Eye relief
11-18-2004, 08:38 PM
#31
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 1,906
RE: Eye relief
sj,
Very true, but unrelated to my explanation. By mounting the scope further forward you in essence encompass a tighter grip---ie. you put your shoulder into the gunbutt more to achieve optimal scope performance. The gun becomes "one" with your body. Although a relaxed "form" is desired for optimal precision, you can train your body to have a tight grip and maintain both physical and mental relaxation. Just like everything else, it takes practice...
Hence, the distance from scope to eye is the same, but your body is pressed further forward, and the gun tighter to your body. Therefore, the gun has less rearward travel at ignition, because your body has "shifted" into a tighter position. This is in theory, and will work dramatically with smaller caliber rifles and shotguns by simply sliding the scope forward in the mounts. Yes, this may cause parallax problems, and the sight line may be too awkward for some (low cheek compared to full cheek)...BUT
Again, as I stated in my original post, is eye relief worth $100's more on the average rifle? Not the monsters that BC is talking about, but the average hunting gun, including slugguns? I don't personally think so, and just don't see the justification.
Very true, but unrelated to my explanation. By mounting the scope further forward you in essence encompass a tighter grip---ie. you put your shoulder into the gunbutt more to achieve optimal scope performance. The gun becomes "one" with your body. Although a relaxed "form" is desired for optimal precision, you can train your body to have a tight grip and maintain both physical and mental relaxation. Just like everything else, it takes practice...
Hence, the distance from scope to eye is the same, but your body is pressed further forward, and the gun tighter to your body. Therefore, the gun has less rearward travel at ignition, because your body has "shifted" into a tighter position. This is in theory, and will work dramatically with smaller caliber rifles and shotguns by simply sliding the scope forward in the mounts. Yes, this may cause parallax problems, and the sight line may be too awkward for some (low cheek compared to full cheek)...BUT
Again, as I stated in my original post, is eye relief worth $100's more on the average rifle? Not the monsters that BC is talking about, but the average hunting gun, including slugguns? I don't personally think so, and just don't see the justification.
11-19-2004, 08:25 AM
#32
Guest
Posts: n/a
RE: Eye relief
Or you buy the right tool for the job and not develop a habit that will be hard to brake with improper form just because you get emotional over a product.
There's alot more to it than just eye relief.
1. adjustment. I have had two burris scopes. And if you try to change zero to accomidate long range shooting (with the target turrets as they are meant for), you cannot get back to zero. Have you ever did a box test? Yes, i have had Leupolds also fail this test. But since thier customer service is very good, when I called, I didn't have someone try to tell me, "its probably you and not the scope". But with burris, I got just that. Alot of argueing. I don't need that. Then we starting discussing thier limited amount of windage and elevation adjustment compared to others in the market. Again, alot of arguing instead of listening to the customer.
I don't care what anyone says, 22MOA adjustment is not enough with a target scope. You can automatically take away 5MOA of that for the extremes. At the extremes, you adjustment becomes much more inaccurate. So you need 8MOA adjustment, you have use these stupid signature series rings with inserts to get them just right. You use a colimator and still need to verify with shooting. So then you come back to the house and change inserts and repeat. Come on. This ain't no way to do long range work. It ain't worth the 100 dollars I saved on the scope.
Bud, I travel all over the world for a living and going to let you in on a little secret that can't be undone and there's no turning back no matter how many complain. Its a world market.
There's alot more to it than just eye relief.
1. adjustment. I have had two burris scopes. And if you try to change zero to accomidate long range shooting (with the target turrets as they are meant for), you cannot get back to zero. Have you ever did a box test? Yes, i have had Leupolds also fail this test. But since thier customer service is very good, when I called, I didn't have someone try to tell me, "its probably you and not the scope". But with burris, I got just that. Alot of argueing. I don't need that. Then we starting discussing thier limited amount of windage and elevation adjustment compared to others in the market. Again, alot of arguing instead of listening to the customer.
I don't care what anyone says, 22MOA adjustment is not enough with a target scope. You can automatically take away 5MOA of that for the extremes. At the extremes, you adjustment becomes much more inaccurate. So you need 8MOA adjustment, you have use these stupid signature series rings with inserts to get them just right. You use a colimator and still need to verify with shooting. So then you come back to the house and change inserts and repeat. Come on. This ain't no way to do long range work. It ain't worth the 100 dollars I saved on the scope.
Bud, I travel all over the world for a living and going to let you in on a little secret that can't be undone and there's no turning back no matter how many complain. Its a world market.
11-19-2004, 06:53 PM
#33
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 1,906
RE: Eye relief
bc,
No complaints about a world market. And no beef with you having complaints about a particular product line.
I am curious though, why do you think a tighter grip is bad form? It's actually practiced by many who shoot for much higher stakes than you or I...
But I won't argue, some guns require more eye relief, period. I will say, though, to etothepi observation...the person is an idiot if it takes 4 straight smacks to the noggin to either change the set-up or change the scope [&:]
No complaints about a world market. And no beef with you having complaints about a particular product line.
I am curious though, why do you think a tighter grip is bad form? It's actually practiced by many who shoot for much higher stakes than you or I...
But I won't argue, some guns require more eye relief, period. I will say, though, to etothepi observation...the person is an idiot if it takes 4 straight smacks to the noggin to either change the set-up or change the scope [&:]
