Magnum haters?
 

Looking back, I got my first dozen deer with a Marlin 30-30. Then I moved up to the 30-06, and later a shotgun. Sometimes I used a .270, and I've taken deer and hogs with all these guns and various muzzleloaders and bows and never had a problem. I never saw myself as a "magnum guy". But one day shortly after enlisting in the service I found out my first duty station would be in South Dakota, so I pondered the idea of getting a new rifle specifically for elk hunting. I thought about a .280 but after talking to some people who hunted elk every year I bought a Browning A-Bolt in .300 win mag. Upon returning to my home at that time (Alabama) I was almost scared to shoot it. I was sure that everything I had heard about it was true and that it would knock me around and almost certainly cause hearing loss even with ear plugs and I would probably flinch at the sound of loud noises for years afterward... But it wasn't true at all.

I'm not a large guy, I stand 5'8" tall and about 135 pounds. Yet, the .300 seemed no different in recoil then my Model 70 in 30-06. The noise was also of no concern with ear plugs in either. And an even bigger shock to me was that even though the rifle was much longer than any other rifle I've shot before, the stock seemed to fit me perfect and was as comfortable to shoot as my old 30-30. So it's no surprize that the accuracy I obtained with it was better than with any other rifle I've owned. Right then and there Ipicked that Browning as my main rifle for everything bigger than a coyote and have since taken 14 big game animals with it ranging from hogs and antelope to elk and couldn't be happier.

The reason for telling this short story is because I know there are others out there like me. And my question is, why do people automatically think that because someone's main deer rifle is a magnum, that means they can't shoot worth a darn? That they use the extra power and flat trajectory as a substitute for talent? Why do people think that others shoot a magnum because they can't kill deer with anything less? I originally bought my magnum with the thought of elk in mind, but stayed with it because of the accuracy.

Why is it that people say that if you shoot a deer with a .300 win mag you're going to blow a deer in half or something to that effect? I've never experienced that, and the meat damage is not much different than shooting a 30-06.

In short, my .300 doesn't cause much more meat damage than a '06, is just as sweet to shoot, and is more accurate at longer ranges, why is this a bad thing?

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Good post wiggy,First deer I ever shot was with an old .30 carbine.Got a .243 and thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread.Over the years I shot just about everything and anything with my most favorites being the .264 win.mag ,25-06,and my go to the 7 rem mag.I can shoot my old model 70 in 7mm rem. mag. as good or not better than anything I have ever had my hands on.I am sure most here will agree it's not so much the caliber but the gun in the way it fits and feels.But I am going to get me some other kind of 7 that shoots a 140 grain with about 9,817 grains of powder behind it.[8D]

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Good post. I own a lot of different rifles. I trade them and sell them from time to time. The only one that is never for sale or trade is my Remington 300 ultra mag. It is my go to gun.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

For years I was always a non magnum, sub .30 cal guy. I shot a bunch of deer and other game animals with the 243 and 270. Then one day I got a deal on a Ruger 77 300 win mag I just couldn't pass up. I had that rifle for a few years and shot bear and some deer with it. It shot pretty good and was a well made rifle, but I just despised the 3 position safety. (just me)
I traded it in on a 325 WSM that I use for anything bigger than deer. I also have a 45-70 Guide Gun which is my go to bear rifle.
I am not a magnum hater and feel they do have their place. But I still like my 270 and 7-08s for deer sized game.
However my next magnum is going to be a big one. I am leaning toward the browning stainless stalker in 375 H&H.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

For the man that's willing to put in the time required to get absolutely deadly with a rifle,it don't matter what cartridge it takes,it's skill of shooter behind rifle. For the guy that only has 1 rifle for a do-everything gun-magnums make sense if he plans to shoot bigger game as well as deer. For deer,a magnum is simply not neccecary. If you're deadly accurate with your rifle-who gives a flip wether it's chambered for magnum or not-certainly not me,nor should others pass judgement on you. The thing I have against SOME hunters toting magnums-NOT the actual rifles themselves,is when they attempt to subsitute firepower for marginal shooting/hits on game. They grip rifle in deathgrip,wince,and yank trigger,then wonder where in tarnation the bullet went. Even worse,they claim deer are bulletproof and run off from "regular" bullets simply bouncing off. We've all seen these people in camp or on range but thankfully they are few. Those are the people that give magnums a bad name.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I am not a magnum hater, but for most purposes, a standard round will do everything most people need a rifle to do. For example, I am convinced that you'd do just as well shooting elk with a 180 or 200-grainer in .30/'06 as with a .300 Win. Mag. I used a .270 for three years in Alaska, and never felt undergunned. But yes, I avoided provokingKodiak bears with it!!

