ok, but dont you think that if there were a one size fits all approach that the state might become more balanced.

the percentage of bucks that reach maturity is very low, in large part because of the number of 1 1/2 year old bucks that are killed, so if you could increase the number of deer that make it past there first year of life dont you think you would also increase the number of deer that would reach maturity.

Sorry JC but it was intended for the "i have never heard so much complaining about not seeing any deer, people are just to lazy and wont get off their 4 wheelers and sit for a while or even walk somewheres"

I think i missed 3 days of hunting all season this yr(couldn`t get out of work in time). Took the first 10 days of gun season off(hunted from day break till 2, came out ate then right back in till dark) had 5 days off for bow(same sitting as gun) and then hunted everyday after work(3:30 till dark). Hunted 6 different spots and saw hadley any deer. Yes I did my pre season homework and scouted so can`t say it was do to lazyness. Don`t bring the 4-wheeler out till I shot something, and did a crap load of walking. Again I know this is off topic but I hate when people assume and put everyone in a category. I grew up hunting so I know what I`m doing. I do support some kind of AR, in hopes of bringing the herd up. I also know that if there isn`t a AR then if you pass a spike/4point or young buck you might not see it again. I do hunt to see deer but I also hunt b/c I love to eat it(I`m eating some jerky now)I did read in the paper before season about some land owners trying to get AR`s in effect for my area but I think it died down.

What does any of this have to do with AR?

Seems to me the moral of this story is that you are not hunting in a good area and should consider hunting a different area. If you did your "pre-season scouting homework", shouldn't you have known there was "hardley any deer".?

well i was hunting on state land that i had never set foot on until hunting season and i had no problems finding deer up there, actually i shot 3 up there.

Ummmmm I said sorry for going off topic in my post. It was a reply to the "lazy poeple" post. I did my pre-season homework. saw rubs, alot of tracks and evan does.Was hoping the does brought in bucks,LOL.Travel up this way sometime and try to hunt public land. Cicero swamp had 30 cars parked there. Alot of the land here is POSTED.No I don`t tresspass. Any hunting land here is either being hunted or the land owners don`t want you on thier land.The 6 spots I hunt are the ones I own or have permission to hunt. Total I saw 13 deer including the 4 point I shot. that`s "hardley any deer"to me. I think if there was AR`s then some of the guys around where I hunt wouldn`t shoot small deer but since no one I hunt with is seeing deer they shoot the 1st buck they see. I would`ve passed on the 4 point but he was the only buck I saw all of bow season. This is my last rant since I`m the only "non real hunter" on here and am the only hunter not seeing any deer.[&o] again sorry off topic.

well good for you John. YOU THE MAN. I guess if we got off our 4-wheelers and hunted we might have gotten 6 bucks in the last 3 yrs.must have been in the RIGHT SPOT. Try that in cicero swamp or toad harbor swamp.

No I don't. The habitat varies widely from farms(marginal to great land), to abandoned farms, to swamps, to mountains, to rural to high density urban. Therefore the carrying capacities and land open to hunting varies wildly also. What is good for one area will fail miserably in another.

Very true. But the majority of 3 per side you see are 1 1/2 yo. The rest will for the most part small 2 1/2 yo. Under 3 pts or better, these deer are the targets and will be about shot out each year. You save the less than 3 pt/side so they are legal at 2 1/2 and join the target pool - still YOUNG deer.

Shooting a 1 1/2 yo 3 pt/side (or even 2 1/2)does not let this deer get mature. I see no way AR based on points will allow any significant number of bucks to reach true maturity in NY.

The only way for a deer to mature is to not shoot him when they are young regardless of the arbitrary number of points in their rack.

And I will never feel it is might right to dictate to someone else what deer is "big enough". I will continue to explain to them that if they really wish to shoot a mature deer, they better not shoot any young ones.

Stretch...I just wanted to say..your a good sport...

ok, but alot of the bucks that may have 3 points to one side wont necessarily get shot, if the AR was enforced you would first have to be able to identify 3 points on one side before you could actually shoot. thats not possible in every hunting opportunity.