.243 or .308
10-11-2007, 10:45 AM
#21
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 5
RE: .243 or .308
If you are set on either the .243 or .308, I'd go with the .308 simply because you sound like you haven't put a whole lot of thought into what it is you really want the gun for. Something bigger than what you currently have, a bit more kick, a bit more destruction... Later down the line if you get more serious into hunting, I think the .308 will be more versatile.
10-11-2007, 12:49 PM
#25
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wall SD USA & Jamestown ND
Posts: 11,474
RE: .243 or .308
7.62x51 Nato. It was a better cartridge for use in auto's because of its shorter length than that of the 30-06. It was Introduced by Winchester as a sporting cartridge in 1952. I was only eight then but I wanted one.
. Truth be told, if I had to sell every gun but one, the 308 would be the last gun standing. It quietly does anything and everything ask of it. Before it was the Nato it was an experimental T-65 cartridge.
. Truth be told, if I had to sell every gun but one, the 308 would be the last gun standing. It quietly does anything and everything ask of it. Before it was the Nato it was an experimental T-65 cartridge.
10-11-2007, 01:28 PM
#26
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,429
RE: .243 or .308
This is from Wikipedia:
The .300 Savage distinguished itself further by serving as the parent to the .308 Winchester (7.62 mm NATO) cartridge, a round that was developed for the US armed forces in the 1950s and which is still in use today.[3]
The Savage Model 99 lever-action rifle is no longer in production, and over the past two decades or so the .300 Savage has faded in popularity, eclipsed by its own progeny the .308 Winchester and other more powerful short action cartridges.
This is a bit misleading though. Because you can not start with a 300 savage case and make a 308. I believe the correct terminology might be that the 300 savage was the inspiration for the 308. I believe that originally the 30-06 case was shortenedto make the308.
The .300 Savage distinguished itself further by serving as the parent to the .308 Winchester (7.62 mm NATO) cartridge, a round that was developed for the US armed forces in the 1950s and which is still in use today.[3]
The Savage Model 99 lever-action rifle is no longer in production, and over the past two decades or so the .300 Savage has faded in popularity, eclipsed by its own progeny the .308 Winchester and other more powerful short action cartridges.
This is a bit misleading though. Because you can not start with a 300 savage case and make a 308. I believe the correct terminology might be that the 300 savage was the inspiration for the 308. I believe that originally the 30-06 case was shortenedto make the308.
10-12-2007, 06:47 AM
#27
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: WY
Posts: 2,056
RE: .243 or .308
I believe you are correct, Shato. .300 Sav as the "inspiration", but .30-06 as the foster parent. I don't have my manuals and caliper handy, but seems there are some dimensional issues that would make it impossible to form a .308 from a .300 Sav.
Years ago, I had to choose between a .243 and .308. Though I lived in elk woods, I saw most of my hunting as deer, coyotes, and varmints. I chose the .243 and it's been perfect for all of those. I don't know that I'd go shooting raccoons with it, especially if I were selling pelts. I think it'd leave an awfully enormous exit wound (thinking back to what it did to a porcupine I shot with it). On a windy day at the prairie dog town, it's perfect (I also shoot a .22-250 and a couple .223s). A bit on the light side for elk, but the best one-shot-killer of deer in my gunsafe.
Years ago, I had to choose between a .243 and .308. Though I lived in elk woods, I saw most of my hunting as deer, coyotes, and varmints. I chose the .243 and it's been perfect for all of those. I don't know that I'd go shooting raccoons with it, especially if I were selling pelts. I think it'd leave an awfully enormous exit wound (thinking back to what it did to a porcupine I shot with it). On a windy day at the prairie dog town, it's perfect (I also shoot a .22-250 and a couple .223s). A bit on the light side for elk, but the best one-shot-killer of deer in my gunsafe.
10-13-2007, 03:47 PM
#29
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Coralville, IA. USA
Posts: 3,802
RE: .243 or .308
The only differences between the 7.62x51 NATO and the .308 Win is the case wall thickness (the mil-spec is thicker to allow higher pressures and reliable feeding in belt-fed machineguns without damaging the case) and the 7.62x51 is loaded to higher pressure. In external dimensions, the .308Win and 7.62x51 NATO are identical and as long as the actions are strong modern actions, interchangeable.
The same is true with the .223 Rem and the 5.56x45 NATO. Externally identical, with the same thicker brass for the same reasons.
One just needs to be careful when handloading, because using .308 Win data in a 7.62x51 case could cause excessive pressures because of the reduced case capacity. The Hornady Manual has load data for both.
I think the info about the .300 Savage is correct. It was used as the basis because the .300 Savage was the right size and almost at the desired performance level, but the 7.62x51 was an original cartridge. It's possible that they made the first prototype brass out of (readily available) .30-06 cases, but the dramatic amount of trimming and forming necessary doesn't really make it the true "parent case", since they could have used several other cartridges to make the new one out of.
Mike
The same is true with the .223 Rem and the 5.56x45 NATO. Externally identical, with the same thicker brass for the same reasons.
One just needs to be careful when handloading, because using .308 Win data in a 7.62x51 case could cause excessive pressures because of the reduced case capacity. The Hornady Manual has load data for both.
I think the info about the .300 Savage is correct. It was used as the basis because the .300 Savage was the right size and almost at the desired performance level, but the 7.62x51 was an original cartridge. It's possible that they made the first prototype brass out of (readily available) .30-06 cases, but the dramatic amount of trimming and forming necessary doesn't really make it the true "parent case", since they could have used several other cartridges to make the new one out of.
Mike
10-16-2007, 02:50 AM
#30
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location:
Posts: 3
RE: .243 or .308
Hello too,
I'm guessing you want a little more "terminal action" so to speak. I would lean towards the .308 due to reload options and cross-sect. density.
Both rounds provide plenty of down-range energy for more visually pleasing results. BUT, the targets need to absorb as much energy as possible (i.e. vaporizing prairie dogs, computer moniter with CRT filled with water) and the bullet as soft as possible for frag. and reduction of ricochet potential.
Personally, I enjoy popping milk jugs filled with colored water/chalk, with a .22-250, at range. The "burst" that satisfies.
I'm guessing you want a little more "terminal action" so to speak. I would lean towards the .308 due to reload options and cross-sect. density.
Both rounds provide plenty of down-range energy for more visually pleasing results. BUT, the targets need to absorb as much energy as possible (i.e. vaporizing prairie dogs, computer moniter with CRT filled with water) and the bullet as soft as possible for frag. and reduction of ricochet potential.
Personally, I enjoy popping milk jugs filled with colored water/chalk, with a .22-250, at range. The "burst" that satisfies.