"Why is it that people say that if you shoot a deer with a .300 win mag you're going to blow a deer in half or something to that effect? I've never experienced that, and the meat damage is not much different than shooting a 30-06."

This is a dead givaway that the '06 is good enough. See, the damage to the critter is about the same. And it is this DAMAGE that kills 'em, after all..........

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I'm not a magnum hater either, it's just that many people buy them only to impress their buddies. Many I see bring them to my small range can't shoot them worth a damn, but can do quiet well with a 243 or 308 class gun.
Then comes the price of ammo and reloading components, at over $20 per lb for powder it takes about twice as much to load a single 300 ultra as it does for a round of 308 win. Here in Alabama the 300 ultra has no real advantage either.
In an area where larger game and 400 yd shots are common the large magnums have a realistic place but only if the rifle shooter can handle them well. A lung shot deer will die much quicker than a gut shot one will even if it's a fifty BMG round that hits the gut.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I am by no means a magnum hater as I have a couple myself andI love to shoot and hunt with them.

However I see the same scenario all the time. Someone comes into the store andwants a new deer rifle or is buying a son their first deer rifle. Keep in mind that I am in Florida and a 160 pound deer is pretty danggood size. I suggest a .243, .308, 7mm-08, .270 or something similarand I get to hear the stories of how the________ cartridge (usully the .243 or .270)is crap and does nothing but wound deerand they want something with more "knock down power". They have seen too many deer not found because of the _____. So they end up buying a magnum of some kind, usually a 7mm or .300, and off to the woods they go. I think about how they can't shoot a .243 or .270 accurately but theybuy a .300in an attempt to make up for their lack of shooting ability whether they know it or not.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I am not a magnum hater either! But once I was cured of "Magnumitis," I realized that for deer sized game, a .243 or 25-06 kills 'em just as dead, just as fastas a Super-Duper- Whopper-Stopper-Magnum!
It has nothing to do with meat damage, as Eldeguello said a well placed magnum shot won't ruin any more meat than a standard caliber.
With the cost of ammo, recoil, and given that MOST people shoot better with lighter calibers, there really is such a thing as "overkill!"

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I have watched literally thousands of shooter's over the years at the bench. And I can say that I have noticed one trait in all the shooters at the bench. And it is a simple trait. They either know how to shoot or they DO NOT. This ability has nothing to do with what type of firearm, or cartridge they are shooting. The biggest problem I see with people who advocate a 243 over a 30-06 or a magnum is that they automatically assume a shooter will shoot a 243 better than the larger cartridge, and that is just WRONG. They will not shoot any firearm better until they are properly instructed as to how to shoot.

Now if a person is properly instructed on how to shoot then recoil can become an issue if they are sensitive to the recoil. Now if that is the case then there are a lot of ways to tame down the recoil of any firearm. Or you can choose to shoot a lighter cartridge.

But to say that a 243 is every bit as effective in "Killing Power" as a 300 magnum is just wrong. The old argument about "Dead is Dead" is wrong. If a person hunts and shoots a lot, then there will be times when the extra firepower may help. And if you "Know How To Shoot" then the magnum is no real issue, and can be helpful for the occasional bad shot.

And please do not tell me that nobody has taken or made a bad shot. Anybody who has spent times in the woods and shot deer has made mistakes, I do not care how careful you are, it happens even to the best shooters. And that is where the "Magnum" comes in. The "Magnum" can make up, and has made up for some "Shooters" mistakes. Tom.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

"They will not shoot any firearm better until they are properly instructed as to how to shoot. "

No-one can dispute this fact!:D

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I think you hit the nail on the head, Tom.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I dont have a thing against magnums. I even own a couple...but I see tons of what bigbulls is talking about. If I ever have to hear another "270 is a crippler" or the "270 bounces off deer" again though Im gonna puke! LOL

RE: Magnum haters?
 

