TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
07-26-2003, 01:52 PM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 2,175
TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
just got back from shooting a box of 225 gr hornadys through my winchester model 70. its not doing too good on paper. i cant get a group out of it at all and i dont think its the scope or the gun. i had the gun bore sighted but i think the flinch factor is a problem. does anyone have a recommended idea for a recoil tamer that doesnt look too goofy and works ? im a big guy but i must say the recoil is pretty nasty. didnt want to go with a boss system or porting due to the increase in noise.
07-26-2003, 03:08 PM
#2
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: East Central Wisconsin
Posts: 162
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
I just bought a .338 this past December and have been shooting it quite a bit in preperation for an upcomming Elk hunt. I too, am a large individual, 6' 0" 200#. While the recoil of the .338 is more noticeable than with my old ' 06, I do not feel it is overly punishing. You say you have been sighting in with 225 grain Hornadys and are not happy with their performance? I tried them as well and did not get very good groupings from them. I might suggest trying a different brand/weight of bullet/ammunition. Each individual rifle will have a favorite load. Best groups came from Federal 250 grain High Energy Noslers. I assume you will be hunting Elk, Moose or Bear with such a large caliber so the 250 grain would be a good bullet weight for you. The 250 is also not as prone to wind drift as a lighter bullet giving you better accuracy. I have the BOSS system on my rifle, so perhaps the recoil from my rifle is less severe. Here are a few tips. Make sure your rifle is FIRMLY seated on your shoulder in the correct position. If you need it, Cabelas sells Recoil Pads and Recoil Decelerators (Pg. 582 Fall catalog). I might also suggest not shooting a full box of ammo at the range each time you go out...remember this is a high powered rifle, not some .243. As a last resort, you could also have an aftermarket muzzle brake installed on your rifle. I know you said that you didn' t go with porting/Boss due to noise, but if you can' t shoot your rifle properly, being quieter won' t do you much good! Hope this helps. Good shooting.
07-27-2003, 07:35 AM
#3
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 411
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
Get a Decelerator pad. There are many different sizes for the various 70' s so make sure you get the right one. The triple mag pad works well also, but you probably have some fitting to do. The recoil tables say the .338 has about 30 lbs of recoil, which isn' t too bad. Have a qualified person take a look at how you are shooting, that could be part of the problem.
07-27-2003, 08:34 AM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 2,175
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
my normal hunting rifle is a 30-06 and i regularly shoot slugs from my 12 gauge . this model 70 still kicks like a mule compared to them. my shoulder is still hurting. it was probably around 85 degrees so that may have added to the kick. i would hate to have to wear a shoulder pad so im gonna try one of those limb saver recoil pads cause i think what winchester uses for a recoil pad looks cheesey. as for the ammo i couldnt pass on it i got a couple boxs at 21$ each and i was told that the 338mag wasnt supposed to be picky with ammo just like the 30-06. i went with the 225 gr because i plan on using it for bear as well as deer and someday for moose. i also seen some kind of spring contraption that fits inside the stock i think outers makes it.
07-27-2003, 08:59 AM
#6
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: fort mcmurray alberta canada
Posts: 5,667
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
Get a decellerator and use lighter bullets such as the 210gr partition as they do provide less recoil.Only get a muzzlebrake if you intend to hunt with hearing protection in place at all times.
07-27-2003, 02:13 PM
#8
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Rocky Mountains, Colorado
Posts: 1,964
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
liquid,
Being big in body is NOT the key ingredient to being able to handle the recoil of mid-bores like the 338WinMag or big-bores like the 458 and up -- it can help (a little) but not much. A 338 mag at 35 pounds at 15 fps is not much of a kicker -- something is out of whack with either technique or fit or some past injury that you may be " getting away with" on small bores but not with your mid-bore.
I' ll address flinch, but let' s not ignore that it could be a loose/damaged scope or some gun " issue" . Also, these techniques may or may not reduce aggravation of a pre-existing injury.
