30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I shot my 30.06 for the first time today and my shoulder is bruised and purple. I am sure that some of this was my fault as I don' t think I started out holding the rifle correctly. (this is the first hunting rifle I have ever owned) I shot 40 rounds with it and managed to get a 2" group at 100yds and a 3.5" group at 200yds. I know this is not very impressive, but it is certainly good enough to kill a deer. ;)

My question is:

What good aftermarket recoil absorbers would you guys suggest? Pachmayr? Others?

Thanks in advance for your help.

PS: My rifle is a Weatherby Vanguard. Yeah, I know it' s not the best rifle in the world, but I am not trying to win a sniper competition. I just wanna bag a deer.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Pachmayr will do fine....personally, I' d look for something called a decellerator.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Just keep shooting, in 20 years your shoulder will be mostly scar tissue and the recoil won' t bruise anymore.:D

Make sure the rifle butt is tight to your shoulder- if its not, it will slam you harder and cause bruising and abrasions. Sounds like the rifle is a good shooter, get off the bench and practice from sitting kneeling and improvised rests- it will make for a better field shooter, and your body will absorb the recoil in a much more pleasant manner than shooting from a benchrest.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I will try that. I will also check into a decellerator and a couple of others. My wife about fell over when I showed her my shoulder just now. Ouchie! I am going to go to the range again on Thursday and I will be taking a friend of mine to help me fine tune. My goal is 1 MOA at 100 yards. If I can get that, I will be happy. The way my stand is set up, I won' t have to make a shot longer than 150 yards or so. If I change stands, I might have to make up to a 300-350 yard shot, but I think I will have plenty of shots where I am.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

If you are having alot of recoil probimes try a litter bullit

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

just an idea,check to see if your barrel is floated,i had trouble with my brno it was rubbing on the wood. also check to see if your stock is to short or to long, that can give ya shoulder a hard time. good luck.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

reacher..

what gun and grain size are you using? do you shoot your gun alot?i have also found from my experiences if i have not shot alot that year my shoulder would be more recoil sensitive to shooting compared to shooting more frequently .i have owned 3 30-06sprg' s in my hunting carrer. one was in a rem 700 ADL using 180gr. another browning BAR and a browning medallion. i find the ligther medallion bit me more after i went past 165gr. the rem 700 had no kick what so ever like my 308win.
also is the gun fight you like an extension of your arm? i have heard from people on this site complaining that a 270win kicking more than the 30-06sprg due to the stock design/ hunter fit.

also how far will you shots be? what frain size are u using? try maybe a premium 150gr. or 165gr. buulet less recoil and the 150gr premium bullet wil hold better.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Weatherby Vanguard is a great rifle. I have a Sako and a Weatherby Vanguard and I' ve grabbed the Wby first the last two seasons. I' m not saying the Vanguard is a higher quality rifle than a Sako, but it' s nice enough to make the choice between the two more about the caliber than the rifle. Is your Vanguad wood or synthetic.

Scott Meier
White Oak Lodge

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Reacher,

I don' t think I have ever shot 40 rounds at the range with my 30-06. I usually keep it under 20 more like 10 and have no problem with shoulder. My Mossberg 500 shooting 2 3/4 slugs, now that rifle will definately mess with the shoulder.

I use either 165 graim remmington' s or winchesters and kill deer just fine. Many hunters by me go to 180 grain but I feel the 165 works great. I usually bring 1 box or rounds with me and if I' m hitting the target with nice groups, then that is what I will be using FDD (First Day Deer).


Good luck....

Tomster

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

First at the range are you using sand bags? try throwing one over your shoulder. NO sense beating yourself up at the range. The sand bags will cut the felt recoil by about 95% no bruiseing. as far as recoil pads. Sims labratorys has some great reoil pads guaranteed to cut felt recoil by 50%. If you like your rifle and you think it is good for you. It really doesn' t matter how much you spent. Vanguards are nice rifles for the money. your groups sound pretty good, especially if that was your first time out. It isn' t always the rifle but sometimes experiece shooting. Good luck with your rifle. I had great luck with the remingon core lokt 165' s in 06.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Ditto on the Limb Saver recoil pad:D

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Many different factors will cause recoil to be greater.