This is one of the best posts I have read on here. I love my 7mm rem mag. And yet if I mention that I shoot one people think that it is overkill and I should get a 30-06 nothing against the 06 but I just dont like them. I love my mag. I got it dialed in its light and reliable.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

When I said most people shoot a lighter caliber better, it goes without saying that they know how to shoot to begin with! I stand behind that statement 100%! Also, at normal deer hunting ranges +/- 300 yards, I have never seen a deer that would have been any deader with a magnum than one that was shot by a .243 or similar cartridge!
Agree with the above or not, I think all here would or shouldagree with this: magnums do not make up for poor shooting/shot placement!

RE: Magnum haters?
 

But here in lies the rub. Most hunters do not know how to shoot.

And if your assumption is right, and they do know how to shoot, then they certainly should be able to handle the magnum. Tom.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I can not agree with that one. Let me see, a deer shot in the guts with a 85 grain 243 pill or a deer shot in the guts with the 300 magnum?? No doubt, I will take the one shot in the guts with the 300 magnum. He will be laying right there. Shot in the guts with a 243 or even lesser cartridge.......... Well who knows where he is.

I have seen too many poorly hit deer to believe that a light cartridge does as much damage as a magnum cartridge. It just is not true. The light cartridge will not do as much damage. It is really that simple. And as I said, even the best shooters make a mistake from time to time. So a magnum is a definite advantage. Especially to a person who knows how to shoot.

I am not advocating that a poor shot would hunt with a magnum to make up for the inability to shoot. But I am definitely saying the magnum will do considerably more damage. Tom.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I think that you may be mischaracterizing people who don't think that magnums are the right or necessary tool for every job as "haters." I dislike the very term "hater," because it's so often used to label and shut down anyone who disagrees with another's point-of-view (think homosexual "marriage"). If you don't agree with it, you're labeled a "hater" which dismisses your viewpoint from any further discussion or consideration... but I digress.

I'm of the mindset that too many people choose a magnum for all the wrong reasons. They buy one for bragging rights, they buy one because bigger MUST be better, or they buy one to compensate for pi$$-poor marksmanship skills thinking that the mag will kill the deer lightning-strike dead no matter how they hit it. I also think that many have this mindset that the old standards just can't cleanly kill a deer anymore. An opinion that has been well nurtured by gun and ammo makers who want to set the next big trend, and the gun writer "experts" that fawn over every super-duper blast-o-matic that the gun makers send them for their glowing reviews. I've also heard a lot of guys justify the magnum by pointing to the possibility, however remote, that they might go out west one day. My view is that, unless you have the trip planned and the money to spend, don't buy a bigger than necessary cartridge based on what you might do years from now, but rather pick the right tool for the hunting you're going to do the most of right now. If the opportunity presents itself in the future to book a $5-10K hunt for mixed big game in Utah or Alaska, chances are you'll have the cash to get the bigger rifle such hunting may call for.

Now, as I've said before and I'll say again. Magnums have their place. If you have a genuine need for the extra power and velocity, and you're willing to put the effort into developing your ability to shoot one well, which is a tougher task more prone to bad habits than with a lighter cartridge, then more power to you. But for me, I have no need for such power. My .30-06 will do all I need it to on anything I can forsee myself hunting in the future. I was once bitten by the magnumbitis bug, and I've owned everything up to a 300WSM and 7mm STW. But as I've been getting older, and hopefully a little wiser, I realized that I had no need for that much firepower, nor did I enjoy spending time at the range with them. Since I've been moving back down the firepower spectrum, because I also want to enjoy shooting my rifles beyond the few shots I might take in the woods at game every year.

Mike

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Most of the areas I have to hunt these days are long, narrow farm fields and CRP fields. Picture a powerline but without the utility poles. Or I hunt public land. In either case, the magnum has flat out done everything I ever wanted in a gun. I get flat trajectory for long range shots, and the knock down power to drop deer on the spot. Rarely have I ever had one run more than a few feet. I could push my 30-06 to it's limits, or I can use my magnum and make the same shot look easy.

I bought the gun to use out west on elk, mulies, antelope, and hogs.It worked amazingly well for that. Now, I'll probably never have another opportunity to hunt out west again, but does that mean that I should stop using the same gun? I think not. My .300 can do everything my 30-06 can do and more. Why mess with a winning combonation?

