fufanu360

what about the 243?? i would look into it... maybe a little under powered for bears...

crump116

What can you guys tell me about the .308 or 30-06. I was told to stay away from the 30-06 because it shot like a rainbow and I would have trouble judging distance and hitting my target, if that makes since.

zrexpilot

.243 is probably the most accurate gun out of the box. Extremely flat shooting and has good BC and SD.
You can shoot 55 gr bullets for varmints, and go up the 100 gr. for deer, elk or blackies. Well capable of 400 yd shots for deer and varmints, blackies I would keep it under 200 yds.
check out my threads on the .243.

ColoradoElk

Crump, I think you are mistaking the .30-30 Winchester and the .30-06 in terms of trajectory. I would'nt want to take a '-06 out for a day of varminting, but it would be a great choice for deer and blackies.

James B

In 1925 Winchester developed the perfect cartridge for what you are asking. It was called the 270 and has yet to be improved on as a deer caliber form 0 -400 yards. Easy to get ammo for, acceptable (to most)recoil, great ballistics and wide spread availibility. You could ask for more but probably won't find it. The 25-06,260,6.5x55 Mauser,7x57,7mm-08, 280, 308 and 30-06 would also be good choices. The 30-06 is really more than needed for deer but is hard to beat as an all around NA caliber. I probablly missed a few good ones. The 25-06 minimum is because you through in the 300-400 yard part.

Virginia7

crump116,

Forget the 243Win. It's an excellent varmint cartridge, and will pass for some for deer hunting if shots are kept within a couple hundred yards.
There are far, far better cartridges for use on black bear. Hell, IMO it should be illegal to hunt bear with this cartridge.
I don't know where you're at, but just for some interesting reading I'd suggest you look at the information on bear hunting on the PA. Hunters forum. The largest dressed weight black bear taken this year was a 747 pound male. There were several others going well over 600 lbs.
One poor fellow took on a large bear with his 444Marlin, and got bit a couple times for his trouble before the bear expired. If you want to go after a bear with a 243Win., please, be my guest. Just do me a favor and name me in your will. I'll be laughing all the way to the bank!

Link: http://www.huntingpa.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/Cat/0

For what you want I'd seriously look into a 270Win. (minimum, but better suited to both deer & varmints), the 280Rem., 7mmRem.Mag., 308Win., or
30-06. If you really anticipate shooting over 300yds., then the 7mm Remington Magnum is probably the best bet.

firstshot

crump116

In my opinion, of course I'm totally biased , the 7mm-08 would be an excellent option for your application as ithas a wide variety of 7mm bullets available from 100Grn (Varments) up to 175 Grn (Anything else), andis more than capable of making shots in to 350 Yd range.

I've gota 7mm-08in Rem 700 Mtn LSS flavor and have worked uploads for the 145 Grn Speer SP (HotCore) that has a muzzle velocity of 2,848 FPS and 2,622 FtLbs energy and at 400 Yds is still running at 2,158 FPS and 1,500 FTLbs of energy which is more than enough for the types of game you are considering. The 7mm-08 also has the added benefit ofvery light recoil.

As has aleady been mentioned, there are a number of calibers that could meet your needs. Here are a couple of links to the Remington and Federal sites that allow you to compare the ballistics of multiple cartrdges.Even though thisis"factoryammo" ballistics, it may help you with your decision process. Another thing to keep in mind, especially if you are not an handloader, is the availability and variety of factory loads. These two sitesshould also at least give you a feel for that availability and variety.

Remington:
http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/ballistics/

Federal:
http://www.federalcartridge.com/default.asp?pg=27&firearm=1


I'm sure you know that there are a whole host of things that impact accuracy, and in my opinion,the specific caliber isNOT at the top of the list. Every rifle is different and one rifle might like one particular load and a different rifle of the exact same make and model may like something entirely different.

With that said, I have found it to be easy to develop accurate loads for the 7mm-08, at least in my gun. I've developed loads forthe 154 Grn Hornady Round Nose, 145 Grn Speer SP (HotCor), 140 Grn Nosler Accubond, 140 Grn Sierra SBT, 139 Grn Hornady SP, and the 140 Grn & 150Grn Nosler Ballistic Tips. With the exception of the Ballistic Tips, all of these shoot sub MOA at 100 YDs in my gun and even the Ballistic Tips shoot at about 1 1/4" @ 100 Yds. (I think I just need to try some different powders with the Ballistic Tips). Also, the 145 Grn Speer SP's and the 140 Grn Sierra SBT's shoot sub MOA at 200 Yds. I just haven't tried them at longer distances yet.

So don't just through the 7mm-08 out with the bathwater.....you should do a little research on your own (do a search on 7mm-08) and pay attention to what the folks here have to say as many have a lot of experience to share.........but in the end it's you that will have to make the decision.

Good luck in your caliber quest.....I hope some of this helps!

firstshot
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Make your first shot count!

ritchierebelrouser52

in the hands of a skilled marksman, there are alot of good long rage shooting calibers that can take down deer or bear. the 30/06 was used by many accomplished marksmen in 1000 meter shooting matches. lately that has been replaced by the .308. i havea cousin who has killed deer at 600+ yards with a 7mm Mag and can still group well at 800-1000 yards(documented on video,although i havent seen the video) My personal reccommendation is the 30/06. I have hunted with it since i was 11 and the farthest i ever had a deer run was the first buck i shot(i got buck fever and pulled to the left and hit it in the liver) and it ran about 2 steps before it hit the ground. that was with 150 grain loads. it is possible to get loads up to 220 grains(wich would be plentyfor black bear) and clear down to 55 grains(i am told, once again i havent seen these) which would be good for varmints...well bad for the varmints but good for the shooter
but i dont pretend to be an expert, someone will probably tell me that my cousin could not shoot like that, blah blah blah, but in WV we tend to pick up a rifle at a young age and put it down only when we are no longer able to hold them (sometimes after that) and i doubt that anyone who has seen west virginians shoot would bet against us in a shooting match

JagMagMan

I'd say leave the varmints out of the equation! All day varminting, to bears, is asking a lot from one caliber. Anything from .270, .280, 7MM-08, .308, 30-06, 7MM RM, and a couple of other "7's" that I missed, would be perfect!

Soilarch

If black bears are definately possible. Go 30-06...if varmints are definate go .243 I don't feel like you can ask a gun to do varmints and bear. 30-06 will definately take varmints ...a 243 would leave me uncomfortabel in bear country, so I guess I'm saying 30-06