does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I'd like to know what states require bowhunters to pass some sort of profficiency test with their bow prior to being validated to hunt with it.

I brought this up in the Idaho forum. I'd like to know if any states require bowhunters, or any other group of hunters, to pass any kind of profficiency test with their chosen weapon prior to being validated to hunt with that weapon.

I hope that this will not create a name calling episode, as it did on the Idaho forum. I know that there would be pros and cons to any test that may or may not be instituted. I'd like to hear opinions from all. Thanks.




Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Fla.
NO.


I am not a hunter I am a whitetail population reduction specialest

remember keep your back to the sun, your knife sharp, and your powder dry.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Washington state.

No proficiency testing.
Mandatory hunter education.

The Mouse

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

We have mandatory class in Idaho, but no mandatory shooting test. What do you guys think? Should it be required or not? I happen to like the idea. Even if the bowhunters clubs sponsored the idea instead of state mandatory. Comments?

Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Calif., no proficiency test but there is a required Hunters Education course before a hunting license can be obtained.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I'd like to know if you people would welcome a test that requires you to prove that you are profficient with your bow prior to being able to hunt with it.

Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

They all should. WI. doesn't

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I was told that Alaska has this requirement. I don't know how long they have had it, or if the hunters whined at having to pass it.

I would like to see it hear in Idaho.

Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

well bullhound we do have this education that is required. but if you had a bowstamp on your lisence prior to like 1990 you dont have to take it. i do however think that anyone who has gone through a basic hunters education class should be able to apply this same basic knowledge to any type of hunting. and yes bowhunters who shoot bad wound game. but ive seen so many rifle hunters who wound game that i think they outway the bowhunters.
ps where is this idaho forum your talkin bout

Edited by - nidahoscott on 02/22/2002 18:32:52

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

No proficiency test here in GA, just hunter education. It would be a good idea to insure that hunters can use their equiptment though.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

nidahoscott,

I agree. Maybe you didn't see that I'm from Idaho. You bring up a good point that I had meant to mention. I would welcome testing of ALL hunters. I would think that a standard could be agreed upon by each group.

Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

but if we make people prove they can shoot a bow do we then make everyone prove they can shoot a rifle,muzzleloader or even a crossbow

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Ohio has no test but does require hunter ed for new licensees. I wouldn't mind a proficiency test for both bow & gun hunters. They now limit shotguns to 3 shells. That helps cut down on the guys who start throwing lead & hoping at the sight of fur.

Phil.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

nidahoscott,

for the Idaho forum go to

http://www.bowsite.com/BOWSITE/TF/threads.cfm

Go to the "state conferences" and pick Idaho.

If you go there, beware, There are a group in Idaho that are aggressively against any sort of test. I've been slammed pretty hard by some there just for bringing up the subject.
I'm in Lewiston. Maybe we can hook up some time.

Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Are any of you guys against a required test?

If you're interested in some wild reading, go to the link I posted above, then go to the state conference link at the top right of the page. Pick Idaho and look for the "profficiency test" thread. Some of these people appear to be really afraid of any test whatsoever. They got pretty pissy about it to. I'd like to know if this is found in other states.

Get Close.......& Shoot Straight

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I don't mind wearing a seat belt, but I don,t like to be told that I have to. This is not any different, we need to keep as many freedoms as we can. Move to a different country if you want more laws.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Nebraska doesn't have this test but it sounds like a good idea. All we have is hunters education for firearms and we have seperate class for bow hunting.

"Trophies are not measured in Inches!"

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Yup, in Archery only areas you need to take a shooting and a classroom test, takes one day or 2 depending on what class you sign up for!

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Minesota doesnt have a test, just hunter saftey.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Alaska does require the shooting proficiency test for most bowhunting only areas. However, if you are a non-resident coming up to hunt a bowhunting only area, all you need is the basic IBEP or NBEF course, not the shooting portion.

