browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I recently bought a browning a-bolt composite stalker in .30-06. If I fire 8 rounds one after the other at 100yards I get the following: First two make 1/2" group wherever you wantit. Next two shots drift about 3" left and make 1" group. The rest of the shots appear randomly, but remain within a 6" group. So the hotter the gun gets, the more randomly it shoots. Seems the first two shots on a cold barrelare all it can do 'reliably.'

I'm using Remington UMC 150gr full metal jackets, and Remington Express core-lokt in165gr. Results are the same with either ammo. I've hadseveral other people shoot therifle as well, with the same results. Clean barrel, oily barrel,or slightly dirty barrel doesn't seem to matter either....the first two shots always go where you want it, after that, who knows!

SOOOOO is this normal a-bolt behavior, or?!? Could the remington cartridges be too fast or slow for this rifle? What does everyone else use for ammo??

any info appreciated as always.. :)

--matt

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I think that's what happens when any barrel gets hot, the bullets start walking. Albeit, different rifles do this to different degrees. If this is your hunting rifle, don't worry. If you're using this for competition, worry.

Actually the best way to zero the hunting rifle is to shoot once, give the barrel 30-60 miinutes to cool, then shoot again. This will best simulate hunting conditions (one shot on a cold barrel).

I have never shot my A-Bolt more than three or four shots per group, but never seen drastic groups like yours. Try different bullets and give the barrel a chance to season or break-in.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I have the exact same rifle but in 308. I guess I have never fired more than five or six rounds at one setting but mine puts that many in a pretty small group. I would suspect some poor stock to action fit. You may want to look into glass bedding the action and free floating the barrel. I usually just fire a three shot group before a hunting trip as you seldom need more than a couple shots.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

so i called up browning this morning...their response: their rifles are designed to be accurate for 2-3 shots, andthey have no ammunition recommendations beyond "factory loaded." basically iftheriflecan't robinhood two shots on a cold clean barrel, there's something wrong with the rifle....but after two shots it's gonna move. they said for higher volume shooting a different ammunition *might* help make the groups a bit smaller, but again, no recommendations.

so yeah, i'm glad this is my hunting rifle and not my competition gun!

--matt

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

What your seeing is fairly normal, and nothing out of the ordinary. The browning A-Bolt small barrel really had an effect on temp and shots fired. I know my A-bolt in 308 shoots the first cold bore shot 1" high and 1.5" to the right. After I let it cool, dead center and subMOA for 2 shots. If I throw a 3rd shot, it usually opens my groups to 1.5" group.

Now, I could tear out the original bedding and rebed and monkey around for more consistency, but I know the gun and how it reacts pretty well, and its a hunting rifle, so I leave it alone.

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RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

If that's your standard, you're going to have a VERY hard time finding a sporter weight rifle that fits it. Heck, you'd have a hard time finding a factory stock varmint rifle that will do that consistantly. I think you've set your sights too high (pun intended). If it'll shoot 2" groups all the time with factory ammo, Browning's not going to tell you there's anything wrong with it, because there probably isn't. Try different ammo, some rifles are particular. I had a similar problem with my Savage. Found out that when I had reassembled after it's initial cleaning/lube I had not gotten the recoil lug and action seated quite right when I tightened the action screws which caused a wandering zero. Also, you should try to let the rifle cool for several minutes between shots. I tend to get impatient and shoot too fast getting the barrel too hot, it's easy to do. If there is any stress in the barrel it can flex and the POI can shift. I found this out the hard way. Just slow down and take your time. These are bolt action rifles, not machineguns. ;)

Mike

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I have found it. Its called Cooper Arms. Also found another. NULA's. Guaranteed for cold bore accuracy.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

Bigcountry,

The Coopers are a notable exception, but I would place them in the category of "semi-custom" in terms of production volume. I was really referring to the true factory mass-production rifles (which the Browning A-Bolt is), which I really don't think Cooper fits this category, but I could be wrong. Our local Scheels stocks Cooper rifles and they all come with a test target (usually prominently displayed alogside the rifle in the case!) that is usually a one hole group. Now, it is important to remember that the test/proof groups are shot in an indoor range using a 36x target scope off of a machine rest with carefully worked up handloaded test ammo, so it reflects what the rifle is capable of in optimum controlled conditions. I would bet that real world results would vary, but would still be fairly impressive. It should also be noted that one pays a handsome sum for Coopers out-of-box accuracy too.

Mike

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

Hey, if the fella demands cold bore accuracy of subMOA every time all the time, he's going to have to pay for it.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

Very true.

Mike

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RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I think my Tikka has the same issue. First 2 shots are usually 1/4" followed by #3 opening it up to 1.5". I'm still testing this but if this is the case I'll just have to wait longer for the 3rd shot to have nice groups.

