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223 for deer?

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223 for deer?

Old 01-14-2013, 07:02 AM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by Topgun 3006
Shot placement is obviously very important, but poking a bigger hole through the heart/lung area will also insure a quicker humane kill most of the time with a properly expanding bullet. That's why the majority of states require a caliber bigger than the .223.
No it won't...Deer shot with my .243 drop just as quick at those with a .270, if the same type bullet is used...

One afternoon my brother and I shot the same deer with my .243 and his .270...Both shots went through the lungs and both would have been lethal...The deer still ran 75 yards or so before falling...

For the past 30 years we have killed 40-50 deer a year with various cartridges and we see no difference in size of bullet vs when the deer drops, it's all about shot placement...
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Old 01-14-2013, 07:32 AM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by nchawkeye
No it won't...Deer shot with my .243 drop just as quick at those with a .270, if the same type bullet is used...

One afternoon my brother and I shot the same deer with my .243 and his .270...Both shots went through the lungs and both would have been lethal...The deer still ran 75 yards or so before falling...

For the past 30 years we have killed 40-50 deer a year with various cartridges and we see no difference in size of bullet vs when the deer drops, it's all about shot placement...
Exactly! All deer act differently, caliber is not as important as shot placement. I have had more deer run off and have to be tracked with my 300RUM than with any gun I own, including my 223.
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Old 01-14-2013, 08:08 AM
  #63  
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Did you ever think that 300RUM put that bullet through the animal so fast that it didn't expand to do anything more that what the .223 did? You guys are unreal in that it's like you know nothing about ft/lbs of energy and using the proper caliber/bullet to take an animal as quickly as possible. Sure the small caliber will kill and sometimes pretty quick, but why do you think that the majority of states require certain minimum calibers for shooting various big game? Next thing we'll be hearing from fritz1 and others is that the .223 is fine for elk and big bears, LOL!
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Old 01-14-2013, 10:07 AM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by Topgun 3006
That's why the majority of states require a caliber bigger than the .223.
Originally Posted by Topgun 3006
why do you think that the majority of states require certain minimum calibers for shooting various big game?
"Someone" is making un-researched (and erroneous) proclamations about what the law is...

There are 43 states that allow rifle hunting for deer. Of those, 35 allow the .223.

Last edited by ipscshooter; 01-14-2013 at 10:12 AM.
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Old 01-14-2013, 11:00 AM
  #65  
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It all boils down to how and where you hunt IMO. I don't care for the lightweights one bit but I do know people that have used them successfully. If the 22 rimfire were legal to use for deer I'm sure there would be a certain segment of people that claimed they were awesome one shot deer killers too. A dead deer is a dead deer. That being said, I will always err on the side of caution and use plenty of gun and bullet for the job at hand. Never had one too dead but I have seen a few too alive.
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Old 01-14-2013, 11:12 AM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by nchawkeye
No it won't...Deer shot with my .243 drop just as quick at those with a .270, if the same type bullet is used.
9 times out of 10, that's probably true. On that 10th time, who knows, that little bit of extra power from the .270 might make a difference, and that's more likely if we're talking about a .223. I won't criticize anyone for using a legal gun, but I personally would go up a little bit (just bought a 7-08 for such things).
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:26 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by Murdy
9 times out of 10, that's probably true. On that 10th time, who knows, that little bit of extra power from the .270 might make a difference, and that's more likely if we're talking about a .223. I won't criticize anyone for using a legal gun, but I personally would go up a little bit (just bought a 7-08 for such things).

As I said, my experience has proved to me to be different...We own 3 farms, over 850 acres and have to harvest a lot of does to raise our corn, soybeans, peanuts and wheat...Over the past 30 years we have found that we need to take 40-50 deer a year...We bring in 10-15 hunters a year with some being experienced and some not...There are few calibers that have not been used...

With the proper bullet for it's caliber we simply don't see much difference in how far a deer runs...It's that simple...

With gut shot deer, a larger caliber is needed but if a fellow is flinching that bad sometimes a smaller caliber actually improves his shooting...

As far as what the regulations say.....Just consider who is making those rules and their experience level....
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:30 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by Topgun 3006
Did you ever think that 300RUM put that bullet through the animal so fast that it didn't expand to do anything more that what the .223 did? You guys are unreal in that it's like you know nothing about ft/lbs of energy and using the proper caliber/bullet to take an animal as quickly as possible. Sure the small caliber will kill and sometimes pretty quick, but why do you think that the majority of states require certain minimum calibers for shooting various big game? Next thing we'll be hearing from fritz1 and others is that the .223 is fine for elk and big bears, LOL!
I know how to select the proper bullet for the game I am using, Topgun. I dont use a bonded or partion bullet in a 300RUM for shooting deer, beleive it or not but the faster the velocity, the quicker a bullet expands. A bullet of the same design and weight shot from a 300RUM will expand more and penitrate less than the same bullet shot out of a 308 or 30-06.

Actually Topgun, the 223 is leagle here in Idaho for elk, moose and bear, ALL big game, Montana is the same. The biggest bull elk I ever seen shot was with a Ruger Mini 14 223. Not what I would use but it is leagle and people do use them. As far as bears go, I have shot bears out of a tree with a 223, with the right shot it is dead before he hits the ground.

Last edited by fritz1; 01-14-2013 at 12:37 PM.
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:38 PM
  #69  
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And by the way, a bullet doesn't move so fast it doesn't expand....They are just like cars, the faster they are moving when they hit something, the more damage is done...

Now, if a fellow is using a .300, chances are he may also be using a tougher bullet as the .300 would be more suitable for elk than deer...These bullets will zip through without mushrooming much because they are "harder", causing less internal damage...

That would not be bullet failure but hunter failure to use the proper bullet for the game he is hunting...
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Old 01-14-2013, 01:02 PM
  #70  
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I have looked into the various states that allow the .223 for deer and was surprised and stand corrected in that there are a lot that have evidently changed to allow those little pea shooters since the last I looked many years ago. Maybe that's because of the better ammo now available for the little peas shooters (Just kidding guys, LOL!). However, I think I was misunderstood in the last two posts regarding big calibers zipping through deer. That is exactly what I meant in that they are normally loaded with a style of bullet that is not designed to expand much until driving much deeper on bigger game like elk and moose than on deer. That would definitely be the shooter using an improper bullet for what it was designed---no argument there and what I was trying to say.

Jaag---I like your line of thought and that's all I've been trying to say every time this .223 topic comes up!

Last edited by Topgun 3006; 01-14-2013 at 01:05 PM.
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