I am on the fence line about the testing. In one way I think it is a great idea, but I think it is biased to single out bowhunters since just as many gun hunters wound game. I believe the Alaska Bowhunters Association inacted the proposal to mandate a proficiency shoot in Alaska. I'm not 100% certain on where or why it was derived from, but with all the complaining and whining you hear from hunters up here about unethical archers, you would think the class is worthless. Hunters spend so much time complaining up here, that they feel they need to be proactive and start limiting hunters even more by closing areas, marking arrows, limiting seasons and so on. I would encourage a more proactive stance if the citations by the game wardens proved that problems exist, but rather these people are scrambling by word of mouth.
It's a touchy subject in Alaska right now, but I strongly feel that creating more laws, and more restrictions will only hinder us as a whole, and our key to cleaning up whatever mess is out there is by enforcement. They say this area is a highly visible area, and lots of folks are seeing several violations on a single outing, yet only 2 or 3 citations were handed out to bowhunters with up to 5 wardens patrolling this "highly visible" area. Then other folks that routinly hunt this same area see no violations, no problems and enjoy the experience and the accessibility to this area. Something that other archers seem to want to limit. My thinking is if they don't like hunting there, don't go there! If people are being unethical to others, yet legal, the only way we are going to hurt ourselves it to whine about it. I don't think you can regulate ethics in this case, but some folks sure are trying!

Enough rambling about this. I just get tired of seeing more regulations, stipulations, examinations and laws put in place to limit hunters. However, I think it is a good idea to make hunters prove that they are proficient with their weapons. Can't make everybody happy in this case

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

No profficiency tests for any weapons in Iowa...I would definitely be in favor of such testing though. Hunter Ed is required for those born after 1967.


TB

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

There are a few thoughts I have on the subject of proficiency testing.

1) On the surface, it will stop people who just bought a bow or who are horrible shots from going into the woods with it until they pass the test. Which I am all for. Too many pick up a bow and immediately take it into the woods to get lucky. Or, there are those who can't hit a 3 bale high hay target butt from 15 yards doing the same.

2) On the other hand, you have those who hit the required number of kills out to 30 yards or whatever who take shots out to 60. A test won't stop that from happening.

3) I don't like giving a governmental agency that kind of power over us. It would leave bowhunters open to attack from those who would regulate us out of hunting.

To be honest, I don't know what the right decision would be. Should we ask for more regulations and laws? Should we find a way to regulate it ourselves by using bowhunters to police other bowhunters? or, Should we ignore the existing problems in hopes that they will go away or be ignored by the powers that be? Are those our only options? I have no idea where we should take this.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

ABM- THE FIRST PROFICIENCY TESTING WAS JUST THAT FOR THE HILLSIDE ANCHORAGE MOOSE HUNT AND I BELIEVE FOR THE FORT RICH HUNTS AT THE SAME TIME ( 4 SHOTS AT A BIGGER THAN LIFE SIZE MOOSE TARGET) NO CLASS... THEN THE CLASS WAS STARTED AND THE SHOOT WAS DOUBLED. AND WAS EXPANDED TO OTHER HUNTS. WE (BOWHUNTERS) GOT A BLACK EYE FROM THE HILLSIDE HUNT BECAUSE OF RIFLE HUNTERS GETTING PERMITS AND THEN BUYING A BOW. THEY PASSED THE SHOOT...SOME AFTER MANY TRYS. AND IT WAS STILL A REAL MESS ... OVER ALL I THINK IT IS A GOOD THING BUT YOU ONLY HAVE TO PASS IT ONCE AND YOU MAY NOT GET A PERMIT FOR 10-12 YEARS THEN KNOCK THE DUST OFF AND GO AFTER THE MOOSE. UNFORTUNATELY THATS HARD TO REGULATE.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

boy bullhound i found that idaho page, what a mess. and i found out i just missed my local shoot. damn. but back to the test, im gonna have to go the anti-govt perspective on this one. i think we have too many laws right now that are to hard to enforce. why make more? is this really gonna do something to make our sport better? or is it just another way for the govt to control the actions of a mainly law obiding group of people. i hope we as a group can teach our youth "the right ways" and not have someone tell us what they think is the right way.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Proficiency testing would at best give everyone a warm fuzzy feeling about the general level of expertise of the average bowhunter. At worst it would be another governmental SNAFU that creates one more brainless bureacracy headed by a political appointee who doesn't know the difference between a broadhead and a field tip.

