Recommendations for kids rifle
 

My 6 year old is dead set on deer hunting this year, so I've been shopping around for the best rifle option for her. She's gotten pretty deadly with her BB gun and I plan on having her shoot my Ruger 10/22 next. However, it's been more than 5 years since I worked at the gun counter at Bass Pro, so I don't know if there is anything new out there. I sold a lot of the Youth H&R single-shot rifles when I worked there. I really like the fact that you can get a Rossi with 4 different calibers, but the gun itself seems pretty heavy. I've looked at a few youth model Remington's and Savages, but they still seem a little big. Any one have any opinions on a good first-time kid rifle. I would think a .243 would be best, but not opposed to a .223. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Nate

1st, what is legal in your state (caliber wise), not trying to ignite a caliber war here. Just what is legal.

2nd, is she old enough to have a license? If not, that ends it right there.

Yep, .243 would be best, I've killed over 200 deer with mine through the years...

If legal, a .223 or 22-250 will also get the job done...I used a 22-250 back in the 60s and 70s for population control on our farms...Blood trails were sparse but they didn't go far with lung shots and dropped with neck shots...Now that you can get a 60 gr Nosler Partition for them they are much more potent...My niece has used one for the past 10 years and I've seen the damage they do...With high shoulder shots, she gets exits and the deer drop...She has killed a couple of dozen with this setup and hasn't lost any...

Although I like the idea, I hunted with a young man a few years ago who carried one of the Rossis. It was unbelievably heavy, and he was miserable by the end of the first day.

I see young hunters at the range frequently, many of them reaching for all it's worth to hang onto an adult-sized rifle. With weight also a consideration, I think what I'd recommend first is finding a youth-sized platform. Most manufacturers offer some version of "youth" rifle, and some (like the Howa) may also come with an adult-sized stock for later.

Good advice to check your local laws before hunting with a .223. I personally prefer the .243. Recoil isn't usually intimidating, and although I have a number of chamberings to choose from now, it's the .243 that goes to the field after deer and pronghorns at my house. Other mild cartridges you might consider, but which are going to recoil a bit more (thanks to launching heavier bullets) are the 7mm-08 and .308.

Good luck!

I think you are on the right track. either of the three calibers mentioned above will work. My boys both started off with the rossi youth model in .223. They been shooting it since they were 5. Not too heavy and you can carry it into the woods for her.

I'm in Missouri and any center-fire cartridge is legal. So .223 and up will work. She can hunt starting at 6, so that's not a problem either. My question isn't so much with the caliber as it is with the actual gun. I'm trying to explore all my youth rifle options other than the Rossi, and scoped-bolt action rifles. I've heard that I may be able to get a Thompson Center in a youth model, but I'm sure that's gonna be heavy as well? Any other ideas on makes and models?

Thanks for the help,
Nate

Does it really matter if the rifle is heavy? If a child gets a shot it will most probably be from a solid rest in a blind. Weight may be a very good thing.

Yeah, more than likely I will be the one carrying it! I just don't want to buy something then, find out about a better option later. Getting 4 barrels with the Rossi may be the best bet for that price range, I'd say. I've got a few months to think about it, but if you think of any other models, please let me know.

Thanks,

Don't set up a young shooter for failure with a cheap gun with a bum trigger. (I noticed that New England Handi Rifle was mentioned in a previous post)

I'd go with a Rem Mod 7 in .243. And get the stock cut to fit right if necessary.

What kind of BB gun is your daughter shooting? I have a 6 year old girl and need to get her started.

It is the Crosman 760 Pumpmaster. See link below. It shoots BB's and/or Pellets. Seems to be a good little gun. I used it to teach her basic gun safety and technique. I just set a can on my bow target in the back yard. Since we live in city limits, I just have her pump it one time so the velocity stays pretty low. She started out rough, but now can hit the can every time, so I slowly move the target farther back for her.

Link to gun: http://www.amazon.com/Crosman-Pumpma...irls+air+rifle

I sighted in a Remington 700 ADL Youth rifle for a fellow about 6 years ago...That thing was unbelievable...With the 100gr Hornadys at 100 yards you could cover the group with a nickel...His girls ended up killing a few deer with it but what tickled me is he started using it...He is only about 5ft 6 or so, I'm 6ft 5...The stock fit him perfectly...

Well, he was an '06 man and decided to try the .243...Sure enough a 10 point walked out and he thought "Crap, I should have the '06"...Well he popped him, the deer ran off...He got down out of the stand, went to where the deer headed and there he laid...Funniest thing was him coming by the house with that deer and telling me how effective the .243 was on deer...