A 30-06 kicks pretty good so there isn' t much you can do to soften the recoil EXCEPT;

Good recoil pad

Lighter weight bullets

Reduced power handloads

padded shoulder

Some say a wood stock verses synthetic, but I don' t notice the difference personally. I also agree with whoever said that shooting from a rest is different. When leaning over a shooting bench , your body doesn' t have much " give" to it. So the more " upright" your torso is, the more your body will flex with the recoil.

Above all, keep this in mind. When shooting at a deer, you will most likely never even hear the report of the rifle, let alone feel the recoil!:)

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Wow! Thanks for all the replies. Here are the specs.

Weatherby Vanguard - Synthetic stock, 30.06
Hornady 150gr SST Light Magnum

No sandbags. I was just shooting off a concrete rest with a rolled up sleeping back under the stock of the rifle.

This was the first time I shot my rifle and is the first time I have shot anything over a .22 in about 10-12 years. I only shot 40 rounds because the guy that bore-sighted my scope did such a bad job that I wasn' t even on the paper at 100 yards. I had to move up to 50 yards and work my way back.

I am sure that my accuracy will improve with practice. I did ok for not having shot a rifle in so long, but I know I can do better. As I said in the above post, my goal is 1moa accuracy. If I can achieve that or maybe a bit better, I will be very happy.

Again, thanks for all the suggestions. I will check into " Limb-Savers" and into the " Decellerator" .

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I shoot 25-30 rounds out of my 45/70 sometimes, and my dad owns a .450 Marlin that he likes to run alot of rounds through also. What we do when we go shooting is take a couple of towels, fold them to fit nicely on your shoulder, and throw them over your shoulder. Works really well, and they aren' t that expensive. If you want a recoil reducer just for the range, this is the way to go.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

What I use to do when I went to the range and shot my Mossberg 500 shooting slugs, I would put a dry sponge under my jacket. I would use a bigger sponge, like the one you use to wash your car with. The sponge helped reduce the affect on the shoulder and I would not feel uncomfortable at the range.

Tomster

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

40 shots with a 30.06 is a lot in one session. I' m pretty sure your shoulder will be very sore on Thursday, which might make your getting 1MOA tough to do, if not impossible. Here is my very cheap cure, and one that I still do often as for some reason I HATE recoil. Find a big old fat padded leather glove or mitten, stick it in your shirt or even tape it (duct tape) to your rifle stock. I sounds stupid but it will work wonders and probably you have one lying around the house. No need to buy a new recoil pad, at least not right away. Once you are out hunting you won' t notice the recoil, but you will know that you are able to hit your target without flinching.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

You said that you were using " light magnum" cartridges. These shells will create more recoil. Use standard 150 grain 30-06, you should feel a difference.
Also, you mentioned shooting off of a concrete block. Your rifle will " bounce" to some effect from any hard surface. The sleeping bag isn' t the best either, a little too soft in my opinion.
Considering what you are using for rests, I' m impressed with your groups. Fill several old socks with dry sand and tie the ends shut. These work great. The sand is hard enough to get a solid rest from, but will GIVE when the gun fires and not cause the rifle to bounce.
Good luck, let us know how things work out for you.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I use to have a tendancy when shooting at the range to place the gun on the bone of my shoulder vs the crock, which makes for a painful experience after very few shots. I found a padded mitt or glove greatly reduce the effects and after effects, as was suggested previously, i would try this before buying a new recoil pad. If possible wear a jacket when shooting for added protection. Also sand bags are one of the best and cheapest rifle rest you can use, I use old coveralls legs and sleeves filled with play sand(can be found at any hardware/building store) and tie them off at each end. As stated this will keep your gun from bouncing and still offer a solid rest.

BTW your groups are good and considering your first rifle/year I would lean more to say they are exceptional. It takes time to get used to a rifle and also in time you' ll be become more accurate...don' t expect it on the first trip, keep practicing and results will be sure to follow.

Good luck on the range and in the field[8D]

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Reacher, this is only my opinion .......I think as a novice shooter, one can only do harm when firing 40 rounds in a session. It' s neither good for you or the rifle if the shots are taken without letting the barrel cool down. When you start getting beat up by recoil it will infact cause flinching and degrade your shooting ability.

