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BTBowhunter 01-21-2007 06:21 PM

PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
From the Pitsburgh Tribune Review:


By Bob Frye
TRIBUNE-REVIEW OUTDOORS EDITOR
Sunday, January 21, 2007


Sportsmen are worried that some people within the Pennsylvania Game Commission are trying to "undermine" the state's mentored youth hunting program.
Last year, state lawmakers approved legislation that said any child, regardless of age, could hunt provided they were accompanied by an adult mentor. Game Commissioners subsequently allowed youngsters to hunt groundhogs, squirrels and spring gobblers.
They were initially going to let youngsters hunt antlered deer, too, but delayed that until the fall 2007 season so that agency staff had time to work out the logistics of the program.
Now, those same staff people are telling commissioners they need yet more time. When commissioners meet this week, agency staff will recommend that they not let kids hunt bucks.
















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The feeling is that allowing children who don't have a license -- and therefore no harvest tag -- to kill deer will be problematic. Some believe it will play havoc with the commission's ability to track the deer harvest. Others fear it will lead to law enforcement issues, with mentors shooting small bucks and saying the children took them.
"We simply need more time to consider alternatives and the potential benefits and costs to the agency, the resource and the citizens of the Commonwealth," reads an item in the Game Commission's agenda.
Agency staff have already had a year to work out those very issues, though, said commissioner Russ Schleiden of Centre County. He said he's not sure if the board will follow the staff's recommendation.
There's no doubt how the sportsmen who served on the state's youth mentored hunting committee feel, however.
In a letter to commissioners and agency staff, Ron Fretts, the Scottdale man who chaired the committee, said any move to keep kids from hunting deer this fall is "unacceptable."
"Many youth who experienced hunting with an adult mentor in 2006 because of the new program are eagerly waiting to pursue the crown jewel of hunting, the white-tailed deer," Fretts wrote. "We stand to seriously disappoint those families who hoped to enjoy time afield this fall."
Commission biologists have already said there is no scientific evidence to indicate that that letting children hunt bucks -- as well as turkeys -- this fall will cause any problems, Fretts added.
"Sportsmen across the Commonwealth see this type of waffling by (the) PGC as an indication of an agency headed in the wrong direction. Sportsmen that considered the PGC as a partner in efforts to improve hunter recruitment and retention rates will no longer trust (the) PGC if the agency proceeds with plans to gut the mentored youth hunting program," Fretts concluded.


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Bob Frye can be reached at [email protected] or (724) 838-5148.


Its a shame that when the PGc is under fire for trying to do the right thing with the deer program that they let this opportunity to help promote hunting fall through the cracks. Other states like Missouri have shown us overwhelming proof that the key to getting youth involved in hunting is to tear down some barriers and here is the PGc staff failing to do just that.

i dont knowabout you guys but I'm not buying their explanations on this one. Theyve had plenty of time to address their issues.

PABuck_HNTR 01-21-2007 06:38 PM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 

Others fear it will lead to law enforcement issues, with mentors shooting small bucks and saying the children took them.
I think this could be a legitimate concern. Especiallyknowing some deer hunters that would probably do this for sure.I don't think they need more time though. I know they vote on issues this month, but they could table this until the licenses are avaiable in July. That should be enough time to work out issues. I'll get slammed for saying this ,but if the 3 point rule was in effect for all hunters it would eliminate that problem. I'm not against youngsters shooting smaller bucks, just adults taking advantage of loopholes.

BTBowhunter 01-21-2007 07:17 PM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
This isnt to slam you for your opinion but I think maybe the possibility of an adult taking a kid out there, shooting a small buck, and then putting the kids tag on it is pretty low.

Here's why I thinkthat while it might happen, the frequency would be sosmallthatit would be insignificant.

