Sylvan

IL-Cornfed,
Maybe if you take the time to read what some of us are saying you will begin to understand. Maybe then you will begin to realize that we do "grasp" what QDM is and choose to reject it. Maybe when you understand you will stop making such arrogant statements.

Talondale

I think the philosophy of QDM is sound in it's inception. Where it goes from there is not something they can be answerable for. I think we ARE rack obsessive, but that's what drives the money side of things to be honest, and that's what's going to get the most attention (Big Game conventions, videos, magazines, license sales). The department of game is going to listen to the loudest group because that's where their money comes from. So it may be that the Rack Mentality is going to bully people who want to have a simple hunt. But as I said before, I don't want it legislated. I want it accepted on a personal level. If it was going to be legislated here in VA I'd probably lobby against it, even though I practice it personally. But as far as having a more "natural" age group dispersion it definitely benifits the deer herd, anticdotal evidence aside. Going back to my fishing analogy, because it's a good parallel and something that most people accept, why do people throw back the small fish? To let them get bigger. Can you have fun catching small fish? Sure. But universally, most people would consider catching the same amount of bigger fish even more enjoyable. Why would managing deer be any different? It isn't. Raising the median age of deer will increase the enjoyment for all hunters, no matter what their emphasis (unless it's the elimination of the whole deer herd ). I think the official QDM stance is to improve the quality of the hunt for everyone, not just the rack obsessed.

I don't think the hunting trend in NY is to take all but the young does, which was my premise. What I'm saying is there is a danger in taking the very young as well as the mid-age does to the exclusion of the matron does. Good management would be to try and take out the oldest Matron doe and allow the does in their prime do the majority of the breeding.

Birth rates/fawn survival rates, disease levels, after season deer mortality rate. Based on several studies in Minn., Wisc., and a few other states I can't recall off the top of my head. (it's been 15 years).

atlasman

Do you see anything in my quote that says the deer will be less pressured?? Maybe you misquoted me for someone else because I don't even see the word pressure in my quote.

atlasman

First of all I think you are mistaking comments directed at the preachers for those directed at the message. QDM is not the problem.........it's all the guys trying to cram it down other hunters throats and force their own personal opinion on everyone else by trying to make others feel less about themselves if they aren't on board.

Secondly.......I would have Soooooooooo much more respect for those preaching if they would just be honest and say it is about shooting bigger racks and nothing more. Don't cry about herd health or increased challenge because neither are true. More mature bucks means it will be less challenging to find one.....Period. A truely intense challenge would be to kill a mature buck where there is only one or two in the entire area........not eight to ten. QDM is nothing more then growing deer and waiting to shoot them only to stroke our ego and say we accomplished some great task because of it's size........and rack size has nothing to do with it as we all know here.

Anyone with enough money can shoot HUGE bucks year after year in completely fair chase settings because that money gets them access to places with plenty of HUGE deer. Does that make them any better of a hunter or increase the satisfaction of the harvest?? Definately not. QDM gets you the same thing only it takes a lot longer.......and may not even be cheaper if you factor in food plot costs and year round care of the land.

Deleted User

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nodog

Got to agree with you there. What's the point of killing a farm raised deer. There is a problem in Va with inbreed deer. Is QDM precipitating this problem? A while ago a Harley Davidson was a dirty name. I rode one then. I could afford one then. Now it's a joke. ODM will do the same for hunting. People will start having to take out a loan to deer hunt. I hunt for food to feed my 5 kids, that's my satisfaction. That is real hunting.

Blodg

atlasman, I can be 100% honest and say that the reason I choose to practice QDM is because I have no desire to shoot a young buck. I prefer the increased challenge of going after a 3 1/2 year or older. Yes we have already been over this argument about it not being the same in all areas but I can only speak for myself (and most people in the midwest) - it is not much challenge to shoot a 1 1/2 year old buck during bow season. To me all the scouting, practicing, and anticipation would be quite anti-climatic if I shot the first young buck to walk by. It is not so much "about shooting bigger racks" but more so NOT about shooting smaller racks. I have killed several 1 1/2 and 2 1/2 year old bucks in my first 10 years of bow hunting and now it doesn't do much for me. So why not pass the young bucks and take some does while waiting for a mature buck? I only see a few mature bucks in a season so it is not about "shooting bigger racks and nothing else". I did not kill a buck the last two seasons and will continue to do so until a mature buck presents a shot. That is my take and I have plenty of deer meat as long as we take a few between myself and my son.

atlasman

So you are against imposing regulations on everyone to force them into following QDM even if they don't want to right?? After all it took you 10 years until smaller bucks no longer flipped your switch.......shouldn't everyone else have at least that much time to do the same??.......even guys starting this year???

Wouldn't be very fair to impose regs on a guy that has only hunted a year when you had 10 years to shoot whatever you wanted. It's easy to say people should pass on small bucks when you have been popping them for a decade and now decided you want something more.........don't you want others to enjoy a decade of hunting whatever they want just like you did??

rybohunter

Atlas
What so many of us are saying but you are failing to read is that we are just trying to get some more people to start passing on young bucks, NOT MANDATING IT FOR EVERYONE. Neither extreme is what most people want. While I feel it is stupid for all people to shoot small bucks "just because" I also feel that having everyone wait shot nothing less than a 180" 6 1/2 year buck is just as pointless. I kept shooting small bucks for longer than I probably should have, and it took me a while to figure out that only hunting the first few weeks of the season, pretty much sucked. If by reading all these battles someone can make that decision to hold out for something bigger, even in areas where they may go buckless, they will get to enjoy a lot more hunting throughout the year. I would never want to eliminate the guys who are just starting out, or guys who have crappy spots or limited time from shooting what they want, it's those guys who have the kills under thier belt who are on the fence and hesitant about holding out. Those are the guys most of us here are trying to reach.

Sylvan

What so many of us are saying but you are failing to read is that we are just tired of the attitude that your hunting values are superior to others. We're tired of the arrogance. Just go out and enjoy the sport anyway you choose but for pete's sake everybody else should be able to do the same thing without somebody telling them what they should or shoudn't do. I know some of you have seeeeeeen the promised land but while you are all off marching to zion I'm going deer hunting.