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12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

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12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

Old 03-09-2008, 07:41 AM
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Nontypical Buck
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Default 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

As with some, as shotguns became available in longer shells I moved up but did not keep my old gear to compare patterns. So I am wondering, for those who have deep safes and have some in all chamber lengths, what your thoughts may be on pattern effectiveness as the shot column gets longer. Have you found it worth the extra cost and weight?
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Old 03-09-2008, 10:04 AM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

I have found that when i shootany 2 3/4in loads out of my 3 1/2in chamberd gun i get horrible patterns. I was told it is because it gives the shot too much time to expand to the size of the chamber then the sudden compression to the bore size deformes alot of the shot. I get good patterns with 3in and 3 1/2in shells though. I use it mostly for deer and turkey so shooting 2 3/4inshells isnt a top priority.
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Old 03-09-2008, 10:33 AM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

ORIGINAL: biscuit jake

As with some, as shotguns became available in longer shells I moved up but did not keep my old gear to compare patterns. So I am wondering, for those who have deep safes and have some in all chamber lengths, what your thoughts may be on pattern effectiveness as the shot column gets longer. Have you found it worth the extra cost and weight?
Hard part about that jake is that shot column length (shot string length) is rather difficult to measure. Bob Brister put a sheet of plywood covered in paper on the side of a boat on a trailer and had his old lady drive it past him at 35 miles an hour to test just such a thing. Honestly I think suggesting such a test (at least around my camp) would net me an excellent opportunity to test out the couch for a week. I think a lot of what you may notice with longer shot strings will just be that when you look at a bird that you have shot, it will have the same number of hits as if you'd shot it with a 2 3/4" load.... you just can't tell exactly what part of the pattern or shot string you hit it with. Pattern testing only offers us a 2 dimensional view of our pattern... when really we need 4 dimensions... not just height and width, but also depth and length. Without some high ticket camera equipment, its hard to tell. We can read articles all day... but I'm more of a I wanna see it guy.

I only shoot 3.5" shells at turkeys. Its a pellet count game. You'll no doubt notice by the handle and picture that I'm a duck hunter, and collectively, duck and turkey hunting is my thing... and I don't even own a 3.5" waterfowl gun any more..... why bother to fool with such a thing as I see it? Louder, more expensive, kick harder... all to shoot a hovering mallard duck at 35 yards? I'm about to buy a 20 gauge BPS this summer for ducks in the 08-09 season.... most folks are looking for longer shells... I'm switching to yellow shells.

3.5" loads give you more pellets, and in a few select cases now, can give you a bit more speed.... a BIT more speed. I've never in my life shot a bird with a 3.5" shell I couldn't have killed with a 2 3/4" shell, and I've never lost or missed a bird with a 2 3/4" or 3" that I think I would have collected had I been using another 1/2" of chamber and shell.
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Old 03-09-2008, 10:42 AM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

ORIGINAL: SwampCollie

ORIGINAL: biscuit jake

As with some, as shotguns became available in longer shells I moved up but did not keep my old gear to compare patterns. So I am wondering, for those who have deep safes and have some in all chamber lengths, what your thoughts may be on pattern effectiveness as the shot column gets longer. Have you found it worth the extra cost and weight?
Hard part about that jake is that shot column length (shot string length) is rather difficult to measure. Bob Brister put a sheet of plywood covered in paper on the side of a boat on a trailer and had his old lady drive it past him at 35 miles an hour to test just such a thing. Honestly I think suggesting such a test (at least around my camp) would net me an excellent opportunity to test out the couch for a week. I think a lot of what you may notice with longer shot strings will just be that when you look at a bird that you have shot, it will have the same number of hits as if you'd shot it with a 2 3/4" load.... you just can't tell exactly what part of the pattern or shot string you hit it with. Pattern testing only offers us a 2 dimensional view of our pattern... when really we need 4 dimensions... not just height and width, but also depth and length. Without some high ticket camera equipment, its hard to tell. We can read articles all day... but I'm more of a I wanna see it guy.

I only shoot 3.5" shells at turkeys. Its a pellet count game. You'll no doubt notice by the handle and picture that I'm a duck hunter, and collectively, duck and turkey hunting is my thing... and I don't even own a 3.5" waterfowl gun any more..... why bother to fool with such a thing as I see it? Louder, more expensive, kick harder... all to shoot a hovering mallard duck at 35 yards? I'm about to buy a 20 gauge BPS this summer for ducks in the 08-09 season.... most folks are looking for longer shells... I'm switching to yellow shells.

3.5" loads give you more pellets, and in a few select cases now, can give you a bit more speed.... a BIT more speed. I've never in my life shot a bird with a 3.5" shell I couldn't have killed with a 2 3/4" shell, and I've never lost or missed a bird with a 2 3/4" or 3" that I think I would have collected had I been using another 1/2" of chamber and shell.
I'm with SwampCollie on this. The ONLY place a 3.5" shotgun shell has an advantage, is in the turkey field. For waterfowling your just adding more weight, more expensive shells, guns, etc.