My boys are now 17 and 14 so my memories of their introduction todeer hunting are relatively fresh. Taking a 12 year old out in the deer woods requires a lot of patience andway more commitment than it does to hunt for yourself. Their attention span is still relatively short, they inadvertently make noises and movements that spook game. They forget their hunting coat, hat gloves, shells, knife, arrows etc etc etc. They get cold, bored, tired, hungry,and fidgety EARLY AND OFTEN!.

Now dont get me wrong, the best moments of my hunting career were being there for each of my sons first deer, first buck, first gut job etc etc etc. Every minute has been worth it

My point here is that the kind of jerk that is looking for a shortcut to tagging a deer is not the kind of father willing to show the committment required to take a young hunter outat all let alone take him out at a younger age than 12 when all of the things I just mentioned are likely to be maginfied at a younger age.

I'd like to think that a father who takes his kid out at 7 8 9 or whatever age under 12 is showing a commitment to making a sportsman out of that child and we ought to do whatever we can to make that possible.

Poachers are poachers because they refuse toplay by the rules and they take the easy way out. taking a kid thats younger than 12 out to deer hunt if that kid isnt interested is NOT the easy way to get a deer, even a small buck. And if the kid is interested I find it hard to imagine that many fathers would deny the kid the chance to shoot so that they could shoot and tag the kids deer instead.

DennyF 01-21-2007 07:39 PM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
Yes the possibility exists that some bozo might use the excuse of taking his unlicensed kid out for deer and abuse the system. The same possibility has existed for years, when the kid had a license and the ol' man abused the system by using that kid's tag. Agreed, they had plenty of time to formulate a reporting or tag component to go with a mentored youth deer opportunity for next season.

Judging by the comments offered today by Fretts and several others who worked to gain passage of a mentored youth hunting opportunity, the board will be under considerable pressure to reject staff's opinions and move towards the promisedmentored youthdeer component. The most persuasive argument for it, came from the Governor's youth advisory council, who unanimously voiced their opinion in favor of a mentoredyouth "deer season".

BTBowhunter 01-21-2007 08:19 PM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
Thanks for the update Denny! :D

PABuck_HNTR 01-22-2007 05:49 AM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 

This isnt to slam you for your opinion but I think maybe the possibility of an adult taking a kid out there, shooting a small buck, and then putting the kids tag on it is pretty low.
BT, No problem, your opinions are well respected on these topics. I guess you could be right as far as the pros outweighing thecons in the program. Lets just hope the PGC doesn't drop the ball as you said. My concern was based on those greedy meat hunters out there that use tags from their wifes, fathers etc. It could be true as in another post of yours that these hunters are now fading away as more tags are available to them. You've changed my mind.

rybohunter 01-22-2007 06:34 AM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
I'm with trykon, I have no faith in the average PA hunter.

Selloo 01-22-2007 06:44 AM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
IMHO the PGC should do away with all youth days and while they're at it do away with the sub AR clause for youth as well. What type of lessons are we teaching our children that the rules are one thing but for them they are bent. Also allowing them to kill sub AR bucks for a few years then after they have it set in their minds that it's ok to do so try to change them into thinking that those very same deer need to be protected for the benefit of the herd?

Crazy Horse RVN 01-22-2007 06:57 AM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
In an ever decreasing hunter numbers world, everything possible to entice and recruit youthful hunters should be addressed. In N.J. the hunting license is FREE. Imagine that!

How about this; If a youth shoots a Button Buck the parent is obligated to put his (adult Buck Tag) on the animal. That would sure cut down on the killing of Button Bucks.

Every opportunity should be provided to increase the number of youthful hunters in Pennsylvania.

Pops423 01-22-2007 07:01 AM

RE: PGC staff drops an important ball for our youth
 
It is a shame that you have to worry about these 'mentors' not being sportsman and teaching young children these values.

I do think the program is a good one and can't wait to take my son (who will be four in the spring) if the program comes about in the next few years. When he is ready and legally aloud, he will be there.

Selloo, I do agree with you that the sub AR restrictions for the youth should be removed. Who ever said you have to get abuck to be successful? I think a doe would/should me just as much.


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