Not even sure if Remington still makes a Youth model but back then you could buy the Youth and if needed later could buy a Remington or after market stock as the kids grew...

The problem with Youth model Firearms...
 

As I see it, there are a few issues with buying Youth Model firearms, which shoe fits you is ultimately your own decision:

Buying an adult rifle that they might be able to use forever will cost more, and then you need to buy a replacement stock, costing even more. But at least they can use it forever, instead of leaving you with a "rock" sitting in the safe that nobody will use again until the next generation of kids, or trying to resell a youth model with limited market.

Buying a low end Rossi or Handi rifle will save you money up front, but likely means nobody will ever use it again. The trigger won't be real hot, but can be worked, then again you're adding expense to a cheap rifle. Fit and finish won't be fantastic, but serviceable. These single shot low end youth rifles usually lighter and more compact than a standard youth or featherweight bolt action would be. They also tend to have a muzzle heavy, somewhat awkward balance.

Again, if you're carrying it, it just needs to FIT them, not necessarily be light for them. My 5yr old nephew shoots my wife's Savage 12 heavy barrel rifle at water bottles, the extra weight helps keep him steady.

Personally, I plan to buy a .243win in a Savage or Rem 700, standard weight barrel, and a $100 boyd laminate stock, and chop down the pull. I'll add shims to the stock as the kids grow, then swap back to the factory stock once they're an adult.

Yeah, I do remember really pushing the Savage youth models when I worked at bass pro. They seemed like well made higher end guns for youth. I asked them about it a week ago and they didn't have any in stock. I may just have to shop around or see if someone can still order the Savage youth maybe w/ a synthetic stock. If I get that in a .243 then I'd say she'd be set and my boy can take it over when he gets older. Thanks again for all the help.

Nate

Thanks Nate!

Have you considered an AR platform with a collapsible stock? You could shoot .22, .223 and .308 - the .308 being fine for deer. The balance might be off with the lightweight butt stock but it would certainly be adjustable to fit your daughter's growing body.

JM2C

I ALMOST made this suggestion myself, but held my tongue for the following reasons:

Not every 6yr old kid is ready for a semiauto
Recoil in an AR-10 .308 is pretty stiff
AR platforms are a lot heavier than say, a bolt action
Hard to come by these right now, let alone the price for them

It's something to consider and not a BAD option by any stretch, but before you drop $1500-2000 on an AR-10 .308, it might be wise to have your little one take a test drive.

Real hard to beat the ol' Pumpmaster 760. We just started my 5yr old nephew shooting one of my old Pumpmaster 760's that I got as a kid. Rifle is almost 25yrs old and still clears pigeons out of the barn and puts rabbits in the pot just as it always has. If yours ever starts giving up pressure, a few drops of oil on the piston underneath the pump lever will have it running like new. (Or better yet, oil it regularly so you never let the seals dry up)

True. Is there a .270 upper that is made for the AR? That would have more punch than the .223.

My 8 year old daughter started on a Rossi Tri-fecta (22, 243, 20g) when she was 5 at the range and the single shot is a great starter rifle for learning to shoot. It was plenty accurate and allowed her to start with the 22 and then move up to the 243 using the exact same rifle. She never hunted with it, but in my opinion investing a couple hundred bucks on a starter rifle was well worth the investment to get her shooting and the flexibility to move up on the same frame.

When she was ready to start hunting (when she was 7) I bought her a Weatherby Vanguard youth stocked rifle in .243 (eventually I can upgrade the stock). She has got probably 200 rounds through it now and is ready to hunt. Before I let her hunt, the deal was she had to be able to put 5 shots in a row into a 7" paper plate at 100 yards...wouldn't you know it she put the first 5 shots she ever shot through the rifle into probably a 4" group? hahaha...off hunting we went. My niece also started on the Rossi and then a Weatherby Vanguard and was subjected to the same "5 shot test"...she also passed first time around!

For the $ a Vanguard is hard to beat...I did have to shorten the youth stock a little as my daughter is fairly small...

I would go for a 243 over a 223 just because of the margin of error on the 223 is a little greater...load that 243 with a 100g bullet like the Nosler Partition or Speer softpoint and knock em dead.

I would advise against an AR just because of the semi-auto platform and the challenges that can create for young shooters.

I honestly have no issues with the youth single shot rifles, have a couple of them and they shoot well enough for what they are.