RECOIL/COMFORT AND CONTROL TECHNIQUES:
1. Does your stock fit you? -- Do you know what good stock fit is?
2. Good eye relief (3.5/4.0 inches) with scope set well forward?
3. What' s your trigger pull? -- Over 4 kinda heavy (which means you will suffer anticipation as you are pulling the trigger, Under 2 is too light (can go off before you really expected it).
4. Decent recoil pad? (Try a slip on one over whatever you have as an experiment)
5. Do you wear a " over your shirt" shoulder recoil pad for bench rest?
6. Go with VERTICAL posture at your bench rest, DON' T bend down in the classic " hunched over" bench rest stance to where you have little flexibility so you get hammered down your spine, rather sit with your spine straight up and down with your belly touching the bench' s edge -- now, your body can " whip" with the recoil a little bit instead of getting hammered.
Yes that means you' ll be " different" at the range -- you' ve got a 338, you are already different. I' ve carried in a smallish stout card board box to get the elevation I wanted - figure it out at home using a card table BEFORE you go to the range. If the range limits you to 2 sand bags then bring 6 or 7 of your own sand bags -- build a perfect rest. If you can shoot on private land, then bench shoot over the pickup hood standing up. (This isn' t a light small bore you' re playing with)
7. Fast squeeze (or pull) - practice squeezing the trigger " fast" (i.e. NOT slow) without moving things, a trigger finger with a " near right angle" in it is better than one that snakes straight back towards the grip, the " right angle" can fast squeeze/pull without affecting grip whereas the " snakes stratight back" one can affect your grip and move the stock and hence your barrel. Taking a long time to fire is NOT beneficial to accuracy -- when the cross hairs are on the bullseye immediately go to the fast squeeze on the trigger and SHOOT -- if you don' t accomplish it before the cross hairs waiver off target, then stop look up and start the whole process over from scratch -- shots that take forever are a sign something is wrong -- and is poor training for hunting realities.
FLINCH DETECTOR:
Have some one else load single rounds into your gun for you and hand it to you (safety on) only instruct them to sometimes put a cartridge in and sometimes don' t put a cartridge in (60%) -- it will be painfully clear if you are flinching when you dry fire it once or twice.
INSTANT FELT RECOIL REDUCER:
Find someone with a rifle a couple notches bigger than the one you have -- say a 416. Fire a few rounds through it (offhand standing up), then yours will feel nice and comfy by comparison when you return to it. This sounds silly but it does work and it' s quick!
COOLING:
After 3 rounds let your rifle cool back down with the action open. Play with something else while you wait, I recommend a light small bore and practice your mid-bore technique.
Never Go Undergunned,
EKM
Being big in body is NOT the key ingredient to being able to handle the recoil of mid-bores like the 338WinMag or big-bores like the 458 and up -- it can help (a little) but not much. A 338 mag at 35 pounds at 15 fps is not much of a kicker -- something is out of whack with either technique or fit or some past injury that you may be " getting away with" on small bores but not with your mid-bore.
I' ll address flinch, but let' s not ignore that it could be a loose/damaged scope or some gun " issue" . Also, these techniques may or may not reduce aggravation of a pre-existing injury.
RECOIL/COMFORT AND CONTROL TECHNIQUES:
1. Does your stock fit you? -- Do you know what good stock fit is?
2. Good eye relief (3.5/4.0 inches) with scope set well forward?
3. What' s your trigger pull? -- Over 4 kinda heavy (which means you will suffer anticipation as you are pulling the trigger, Under 2 is too light (can go off before you really expected it).
4. Decent recoil pad? (Try a slip on one over whatever you have as an experiment)
5. Do you wear a " over your shirt" shoulder recoil pad for bench rest?
6. Go with VERTICAL posture at your bench rest, DON' T bend down in the classic " hunched over" bench rest stance to where you have little flexibility so you get hammered down your spine, rather sit with your spine straight up and down with your belly touching the bench' s edge -- now, your body can " whip" with the recoil a little bit instead of getting hammered.
