Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
#11
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Maine
Posts: 3,555
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
It's finally nice to see more and more hunters supporting QDM. Ar's are a good tool but habitat inprovment can also do a lot for the herd. I hope VT compliments the AR's with cutting to inprove browse and also land preservation. I don't know if you guys in VT are feeling the squeeze of urban sprawl like we are in Southern Maine and New Hampshire.
All in all I think VT is on the right track.
All in all I think VT is on the right track.
#12
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Warren PA USA
Posts: 1,512
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
No doubt that some 1.5 year old bucks have more than spikes. If they are born early and have good habitat and brows, you can even see some 6 and 8 pointers in this age class. I have found sheds from an 8pt year and a half old. This is the exception and not the rule though.
Some stats from VT Fish & Wildlife. The VT buck harvest consists of an average of 60% 1.5 year old bucks over the past two years. Of these young bucks, they averaged 2.9 points and weighed 114 pounds. I think the current rule will allow more young bucks to get into the next age class than you might think.
#13
Typical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Altoona,PA
Posts: 679
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
thats good they cut the limit of bucks back.. i was going to say if they added another tag i think that would be shooting themselves in the foot..i agree not many hunters are able to tell on the hoof.. and some bucks are hard to tell, but most 1 1/2 are so easy to tell.. and for the hunter that really believes in AR they should learn andpass on them, cause shooting those 6 and 8's are the ones you should pass till the next year... i also dont think many bucks will be saved w/ a 2 pt limit.. but again its a start and they can fix that in other years... i do wish you all luck...
ORIGINAL: Rob in VT
PA Gobbler,
I agree with you, but how many hunters can really age a deer on the hoof? I would say not many. As you stated, this is a start which can be tweeked each year as needed. If you think about it, an ethical hunter won't be able to see that 3rd point which is an inch long unless the deer if right on top of him. I feel that many legal bucks will walk because hunters can't positively identify the 2 points on one side. With a 2.5 year old, there shouldn't be any question whether it's legal or not.
Last year you could take 3 bucks in VT. Really, the number of second and third bucks taken by a single hunter is so insignificant that it isn't going to make much of a difference.
. . . Rob
PA Gobbler,
I agree with you, but how many hunters can really age a deer on the hoof? I would say not many. As you stated, this is a start which can be tweeked each year as needed. If you think about it, an ethical hunter won't be able to see that 3rd point which is an inch long unless the deer if right on top of him. I feel that many legal bucks will walk because hunters can't positively identify the 2 points on one side. With a 2.5 year old, there shouldn't be any question whether it's legal or not.
Last year you could take 3 bucks in VT. Really, the number of second and third bucks taken by a single hunter is so insignificant that it isn't going to make much of a difference.
. . . Rob
#14
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
I would have preferred to see an AR of 3pt on one side, but I am happy that we have AR at all.
You need to have a little background on the average number of points. In Vermont, a point is listed as a "discernable" point. There was no measurement of at least an inch. The old saying of "if you can hang a ring on it, it is a point" was in effect. The AR rule says that it must be at least one inch long. I think this alone will hold off a lot of people from dropping the hammer.
Still, let's look at a hypothetical situation on an average of 2.9 points. Let's say there are 100 1.5 year old bucks. A third have 2 pts, a third have 3 pts, and a third have 4 pts. This averages to 2.99 points per deer (a little higher than our true average), but I think these are reasonable assumptions. Let's assume that all the 2 pointers survive (33 deer). Let's also assume that half of our 3 pointers survive due to hunters not being sure if that third point is an inch or not (16 deer). Finally let's assume that 5% of our 4 pointers survive (2 deer). If you add it all up that's 51 deer out of 100 that would survive - or 51%. I'll take that success rate any day.
. . . Rob
#15
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Warren PA USA
Posts: 1,512
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
Still, let's look at a hypothetical situation on an average of 2.9 points. Let's say there are 100 1.5 year old bucks. A third have 2 pts, a third have 3 pts, and a third have 4 pts. This averages to 2.99 points per deer (a little higher than our true average), but I think these are reasonable assumptions. Let's assume that all the 2 pointers survive (33 deer). Let's also assume that half of our 3 pointers survive due to hunters not being sure if that third point is an inch or not (16 deer). Finally let's assume that 5% of our 4 pointers survive (2 deer). If you add it all up that's 51 deer out of 100 that would survive - or 51%. I'll take that success rate any day.
#16
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Blossvale, New York
Posts: 21,199
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
I really don't see this as an antler restriction. If they really wanted to accomplish something they should have carried it a point or two further, say 3 points to one side. Most of those little four pointers that everyone whacks are 1 1/2 years old. If they'd let them live(and I'm not necessaryily a QDM let-em-grow guy) they'd see some real changes in 3 or 4 years. If those1 1/2 year olds could make it to 2 1/2, a lot more of them would survive to be 4 and 5. That extra year of learning to avoid and hide from man really helps them and gives them a sure enough chance to make it to 3 and 4 and 5 years old. The two point rule doesn't do anything the old rules of One point 3 inches long didn't do.
#17
RE: Vermont Passes Antler Restriction
I agree with davidmill - its not an Antler Restriction - as we know it.
Its more a legal distinction between a"Antlerless & Antlered"
Its a start - but thats about it.
FH
Its more a legal distinction between a"Antlerless & Antlered"
Its a start - but thats about it.
FH