People percieve recoil differently, I for one consider 06 recoil as insignificent while others find in painfull, it' s really a personal thing. You might even consider a smaller caliber such as a 243 Win.

Adding a good recoil pad, weight in the butt or forearm and installing a muzzle break all do their part in reducing felt recoil. Again, it' s a personal thing as to what you want to do.

This is all easy for me to say, but I have 35 years of shooting under my belt:)



double A



Reading the other post' s..........I have decided to try Handles suggestion. I pulled the recoil pad off of a single shot 300 WBY and attacted a welding glove to the butt stock with good ol duct tape. I think it gives that rifle the " L:eek::eek:K" . Notice how the stainless steel blends with the tape( maybe I should have went with black electrical tape?[&:])....... kind of classy dont ya think?;) That oughta do the trick on soaking up the recoil! I dont know how my friends are going to take it though[:o]

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

what about just getting out and shooting it about once a month or more often ? just shoot about 10 rounds or so to get your shoulder used to it. i think adding a pad to it might make the rifle alittle bit longer now depending apon the shooter.

now i did read a post about you shooting SST light mags. maybe you should stay away from the light mags and go with a NON-LIGHT MAG ?

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

doubleA,
I' m sitting here laughing my a$$ off. That' s very funny:D

How about another post! I' d like another good laugh. I' m a Jr High school teacher, and I could use some more humor!

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Is that tape and glove a factory option? [8D]

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Great photo double A!! It does look funny, but it works.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Use a ligher and cheaper cartridge (that is accurate for your gun) for sighting in and practice - both to reduce expense and recoil. Then, when you' re ready for hunting, just sight in your chosen ammo and you should be good to go. The practice of holding the gun and getting an accurate shot is the same regardless of the type of bullet or cost of the ammo.

After bore sighting, I' ve always had to start at 25 yds. Easier to get on paper, easier to zero, and it will be pretty darn close at 100. If you have a solid vise or rest, you can pretty much zero at 25 yds on the second shot: shoot first shot; leave gun in place; adjust scope so cross hairs are on actual impact point. Next shot, sighted at bullseye, should be very close. If you don' t have a vise, it will take you a couple of groups, but it' s much easier at 25 and should only take you a few groups. Then, I believe you' ll find it' s pretty close at 100 and should only take you a couple more groups to get it exactly as you want it.

By the way, this fall I had to remount my scope and used the " real" bore sight method (we don' t need no steenkeng lazer sighers) - put a small target on a wall about 40 feet away, squinted down the bore and then carefully adjusted the scope to match (I have a cheap $40 shooting/cleaning vise -you can make them out of wood too). When I got to the range, I was within a couple of inches at 25 yards right off the bat. Last year I did it without the vise and was still well on the paper at 25 yards. Both times it took me about 9 shots total to have it zero' d at 100.

As far as group size, remember that a little wind can make a ' significant' difference at 100 yds, especially if it' s a little flukey. I' m not talking about hunting significant, but target significant. If you' re getting 2 inch groups with a slight, but inconsistent breeze, you might find it' s a touch tighter on a still day, at least in my experience. Could make the difference between being satisfied with a particular cartridge vs. wondering why it' s inaccurate.

Also, you could find a different factory load is better (or worse). Last year I tried about 6 different types of factory loads of various weights and brands in my 30' 06, trying to stick first and foremost with those that are commonly available. There definitely was a difference. Best (using a vise, but with not great technique) was about 1- 1.25" at 100 yds, worst pushed 3 inches. For some reason, plain old Remington 180 gr PSP corelokt shot as good or better than anything, including plain and premium, from 150 - 180. But your 2 inches, as you say, is nothing to sweat a lot about, and without perfect stillness or a solid vise and perfect technique, it is a pretty good factory ammo group, imho.

My final recommendation is to use a segment of foam water pipe insulation for target range padding - the dark grey tubular stuff they sell in hardware stores to insulate domestic 3/4 inch water pipes . It is split lengthwise and you can easily slip it over the end of the butt of your rifle. It really eliminates recoil pain and has cured me of flinch. An added benefit is if you' re shooting in warm weather, but will be hunting in cold (with heavy coat), the front/back adjustment of the scope for eye relief will be better with the extra padding on the gun.