Reality must rule. Washington state government projects a $1.6 billion (yes, billion with a B) budget deficit this year, mostly due to decrease tax revenues. There is no way that it will create an expensive program designed to eliminate marginal hunters who pay the same license and tag fees as proficient hunters.

The Mouse

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Good Idea I would like to see it in Wa. Know of 3 bulls just last year that got away and were later found dead. Also two of the bull my family shot had broadheads imbedded way back in the rump. (Pinnacle of poor shooting)

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

We don't have a test and I would not be in favor of one

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Just because you pass a test, Does not mean you are an ethical hunter! And it does not mean you will score on all your shots. Pinnicle of a poor shot comes from no practice. S*@T happens and iam not for it...

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

No but sometimes I feel that they should. I was talking to this bowhunter this past year that told me that he missed 14 deer and is still waiting to connect. Maybe we should.
But not here in NJ.

brian

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I like the idea but I am not in favor of paying higher license fees to pay the employees that have to conduct these tests statewide for all the hunters and wannabe hunters.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Yup, they call them &quot;Deer Checking Stations&quot;.<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Ok, one question. I bet nobody here supports more gun restrictions right, and with each new gun law it is said to be a small step toward taking away our guns. <font color=red>Having said that, I do not support another hunting restriction of which mandatory proficientcy testing amounts to.</font id=red>Does this sound far fetched? Down the road in a few yrs. anti-hunters or non hunters in a state legislature decide that bowhunters should be able to robin hood arrows at 20 yds. regularly!

Shooting at targets and shooting at live animals are two different things. I know a few regular 3D shooters who react differently in hunting situations. Education, guidance, and experience makes for good hunters. Not allowing more laws to dissuade those who want to hunt.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I will not write a long response to the question, only that I feel it is totally absurd to require proficiency testing. I know of a few people who are great on a 3-d course but miss deer after deer every year. all we need is more regulations and big government. PLEASE!!<img src=icon_smile_evil.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_sad.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

hey Nimrod. From another instructors standpoint, welcome to the Haul Road hunt and also the Fairbanks Managment area hunt. I have failed on avg 2-3 a shoot that do just that, you think people would learn! The class-shooting test isnt ment to fail, its ment to teach, if it takes more restrictions to police ourselves up, then so be it. I would rather it be hunters/outdoorsmen and women watching out for our image, then some yahoo peta fan trying to police ourselves up using ballot box initiaves....oh wait, that is about to come too.....by by black bear baits!

Jerry, WORD OF MOUTH LMAO!!!! Sorry dude we went round and round about it, thought you knew better! Oh well.....

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

I used to teach IBEF Hunter Safety Classes. On the day of the shoot(broadheads at unknown distances..usually not beyond 28 yards) it always amazed me. We instructed and taught what we were looking for. We stressed we wanted to see your hunting rig and set up. First thing we did was inspect the bows. We had a couple we wouldn't let shoot because the equipment was unsafe (broken strands on string etc etc). Some would show up with inserts missing(not all just one or something). Then it amazed me how poorly some of the bows were tuned. You could look and see nocks 3/4 of an inch too high or low, feathers missing, rest broke ... all kinds of wierd stuff. And shooting, there was always someone how couldn't hit a deer at 10 or 15 yards because of tune, form, panic etc. We'd pull them aside, play with equipment and let the nervous jervous shoot alone when others were done. Sometimes it made all the difference. Maryland doesn't require Bowhunter Safety Courses... just the regular hunter safety to get a license. I would have no problem with it being mandatory if the keep the politicians and special interest groups out of it and let the certified instructors handle it. Our course is of course recognized world wide and we give it so people traveling to states requiring it can have it. A lot of our students came across the border from PA. We had a lot of father/son attendees.