RE: Magnum haters?
 

yea if u dont want to mess with a winning combination, just shoot a 30-06. its been around alot longer than the 300 will be and the 30-06 will always be around no matter what. A cartridge as good as the 30-06 doesnt last for over a 100 years without being really good at killing big game.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

307 yards? Dang Ridge you musta used open sights that close :D

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I'm a big fan of the magnums. I've spent weeks upon weeks worth of range time and thousands of rounds over the last 15 yrs becoming proficient with them, and their killing power is obvious whenever I have occasion to pull the trigger on something other than a sheet of paper (not very often lol, much better/more dedicated shooter than hunter). But they have their place, and the gun rack of the once a year just to check sight in shooter is generally not it. But to discount them solely on the fact they sport a belt or burn more than 55 or 60 grains of powder is non-sense. Assuming proficient shooters, I think this, like about 98% of everything in this world, comes down to good old fashioned personal choice.

Range...whats that rig your sporting there? Looks very clean.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Nice shooting Ridge! I shot a buck about a week an half ago at a lasered 516 yards with my 7mm Rem Mag, with a 120gr Barnes TSX cranked hot. The bullet went thru the on-side shoulder blade and exited thru the last rib on the offside. The deer was dead before he hit the ground. :)

The thing I like about my 7mm, is no matter the shot angle I know I'll get the bullet to penetrate end-to-end on our big bodied deer!

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Yeah I reckon that one will do the trick on out there. Is that a 3 groove Lilja per chance? Got a few buddies experimenting with those with some hi-stepping rounds, albeit not quite so voluminous as yours. Sounds like a nasty setup, love the worked 700's. Ive owned 3 so far (270 Win, 7mm Mag and 300 WSM), and like an idiot sell them to the first shmoe who offers me 30-50% more than I got in it the thing. Sucks being in sales sometimes lol. Anyhow, killer rig ya got there, always been a sucker for the wildcats myself, just have yet to own one!!

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Rammer, whats the drop on those 120's at that range? I may just have to try some out in mine...:D

RE: Magnum haters?
 

jeepkid, I have no clue on any of the ballistics of it offhand right now, All my load data for it is at my reloading shop about a mile away. I am sighted dead on at 300 yards (about 2.4" high at 100 yards) and I gave it about 2.5ft over the back and about 1ft of windage and it drilled him.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

jeepkid, I ran a few numbers on the net for ya. I'm guessing on my velocity, but I'm willing to bet it might be higher than that. I am above the max load suggested on Barnes website using RL22, I worked up slowly till I got to where I wanted.










Trajectory Output


Input Data

Ballistic Coefficient:
0.349 G1
Bullet Weight:
120.00 gr

Caliber:
0.284 in





Muzzle Velocity:
3500.0 ft/s
Chronograph Distance:
10.0 ft



Sight Height:
1.50 in
Sight Offset:
0.00 in

Zero Height:
2.40 in
Zero Offset:
0.00 in

Azimuth:
0.00 MOA
Elevation:
300.00 MOA

LOS Angle:
0.0 deg
Cant Angle:
0.0 deg



Wind Speed:
10.0 mph
Wind Angle:
90.0 deg

Target Speed:
10.0 mph
Target Angle:
90.0 deg



Temperature:
32.0 °F
Pressure:
29.92 in Hg

Relative Humidity:
0.0 %
Altitude:
0 ft



Vital Zone Radius:
8.0 in
Std. Atmosphere at Altitude:
No

Corrected Pressure:
Yes
Target Relative Drops:
Yes

Zero at Max. Point Blank Range:
No



Highlighted input values were forced valid.


Calculated Parameters

Elevation:
5.16 MOA
Azimuth:
0.00 MOA



Atmospheric Density:
0.08067 lbs/ft³
Speed of Sound:
1087.0 ft/s



Maximum PBR:
471 yds
Maximum PBR Zero:
403 yds

Range at Max Height:
224 yds
Energy at PBR:
1254.1 ft•lbs



Sectional Density:
0.213 lbs/in²









Calculated Table

Range
Drop
Drop
Windage
Windage
Velocity
Mach
Energy
Time
Lead
Lead

(yds)
(in)
(moa)
(in)
(moa)
(ft/s)
(none)
(ft•lbs)
(s)
(in)
(moa)

