even the great "gal that fishes" who spoke regularly with those who studied the outbreak stated it was a particularly bad strain. Walter Cottrell, pgc veterinarian has stated the same. OF course if you lived here and found bodies piled up like cord word and seldom saw a living deer thereafter, you wouldnt need to be told.;) BTW, your also a liar as usual. I didnt say "every deer" I said MOST so its clear you're trying to be an arse and little else. |
RE: 07/08 annual report. Good bad and ugly. Mostly ugly
The pendulum swings both ways, but With this last regeneration report even I am left wondering what they are looking for.
I have posted pictures of my landin the past and I will again when I can get out, buts its snowing like hell so that ain't happening now. My point is even in an area where food is abundant I can show you deer damage, one small white pine in particular that was cleaned off except where the snow covered it. If the goal is not to have any noticeable deer damage then that goal is unobtainable in the northern half of the state where snow is prevalent. |
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