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

It is word of mouth from hunters. Some of them are so tied up in a single incident like the truck door being torn off by a trucker. I would almost bet that it WASN'T an accident from the truckers stand point! But, it is made to sound like it happens all the time. People shooting from on the road, is a proficiency exam going to help that problem? The only thing that will is enforcement. Put new laws in? The only thing that will do is create another law that the slobs will break. Who do you hurt by doing that? Hunters as a whole.
I've talked to the locals up here, I've talked to the truckers, I've talked to the interior wildlife protection officers out of Fairbanks, I've talked and polled several hunters that regularly use the Haul Road and from what I'm hearing, the incidents that are happening are few and far between, but of course you hear about them more than anything else up here. I think it isn't as massive of an issue as some people make it sound, but some folks either feel so passionate towards it, or have their own agendas, that they feel they need to give up hunting real estate, throw in new laws, make new proficiency exams, and so on, opening new doors for anti's or the government to put new restrictions on us. What's next, will we have an &quot;authorized&quot; IBEP instructor ****** us on hunts?

You can sit around and LYAO, think that I know what you feel I should know, but in my opinion, I think the public in the publics eye that you so mentioned before is other hunters that complain about the unethical yet legal acts of other hunters.

We have come up with alternative ideas for cleaning up slobs not only on the Haul Road, but throughout the state. Just as Wahya said,
&quot;Should we find a way to regulate it ourselves by using bowhunters to police other bowhunters?&quot;
I think that is a lot better step towards cleaning up our supposidly scarred image internally, rather than put new restrictions on us.

Prove to me that it isn't word of mouth. AK Nimrod has spent a good amount of time on the road and has only witnessed one or two illegal acts, I've been on the road nearly 130+ days in the last two years and have seen one illegal act, I could go on. The wardens say there were 2 or 3 violations handed out last season on the Haul Road. Where's the proof that it is not word of mouth?

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

hmm....2nd hand knowledge is no different then telling a trooper whats going on! If it was just one or two people, ya then I would pass it off as just someone with an agenda..but sorry, I hear it to often. The reason you dont hear about it...look at the people you are talking to!

Define how bowhunters are going to clean up bowhunters without restrictions, I would be for it in a heart beat!

Also turning in between 1-2 GROUPS of &quot;hunters&quot; on the avg up there PER TRIP! This last one was uneventful..granted we drove at nite so its kinda hard to catch someone doing illegal activity then! Also NOT ALL OF THEM ARE JUST BOWHUNTERS! I think that is something you fail to understand! I still dont agree with the 1/4 corridor cleaning it up but I do see the problem the fellas proposing it see's! THen again, I dont see you with a rebuttle other then on here!

I would be there is a TON more then 1-2 violations up there!!! I know of one personally so I just happen to see 50% of the violaters? Also get past pump 2 more often! We've already gone round and round about that! Get by glabreth and toolik lakes where MOST of the &quot;hunting&quot; occurs!

Did ya call the troopers in COldfoot or make the trip to happy valley? Also ask who is policing the road instead of flying out to check the guides and drop off hunters!!! I think Curt was doing most of the road plus the 2 or 3 troopers on wheels that I did run into!

Thats just the ILLEGAL side of the house...no look at the UNETHICAL side of the house! It all adds up....and yes I will LMAO when you cant hunt after work <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>!

RE: does your state require you to prove you can shoot
 

Here's my take on required preliminary testing...at first it sounds good,but think about it for a minute.Just imagine for a second what we are talking about here.Do you realize how expensive and mired with problems such a program would be!!Who is going to do the testing?Our wildlife and fisheries department is struggling with it's available personnel to try to enforce the laws that ALREADY exist.If not them,then who?Some other state agency?What guidelines are you to establish?When and where will the testing take place?How about out of state hunters?Which states law will take precedence?I agree with Cougar Mag on this one.You can test a bowhunter,or a gun hunter(shot-gun,rifle,bp),but this is not going to say that hunter,who may have performed flawlessly on the testing grid,is going to be able to cut it when he is under real hunting conditions,is it?Hunters,and I mean all of us have to police ourselves.You are the only one who knows your abilities and we have to be big enough to admit it when we are not up to the task at hand.Respect for the animals that you hunt is what it all boils down to.If you have it,then you will hunt ethically,with ethical hunters,and not try to do something that is above your ability.If you don't have it,then you don't belong in the woods in the first place.Don't yall agree?That's where I stand..........
Good huntin'.........whackman