I shoot ALOT of honkers and mallards every year, and 70% of the time I am shooting 2 3/4" Kent Faststeels. No reason to shoot anything different when shooting over dekes in my opinion.
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Old 03-09-2008, 03:24 PM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

For years I hunted with my Browning 12ga upland special (2 3/4) over and under, mostly after grouse and woodcock.
But the last two seasons I liked my new (3 1/2) benelli super eagle so much that I've been using it for the same upland hunting, and shoot the same 2 3/4 Federal #8 game loads without compromise.
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Old 03-09-2008, 05:23 PM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question


ORIGINAL: Edcyclopedia

For years I hunted with my Browning 12ga upland special (2 3/4) over and under, mostly after grouse and woodcock.
But the last two seasons I liked my new (3 1/2) benelli super eagle so much that I've been using it for the same upland hunting, and shoot the same 2 3/4 Federal #8 game loads without compromise.
That is the other benefit of owning a 3.5" gun though..... if the shell says 12 gauge.... you can shoot it. Just because you drive a Corvette doesn't mean you need to do a burnout when the light turns green... so to speak...
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Old 03-09-2008, 05:30 PM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

Yeah SwampCollie.
Another benifit is taking just one gun when going to camp.
Also, you can drop the blaze lead vest and grab the camo steel shot vest when hitting pheasant fields with rivers running beside them.
Sometimes you get to jump shoot and have the bigger 3 1/2 mag verses the 2 3/4 mags
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Old 03-11-2008, 12:08 AM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

I have tested all three lengths side-by-side out of the same gun, as well as shooting them out of shorter-chambered guns. What I found in my tests was:

1: The 3.5" shells did not pattern as well as the 3" shells when fired from a 3.5" chamber.

2: The 2.75" shells patterned slightly less well than the 3" when fired from a 3.5" chamber.

3: The 3" and 2.75" shells patterned almost identically when fired from a 3" chamber.

4: The two tests above were all fired using the same brand/lot numbers, and using the exact same choke tube.

5: I dont have a 2.75" gun that will take choke tubes, but for comparison I fired my browning fixed choke (Improved cylinder, 2.75" chamber) and compared it to my remington (3" chamber) using a Imp. Cyl. choke tube. Using 3" ammo in the remington I got better pattern density (no big surprise), but when using 2.75" in both guns the browning had better density. So this was sort of a toss-up.

In the end I decided to use 3" or 2.75" for turkeys or smaller game. Why get beaten up by the increased recoil for poorer patterns? However, I do use the 3.5" shells for deer hunting with buckshot. I like throwing as many pellets as possible when the deer are running.
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Old 03-11-2008, 12:39 PM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

I have a Winchester Model 12 3" that shoots better patterns at 50 yards than a several 3 1/2" guns I've owned. Of course such a small sampling means very little the grand scheme of things, but I've sold off the 3 1/2" guns I own. I found a 3" magnum is enough for anything I want to hunt.
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Old 03-11-2008, 12:50 PM
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Default RE: 12 gauge 2 & 3/4", 3" & 3 & 1/2" Question

Another thing to take into consideration as well is exactly what your definition of a "good" or "better" pattern is.

That of course, depends on your game. I have found that there are certain 3.5" 12 gauge guns that do pattern better with 3.5" shells than 3" shells. However, all of those guns, without exception, were overbored Mossbergs.... basically 10 gauge barrels (835s and 935s). And when it comes to turkeys.... you can't beat a 10 gauge.. its a like a deaf mute going for Miss America so to speak (or not.... get it!... sorry that was mean ).

When it comes to waterfowl patterns, I've never seen a really good shooting 3.5" gun pattern wise. Not when you look at the big picture anyway. Quite frequently, I'll get a good number of centrally dense pellets, but I'll also get a huge increase in the number of flyers. When you divide out the overall density... its almost always lower than that of 3" shells.... meaning that the pattern as a whole is really less effective.

Buckshot is a whole differnet story that really applys mostly to us southern gents. The thing with 3.5" buckshot, aside from ferocious recoil, is that those 18 pellets of OO are going much much slower than even a 3" load of OO. Most of the hardcore dog runners I know still shoot 9 pellets of OO out of 2 3/4" shells exclusively. Why... speed. A faster pellet of the same weight will give you better penetration and better ability to break bones, and with buckshot that is so very critical to success. A lot of these guys take shots that really should not be taken, and like a blind hog, they are successful probably half the time (thats optimistic). Plenty of bragging about the ones they shoot at 80 and 90 steps (of course, range guesstimation isn't one of their strong suits either). But you don't hear about the ones they bugger up. Generally, if you keep your shots under 50 yards and have patterned your gun and found a load and choke that works well.... it really is almost academic.
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