If its true, that you carry an MS or even a simple BS in engineering, you would know thats not true. Being a true scientist or engineer in the field is a lot more. If you were an engineer, you would know about patent writeups. You would know about scientific conferences, and white papers. You would understand about sponsoring and auditing post docs. But this would be if you actually carried an MS or more.

Tad more than simply a student. But one would have to be an engineer to understand this. Savvy?

As a high school science teacher and a community college math professor, I thought that this reply was excellent.

wow guys seems every post I make gets everyone in an uproar. Alot of students will tell you the basic level English and math classes are the worst. I have As in welding tech classes plus a few design autocad classes. It is alot harder to write a A+ paper then do a list of designs on autocad. I think my big problem is not giving enough study time or homework time. It will change every soon. I also think the early classes math, English, so on are the weed out classes. I know a few kids who have all the core degree class done. The welding class and the auto classes done but are on the 5th semester retaking basic english and math. English

bigtim6656,
I meant no disrespect and didn't want to sound preachy, but I just know these things to be what works. I think you've got guts for approaching your teacher, and don't ever forget how useful it was for you. Most teachers will work with you if they see the effort, and you will certainly catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

Teach Deer,
Thanks ... as a 34 year veteran public school teacher and counselor in Michigan I repeat those same adages (above) well over a couple hundred times per year. I know they work for everybody ... but not everybody tries the suggestions.

To students everywhere, enjoy your break and gird your loins for next semester!

Well, you're going to have to forgive me if I sound unimpressed. For, I am unimpressed.

No, no MS - in Engineering, that is. A brief period of my career in the military involved sifting through piles of work provided by statisticians, accountants, and yes - engineers. Those white papers? Who do you suppose reads those? Why, I did. Who do you suppose had to collate all that "stuff" and brief the guy with the checkbook? Patent writeups were not my responsibility, nor would any of the other "duties" you seem to be convinced that EVERY Engineer would perform. Of course, "engineering" was not my role then, either. I abandoned my undergraduate field in favor of something more rewarding. If you've ever worked outside your narrow field (Electrical, by chance?), you'd know how incorrect your assertions are. Savvy? JAFE.

Beyond that, it remains rather obvious that your academic career focused on earning a diploma. Maybe your institution didn't require grad students to take on a role in academic advising? That would explain the lack of depth in your advice here to Tim. Stick with being an engineer. Your arrogant manner otherwise stinks - and makes those scriptures you quote seem just a little facetious.

I remain, unimpressed.

Now that I'm completely distracted - finally some constructive advice! Well said, 8mm/06 and Teach.

Tim, those basic classes are not typically hard at all or "weed out classes" i just finished college in May...problem is, who wants to write a paper when they can play on autocad when that is what they enjoy doing and what they THINK is more important to learn and become good at?

i found my wildlife classes to be VERY easy, but they were much more intensive and muuuuuch more difficult than any of those "basic" classes...were talkin 20+ page research papers and projects for wildlife management and ecology classes that had to be dang near perfect just to get looked at and taken seriously for a grade...after a 2 grammer mistakes you dropped a letter grade each time...most of those basic classes, i hardly wrote anything even though they were english and writting classes...

those "basic classes" gave me the foundation and skills to complete those big research papers...they gave me what i needed to get through college...you can go back and look at my transcripts...i think i got 1 B in the major..rest was all A's..anything else was hit or miss..A's-C's..its just tougher to devote time to those basic classes because at the time, they seem useless...but take it from me, do well in them and take all you possibly can from them...make those english and writting teachers your friends...i recieved help from them many times in writting papers for my major classes...

those basic classes also can seem difficult because they are typically a class with more students, less hands on stuff, and by the end of the course, most of those professors dont even know your name compared to your major classes which are usually smaller...

your years at college fly by and you cant go back and change what you did or didnt do...take it from me....take everything you possibly can from each and every class...as useless as it may seem at the time, theres something to be taken from EVERY class...devote time to each and every one of them...take good notes...do good work...study hard...you'll be glad you did in the end of it all...even if that means not heading to the woods to hunt, although that seems like a huge sacrafice, take it from me, missing hunting time those couple years of college will lead to a better education and a better job in the end of it...fail college and you might never have the time and money to hunt...

take your love for hunting as a motivation to get good grades and to get your work done...thats honestly how i motivated myself...it can be hard to have such self discipline, but i would NOT let myself head to the woods to hunt or fish till ALL my work on my list was done and i was SURE i was caught up on studying....i missed the rut in bow season one year for training that i may never use, but it already helped me land jobs just because its on the resume...you gotta treat college as a full time job...its easy to say and think about...but you gotta devote the time AFTER class...you cant be happy with just "passing a class" you gotta raise your goals..that GPA is more than a couple numbers that noone looks at...ive been asked about it in interviews and almost all my applications want transcipts..

good luck Tim....from what ive read, id say you gotta change your view on college before it goes down the crapper...believe me...if you could dig up some of my posts about college 4 years ago, you'd see i complained about some of those "useless" basic classes that i thought was a money scam...the guys on here told me the same things i told you (in alot less words...) and i found it to be VERY true...without doing well in those classes, i wouldnt have done well in college...

I have the solution to your problem kid. Stay off the friggin internet. If you spent half the time doing work as you do plunking on the computer, you might get somewhere. Instead you choose to be fight some battle that you'll never win with college.

IF YOU CAN'T READ OR WRITE YOU WILL LOOK LIKE AN IDIOT, AND BE THOUGHT OF AS SUCH

Problem with most of the snot nosed kids your age is that think they know everything. Fact is, you don't know schit from shinola, and never will. A monkey could run Auto-Cad. Just follow the manual. Imagine that..... its written in plain English.

Thanks, this clears up what I was thinking and explains your point of view. I appeciate it.

And no, those are not what we call white papers in the engineering world. Go to OSA or IEEE website or pick up a IEEE peer reviewed journal, and that will explain what a "white paper" is. One thing for sure, I am not impressed but extremely amused.

If it was me, I suggest not worrying so much about being impressed or unimpressed, its really a moot point in the real world and does not increase joy or payscale. And besides, this is a guns forum. Just a free piece of advise.

Is it not apparent why engineers are such a pain to work with?