100
2.4
2.3
0.7
0.7
3187.6
2.932
2706.9
0.090
15.8
15.1

200
2.9
1.4
3.1
1.5
2888.1
2.657
2222.1
0.189
33.2
15.8

300
-0.8
-0.3
7.3
2.3
2608.7
2.400
1812.9
0.298
52.4
16.7

400
-9.7
-2.3
13.6
3.3
2346.4
2.159
1466.8
0.419
73.8
17.6

500
-24.9
-4.8
22.4
4.3
2099.6
1.932
1174.4
0.554
97.6
18.6

600
-48.0
-7.6
34.0
5.4
1868.1
1.719
929.8
0.706
124.2
19.8

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I thought about getting a 7mm mag before I got the .300, the whole thing was up in the air in my mind. I settled on the .300 only because it was the first one I found. The ballistics on either is great. Couldn't ask for anything more.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

Thanks Rammer, I might just have to pick up a box...holding on hair out to 400 or so would be pretty nice...:D

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I'm by no means a "magnum hater" either. Unfortunately, I routinely see guys at the range with big rifles cussing up a storm about "their gunsmith this" and "their scope that", when all one has to do is watch them shoot to know why they're not hitting what they want to. Who knows, maybe they'd flinch with a smaller rifle, too. I used to flinch severly when shooting Dad's .30-06, but I was 12 years old at the time.

No question, formal marksmanship training makes all the difference.

I dusted off my .300 Wby this fall intending to take it elk hunting (work conflicted and couldn't go), and it's every bit as accurate as my "go-to".30-06, maybe moreso. But, I've been fortunate to grow up in a family that DID shoot and DID train me, then reinforced that in the military. Yeah, magnums do recoil (ascan lightweight standards), but if I'm hunting, my objective is putting one bullet into a vital area and I've never noticed it.

If there's a chance I'm going to gut-shoot an animal, I'm not going to take the shot, regardless of what I'm carrying. I don't buy the argument at all that a magnum is better than a standard under those circumstances, and hunters should think before they intentionally wound an animal, even if it'll die in the end. Guess I haven't been all that impressed with the tracking skills I've seen in the field, nor the number of dead (usually respectable) bucks I've found "lost" by another hunter.

I kill deer just fine with a .243. I'm perfectly comfortable with the .30-06 on elk, caribou, or moose. I have a .300 Weatherby just because it was cheap, synthetic, and I don't worry about beating it up in the thick timber or up in the rocks. And, a .375 H&H just because I thought I had to have one. They've all been "blooded" on one species or another, and all performed just as I expected them to. Obviously, I had to play my part well, too.

My concern about "magnums" is simply that they're not something one picks up at the sporting goods store and becomes an expert with by reading magazines and forum postings. If it's your FIRST rifle and you have no rifleshooting experience, pick somethingsmaller and/or get a .22 along with it and find a qualified teacher/instructor. I think that we, as a community, owe a lot to that diminutive little rimfire and what it can do for us. I cringe when someone here obviously is looking for a start and all the posts that ensue insisting that magnums are the only way to go. I'm expecting to seen yet another tyro at the range cussing the rifle, when it's really more a casethat he can't shoot it or is afraid of it.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

10-4 that. Never really thought about that aspect. Ive done a good bit of research on the 3 grooves just for my own curiosity sake and had never heard of that issue. As well the aforementioned aquaintances using the barrel haven't had any issue, but then they lag a solid 300 fps behind your application. Just goes to show...just when you think you had something figured. Your round is kind of a different ballgame though compared to most mere mortal cartridges lol.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

No one advocated taking a gut shot on an animal. I brough it up in the context that bad things can happen, even in good situations. And you may find it hard to believe but I am sure that a bad hit deer with a magnum is normally still a dead deer. And a bad hit deer with a lesser cartridge is one you will have to chase down, or you may never retrieve. I have seen it way too many times.

The inability to massively shock a deer is the reason why so many bow hunters loose deer that they have shot. That and the fact that they do not know what to do when they hit a deer. Especially with a bad hit.

Again, I am not advocating taking a bad shot. But I am sure that a "SHOOTER" is better served with a magnum, over a "pea shooter". Just my opinion.

Do you realize that some people consider a 30-06 as a magnum, or overkill?? Tom.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I shoot a .300 Win Short Mag. The kick has never been an issue to me, and I shoot that gun better then any other rifle I have used. I orginally bought it for hunting out west when i lived out there.

Now living back east its my primary deer rifle too. I have a .270 but i dont shoot it nearly as well as my .300WSM. Granted my .300WSM is a nicer gun too.