-zeke

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I bought a Sims limb-saver slip-on pad tonight. I put it on right over the stock pad. It is a bit longer, but I think I like it better that way. I am going to try and shoot again tomorrow and see how I do. Hopefully it will be enough to take care of me. Now I will just need a trigger job and I will be set.

Will try and put a pic of it up when the wife gets home with the digicam.

PS: My box stand has that tubular foam you are talking out on all the lower edges of my shooting windows. It should help with recoil and with protecting my gun finish.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I just bought a 25-06 and went out to shoot it yesterday. I was shooting 117 grain hornady SSTs. I ran 30 rounds through it and can' t even tell I was shooting today. It is a handi rifle with an ultra barrel synthetic stock with standard recoil pad. If I tried that with my 30-06 with white line 1 inch recoil pad shooting 165 grain Hornadys, I would be bruised today. Amazing what a difference 37 grains makes. I was wondering if my 30-06 with 125s would be the same. Anyone ever compare 25-06 with 120s or 117s to 30-06 with 125s? Just wondering if recoil is similar?

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Part of it is that you are shooting light magnums. Man, those things are HOT! I know you are shooting 150s but hornady advertises 180 grain at 3000fps. That is very hot for 30-06...

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Past, kick killer, kick eaze, limb saver...they all make good pads, either shoulder pads or butt-stock mounted pads.

Running 40rnds through it wasn' t really wise since you' re unfamiliar with high powers, especially since it hurt so badly, you' re probably going to flinch now when you go back out, causing really bad accuracy.

Since it beat you that badly, you might also look into recoil reducers, either have a gunsmith add lead to your stock in the proper places and amounts, or add a spring-mass or mercury recoil reducer, there' s nothing fun about shooting a rifle that beats the hell out of you.

Also remember to keep the rifle snug up to your body and keep your shoulder taut/firm, not totally relaxed or totally tense, just ready. Also, check out where you' re shouldering at, it kind of sounds like you might be too far away from yourself, your buttstock should fit right in the pocket b/w the shoulder head and pectoral head, too far out makes it hit more bone than muscle and joint.

What I think is curious, why do you shoot better at 200yrds than at 100yrds? You got 2" groups at 100yrds= 2MOA, when 3.5" groups at 200yrds is 1.75MOA, sure it' s a small improvement, but there' s no reason that 1.75MOA at 200yrds should come out of the same rifle you shot 2MOA at 100yrds with, your 100yrds should be equally good or better than your 200yrds, might look into that further, maybe the 3.5" groups were luck, or maybe you' ve got some other strange problem?

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

You are usually more susceptible to felt recoil when shooting from a bench. You bought a 30.06 for its abilities, so you don' t want to download the cartridge. When shooting many rounds from a bench with higher caliber rifles, I find that just slipping a small towel that has been folded several times in between the buttstock and my shoulder will suffice. In fact, it is quite comfortable. In an actual hunting situation, you will probably be wearing heavier clothing which will help. Have you fired the rifle offhand yet? Perceived recoil is lessened in offhand shooting. If you opt to have a recoil pad installed, make sure your gunsmith shortens the stock, or you will find it will be too long. As you shoot more and more, you will ultimately cease to think of a 30.06 as a heavy recoiling rifle. Good luck with your endeavor---the old ' 06 is as good as they come.

Clint

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I own a Remington 742 Semi-Auto .30-06 and I never had a problem with recoil, I shot 165 grain bullet and they didn' t hurt at all. I recently gave that gun to my younger brother and bought myself a Ruger M77 MKII 7MM Rem. Mag. and after 46 rounds at the range I had a swollen shoulder, made me want to go back to the .30-06!

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I have to agree with this also, I had a .270 bruise me up pretty good last year due to the bench being built so that the shooter was bent over forward too much. I had shot that .270 for a couple years then as soon as I started shooting at this new range I was feeling the recoil.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I would recommend some muscle. Not in the ammo, some standard 150 should do fine so getting that scope on. Then check out (maybe adjust a little for) your preffered higher powered hunt ammo.

The muscle? Put some of your shoulders. Overhead french curls and overhead presses will do wonders. Muscle tissue is MUCH MORE dense than, um, ahhhh, fat. Or worse yet, is no fat at all, bone. Ouch!