Yes that means you' ll be " different" at the range -- you' ve got a 338, you are already different. I' ve carried in a smallish stout card board box to get the elevation I wanted - figure it out at home using a card table BEFORE you go to the range. If the range limits you to 2 sand bags then bring 6 or 7 of your own sand bags -- build a perfect rest. If you can shoot on private land, then bench shoot over the pickup hood standing up. (This isn' t a light small bore you' re playing with)
7. Fast squeeze (or pull) - practice squeezing the trigger " fast" (i.e. NOT slow) without moving things, a trigger finger with a " near right angle" in it is better than one that snakes straight back towards the grip, the " right angle" can fast squeeze/pull without affecting grip whereas the " snakes stratight back" one can affect your grip and move the stock and hence your barrel. Taking a long time to fire is NOT beneficial to accuracy -- when the cross hairs are on the bullseye immediately go to the fast squeeze on the trigger and SHOOT -- if you don' t accomplish it before the cross hairs waiver off target, then stop look up and start the whole process over from scratch -- shots that take forever are a sign something is wrong -- and is poor training for hunting realities.
FLINCH DETECTOR:
Have some one else load single rounds into your gun for you and hand it to you (safety on) only instruct them to sometimes put a cartridge in and sometimes don' t put a cartridge in (60%) -- it will be painfully clear if you are flinching when you dry fire it once or twice.
INSTANT FELT RECOIL REDUCER:
Find someone with a rifle a couple notches bigger than the one you have -- say a 416. Fire a few rounds through it (offhand standing up), then yours will feel nice and comfy by comparison when you return to it. This sounds silly but it does work and it' s quick!
COOLING:
After 3 rounds let your rifle cool back down with the action open. Play with something else while you wait, I recommend a light small bore and practice your mid-bore technique.
Never Go Undergunned,
EKM
07-27-2003, 02:33 PM
#9
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Rockford Michigan USA
Posts: 1,344
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
Maybe your barrel was overheating and thats why you weren' t getting good groups. 85 degrees is pretty hot. My friend said he was shooting in the 80s out of a very accurately sighted in rifle and after a couple shots his barrel go hot and his groups started opening up.
07-27-2003, 08:20 PM
#10
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 411
RE: TAMING A 338 WIN MAG HELP!
Hi LiquidOrange:
I am going to chime in here and say ELKampMaster is right.
Body size has little correlation with felt recoil. I am 5' 7" , 160, and EKM had me shooting skeet (on the ground) with 500 NE at 50 yds. Prior to that, we shot a bunch of skeet with .458 win mag.
The .458 did not fit me AT ALL. I had at least 2 feet of muzzle jump. The .500 fit me well, as did EKM' s .416 Rigby. The Rigby had a bigger punch than either, but because of fit, was not painful, at all. Much of this was done offhand.
I can think of better things to do than shoot a box of .338 off a bench. I don' t care what anyone on this board says, you aren' t going to have a pleasant day shooting boxes of .338 off the bench, regardless of the recoil pad or your shooting skill or pain threshold. Have someone take a peek at your shooting, get her sighted in and get off that bench.
I am going to chime in here and say ELKampMaster is right.
Body size has little correlation with felt recoil. I am 5' 7" , 160, and EKM had me shooting skeet (on the ground) with 500 NE at 50 yds. Prior to that, we shot a bunch of skeet with .458 win mag.
The .458 did not fit me AT ALL. I had at least 2 feet of muzzle jump. The .500 fit me well, as did EKM' s .416 Rigby. The Rigby had a bigger punch than either, but because of fit, was not painful, at all. Much of this was done offhand.
I can think of better things to do than shoot a box of .338 off a bench. I don' t care what anyone on this board says, you aren' t going to have a pleasant day shooting boxes of .338 off the bench, regardless of the recoil pad or your shooting skill or pain threshold. Have someone take a peek at your shooting, get her sighted in and get off that bench.