Also, im not a small guy. I weigh 200lbs, work out,lift weights, the works, and contact isnt a big issue for me. I have a friend thats small and he is affraid of it cause it does knock him around.

I would say shoot what works for you and what is legal for what your hunting. A well place bullet is still the best method. I load my .300WSM light for deer, to try and offset and extra explosions that might ruin the meat.

I just like the fact that my one gun can cover a very large array of game and all i have to do is change bullets and re sight in.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

....and then....

So.....

MagnumsDON'T make up for poor shooting/shot placement, which you can not agree with.

Would you then agree that magnums DO make up for poor shooting/shot placement? That seems to beyour logic here.

But......

You don't advocate a magnum for someone who can't shoot.

Now I'm confused.

And a deer gut-shot with a magnum dies right there, eh? (sorry, didn't quote you, you'll have to read back to your post). I don't know whose world you live in, but there's no guarantee of that, either. A poor shot is a poor shot, whether in how its presented to the shooter or in how the shootercontributes toit. As the shooter, you have a choice whether to take the shot or not.

I burned up nearly1300 rounds ofvarious caliber centerfire rifle ammunition this summer, but since I might use a "pea shooter", I'm not a "SHOOTER"? Yeah,you have a point there, I guess. Aside from a few other things, "Magnum-itis"sometimes brings with it a certain arrogance toward anyone who doesn'tbow to"the great god, magnum". But that's just MY opinion.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

No one here is trying to say that if you don't shoot a magnum that you're less of a marksman or hunter. All we're trying to say is that the reasons why we use a magnum rifle are based upon real worldperformance, and not vanity.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

EXACTLY!
IF someone is "dropping 'em" with a gut shot, they are extremely lucky! No matter what caliber they are using!

What they are basically saying is that a magnum makes up for poor shooting! That is just not true!
Again, I'm NOT a magnum hater, I love mine!
Just try going back to a lighter caliber, it will cure your magnumitis!

RE: Magnum haters?
 

[quote]ORIGINAL: homers brother

....and then....



Please enlighten me as to how either of my statements here are wrong?? If you want to quote it that is fine, but please try to explain yourself??

Are you saying that a magnum does NOT do more damage???????

Are you saying that a bad shot is not possible?? Even if you are the greatest shooter and hunter on earth?? Or that a deer shot with a "Pea Shooter" will die faster than a deer hit with a magnum?? Obviously a deer(bad hit) will expire fasterwith the magnum---with the "Pea Shooter", you may not get him at all!!!

I guess the words "Pea Shooter" lighted a fire. Sorry about that. But I think a hunter owes it to the game to practice with his firearm. And that a fast kill should always be the #1 priority. And in the hands of a competent shooter a magnum will effectively kill faster. I really do believe that.

And I also believe that a hunter should not even be allowed in the woods until he can show complete competency with his firearm, but then that is a different subject.


There are alot of situations that a good hunter or a good shooter can get into-through no fault of their own. And that extra oooommmmph of a mqgnum can make a difference. How can you not agree with that?? I just can not understand ?? Sorry, just my opinion. Tom.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

I just purchased a German Weatherby .300 Wby. Mag., and I already love it!! Good luck.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

No one was saying that shooting a magnum makes up for poor shooting skills. In fact, it's just the opposet. If you want to get the most out of a magnum then you have to be a good shooter to begin with. What I will say is that if you do by chance ever make a bad shot, then you do have a better chance of recovering that deer if you're using something more powerful.

And I hunt with all my guns. This week I hunted with my 30-30 and 30-06. Far from curing magnumitis, I found that for my hunting area the .300 win mag was as close to a perfect rifle as I could have and I missed it :-(.

Much of this is because my other rifles aren't made as well as my magnum and like with anything else, you get what you pay for. I've gone through so much with my magnum and it's been the best rifle I've ever had. I wouldn't really be gaining anything by getting rid of itor using something else. Heck due to the stock design and weight, it kicks less than my 30-06.

RE: Magnum haters?
 

The magnum does not do more damage all the time. The bullet is what does the damage. The worst blown to hell deer I ever saw was hit with a 140 grain Speer Hot core bullet from a 280. Bullet weight and type have more to do with damage than velocity. Any animal hit right with almost any caliber is going to go down in short order. I have killed deer with calibers from 22 rimfire to 416 Rem Mag and 45-70.