My Abolt I used to have would never shoot better than 2" at 100 yards. Good enough for hunting i guess but I wasn't happy with it. I glass-bedded the action, reloaded for it, and even sent it back to Browning. They returned it with a 50 yd target with 3 holes 1" apart, saying that was within factory specs. Probably good enough for most people but not for me. I sold it and bought my Tikka and have loved that rifle so much more I never even think about my Browning except at times like this.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

The a-bolt that I have done a good bit of shooting with is a 270wsm and I have never had this kind of problem. Sounds like a pretty crappy answer you got from Browning.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

If you keep overheating a lighter weight barrel by regularly firing 8 rounds one after the other,you will greatly increase the rate of throat erosion and the accuracy will get worse permanently.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

Any of the a-bolt rifles I've ever seen (as well as bout ALL factory rifles) are good for bout 2-3 shots before the barrel starts walking. This is natural occurence with factory sporter weight barrels. I recently posted about cyrogenically stress relievimg barrel and had people that had NEVER had it done tp verbally attack it and cruify me! As to 3 vs 5 shot groups,my acid test is 5 one shot groups-shoot a round,wait hours or days between shots at same target. THAT will give you HONEST cold barrel accuracy. I have most of the barrels I use cyro'd And it eliminates ALL barrel walk and usually a tad better on accuracy. Another thing I do is handlap ALL my barrels regardless-DO NOT firelap-I've seen barrels ruint because of firelapping. I do these these proven accuracy enhancing methods regardless of manufacturer/model/contour.
By the way-a-bolt is my favorite action to build rifles on but VERY HARD to find 1 cheap enough.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

Dad gone, stalking, you and i are on the exact same page these days besides the carbon arrow debate:D. I ruined a good barrle with firelapping.

Also, I paid extra to have a krieger barrel cyrogenically treated another few cycles. It actually had great cold bore performance. But I think I went way too small in barrel diameter, so it still went all over the place after 4 shots. But it was a hunting rifle.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

You cryo'd barrels AFTER they were drilled?? I thought that the stress relieving would be done before drilling. Guess I need to read up on that a little more.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

To be honest, not sure if it was before or after. I just bought a barrel from krieger, and they give you an option for more cycles to be treated.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

Bigcountry-I consider that an honored compliment:D. Some of the top barrel makers relieve stress between every step AND after all machining that would induce stress. Just about any machining steps cause stress such as drilling,any type rifling other than cut,and even turning down blank will create stress. Cyro works so well because it's done after all these steps are done.I too have heard of barrels becoming more accurate but the main reason I have it done to almost all barrels on rifles I build is it usually stops barrel "walking,and the throats last longer. I built a ruger #1 in .416 rigby necked down to 7mm,got 2 barrels 30" long 1 was cyrod and other wasn't,and conducted testing on accuracy life,velocity loss,etc and the cyrod barrel throat lasted almost twice as long.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

OK, that makes sense. I thought that you meant that you had an existing barrel cryo'd after it was built. Shilen also advertises stress relieving.

So you 'shot out' a 416/284?? Man, that must be hell on both the shoulder and the wallet :) not to mention the Ruger!

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I have two Browning A-bolt rifles, a stainless .338mag with a custom muzzel break, and a regular blued (black)Rem. 280. I load my own, and use premium bullets. My .280 is a sub 1" moa using most 140 gr. bullets, and is just about as good with heaver bullets. However my .338 dosn't like anything above 180 gr.I'm still working on that problem. I usually shoot test groups of 4, then let the barrel cool. I found that removing the bolt and elevating the barrel cools it a lot faster (convection). I also clean it after it has cooled down for the next test group, trying to make "all things equal as possible" for each test group. I had an older model browning 338 that had the fluted bolt, it shot everything perfectly, a serious tack driverthat just enlarged the first shot by a fraction. I sold it and got the .280 due to some shoulder surgery I had, afraid the .338recoil might damage my shoulder, BIG mistake. The new .338 dosn't hold a candle to my first one, however the recoil is about that of a 30-06 with the muzzel break, the only plus I can see so far. Every rifle has it's own personality, you just have to figure out how to get the best out of it. If you can't get it to work, get rid of it and try something else.

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I have a Browning A-Bolt medallion .270 , 16 years of use , and no it does not do that.... at least that badly, BUT , I have to ask, exactly what is the purpose of shooting 6 shots , one after the other .... on a hot barrell , in a hunting rifle ??? I don't understand the process.... You shouldn't need to do this in the field .... and If you do need to , then you have much bigger issues and need to spend time at the range , but I don't believe that to be the case ... so exactly why would one need a gun to shoot MOA on a 6 string from a hunting rifle??? Why is it an issue at all ???

RE: browning a-bolt owners, step in plz
 

I don't shoot a "6 string". When working up loads to find out which "group" is most accurate, I shoot 4 rounds, most shoot 3 rounds for their group. I shoot4 so that Ican seehow my rifle reacts.After I find the load that works best, I will only shoot three rounds prior to a hunt, just to make sure of myself. My system works for me, if I go to a new bullet, I do it all over again. I have yet to take more than one shot at any Elk or Deer I have evertaken.