I don' t think I' ve shot more than 25-30 rounds at one time thru my old sporterized German Mauser at one range session. I don' t recall it ever being " painful" , even with the old steel butt. But then again I shoot ALOT of shotgun, lots of slugs even year-round.

Better work out this " issue" before there' s a deer in your sight.

Good luck.

Uncle Matt (in IL)

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I own 2 30-06 rifles, a Husky and an Enfield The husky is 8 lbs the Enfield is 9.5lbs. The Enfield is easier on the shoulder and just as accurate. the Husky has a nicer action but more of a kick after 20 or so rounds. By that time it is time to stop and clean the bore because the accuracy starts to go south. I was asking about a company called BP Tech. who claims in their ad to reduce recoil by 40% with no increase in noise. This would be good for me because my son will be shooting soon, but he has a fairly severe hearing imparement and the doctors say that even 1 blast from a magnaported or muzzle braked gun could do permenant damage to his ears. Another thing you might want to look at is the 7MM-08. With the research I have done this weapon has just about as good of performance with substancially less kick.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

I put the Limb-saver on over my current pad and it makes the stock a bit too long. I will have to remove the current pad and try it again. I realized that I started out holding the rifle wrong when I got in the shower the other night and had the worst bruise I have ever seen. It was right on the top/inside part of my bicep. It looks terrible, but doesn' t really hurt. The little hollow between my deltoid and my collarbone is still tender though. I bought a ballistic shooting bag and will be filling it up tomorrow. I think this should reduce the recoil greatly for range use. After the new pad is on correctly, I think my problem should be solved.

As for changing to a different round. I am not doing that for a while. I bought a case of 10 boxes of ammo so that I would get the same lot # and hopefully have a batch of ammo with the same shooting characteristics. I wanted to sight in once and not have to do it again for a long time. :)

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

If I was not going to do a lot of shooting with it I would just use the pad you bought.The deal is when you do shoot a deer with it you wont even feel the guns recoil or the report.;)

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

In addition to trying any of the other suggestions above...you might want to consider looking into a good shooting vest or jacket. Outlets like Gander Mountain or Cabela' s usually have a good selection, (and frequently gun specialty shops will carry them as well). Prices will generally vary from about $50. and up (as high as you' d care to go). These will have a pad placed on the " shooting shoulder" (usually right side-right handed) and will help reduce recoil even further. The jackets/vests are normally used for shotgunning....but work equally as well when range shooting rifles. Just insure the pad is placed properly to work when benching your rifle.

The nice thing about the vest/jackets is that they work in addition to whatever other solution (like recoil pad) you decide to use!

Best of luck!

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Update...

I went shooting last night and put 20 rounds through. I did manage to get 1moa and am pleased. The limb-saver slip-on pad worked great but I will have to remove the stock pad as having both of them makes me have to stretch my neck a bit to get in the right position for the scope. Can' t wait to hunt this weekend.

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Reacher,

Try going to a lighter bullet, a 125 or 150 will do the job on whitetails. I' ve been shooting a 30-06 since l972 and love it. Currently using a Ruger Model 77. I went to Colorado this year mule deer hunting and handloaded several boxes of 165 gr bullets for practice and the hunt. I believe the 150 would have done just as good a job on the mule deer. Winchester and Federal offer both the 125 and 150' s.

I also have a Wtby Vgd and it' s in the 300 win. mag., kicks like a horse, thats' s why I took the 30-06 to Colorado. I also took a Rem. Model 7 in 7mm-08 in case something happened to the 06, it to is a good whitetail rifle and caliber.

Dog1

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

Dog (or anyone else), I just got a handi rifle in 25-06 with the ultra barrel. With 117s it is very mild, much less kick than my 30-06 with 165s. I haven' t shot 125s from the 30-06 but I am guessing they are similar in recoil to the 25-06 117s? Or does the barrel diameter play a factor in recoil also or is it just the weight of the bullet?

RE: 30.06 = shoulder turned to hamburger
 

3.5" @ 200 is nothing to sneeze at! Most rifles won' t do any better, particularly with factory ammo, which I assume you were using!

If you start reloading, you can work up a load just for your rifle that will beat this!:D