Why would it need to be an AR10? I'm not advocating for an AR platform for several of the same reasons you do, but I would go AR15 in 223, and they can be had for under $800 now pretty easily.

I have seen lots of friends and family use the remington model 7 youth and has worked great and when they get older change to regular model 7 stock and they have a perfect smaller rifle or always keep pasing it down

Wasn't going to push the .223rem/5.56N as a recommendation. Not making any comment about my beliefs on the .223rem effectiveness on deer in general, but for a young hunter that might not have the best trigger control, shot placement, etc I'm not one to recommend the .223rem.

Which isn't to say there aren't other cartridge options in the AR-15 platform, a 6.8SPC AR-15 would make a FANTASTIC youth deer rifle cartridge (or adult for that matter). But again, all of the other reasons that it's not an ideal choice still apply. Even a 16" M4 carbine with a scope can end up in the 8-9lb range (mine is 11lbs including the bipod).

I am using a Rem .260 Mountain rifle for my daughters first big game hunt! It is small and fits her better then other guns I have. She shoots it well and can probably use it the rest of her life without changing much.

The AR platform is limited by the dimensions of the magazine well. A 5.56 AR will take the .204, .223, 6.5 Grendel (rare), 6.8 SPC, or .30 AR. An .308 AR will take the .243, 260, 6.5 Creedmoor, 7mm-08, .308, and I've even seen them in .300 WSM. .270 and .30-06 are just too long - pure and simple. Also - note that the upper and lower need to match - in other words, you can't pin a longer AR-10 lower to a shorter AR-15 upper, or a shorter AR-15 lower to a longer AR-10 upper to gain the "benefit" of more chambering possibilities as I've seen posts here suggest in the past.

(edit) - I've put my 7-year-old daughter behind an AR carbine recently. It's a sandbag/benchrest proposition for her. Collapsible stock is great, but handguards too wide for her to really hold onto. No way is she carrying it much farther than from the truck to the bench. I've also had her behind a CZ527 Varmint in .223. That combo seemed far more manageable, incorporating a bipod. For some reason, LOP on that stock is shorter than LOP on the other 527 American I have. She's fine with it, but it's even heavier than the AR - and almost as long as she is tall.

Appreciating all the great feedback! I do have a few AR's, and that would definitely be a possibility. I'm just not sure that is what I want her learning on initially. It's not a huge deal, but I'd like to start her on open sights, then go to the scoped bolt-action. After she becomes well adjusted to those, then I would think she would be comfortable enough to go to an AR. Maybe I'm just old-fashioned!(28) I like the thought of not dropping a ton of cash initially on the single-shot jobs. Then, if she doesn't freak out after her first kill... get her a nice youth bolt-action that has the option of an adult stock transition. And I'll always jump at the chance to get a new AR, so if she shoots that at the range and decides she is most comfortable with that, then daddy is getting a new gun!
Thanks again!
Nate

Nate if you worked the guncoutner for 5yrs then surely you noticed the bring backs and problems with the cheap single shots? Do her a favor and buy a QUALITY gun that she can keep for the rest of her life and one day actually let your grandkids kill their first deer with as well. For my boys I bought one the Model 7 youth synthetic. Not the cheap finish ADL 700 crapola Rem now builds but the truly blued, gray synthetic youth mdl 7 that they quit building for some reason! :s13: So as it came time for me to buy one for my youngest son (the mdl 7 like my oldest son has was since discontinued) I looked at the market and decided on the Weatherby Vanguard youth. (Both rifles are 243s) Both have 2x7x33 Nikon Monarchs on them and both will be around for the grandkids to hunt with. Both of my boys are now on to bigger rifles but their 243s are still there ready and willing should the need arise!

Somethings you just can't put a pricetag on! :wink:
HL

All great points...I too wouldn't recommend the .223 for the same reasons.

243 for a 5 year old? nate where you from?

RR

The AR platform is a soft shooting gun.

A .223 with a well constructed bullet will do the job, if placed right behind the ear.


Some of these young kids "can" shoot.


I like this for a truck gun and will work for kids also.

http://www.ruger.com/products/mini14...le/models.html


My biggest concern is that they are both autoloaders - although maybe just limit the amount of rounds in the magazine to start (safety precaution).

Yeah, the few years that I worked the gun counter, I honestly never had anyone bring back any of the single-shot guns. Not to say they weren't!

Missouri. She's 6 and a pretty big six year old. I wasn't just going to throw her a gun. I was going to work her up to that and see how comfortable she is come November.