Chaoselite

Greetings fellow hunters,

I recently purchased these impact enhancement things called slide hammers. These things go inside of your arrow to increase penetration. I shoot a Bowtech Tomkat and carbon express arrows. These things are the real deal. They have a facebook page https://www.facebook.com/NewAgeArcheryProducts and I ordered them from www.newagearcheryproducts.com apparently they will be in stores soon

bowdaddy1964

Sorry but I'm calling B.S.
Do the math. If your shooting 250fps then that arrow going 3000 inches per second will be laying on the ground after going through the deer and the weight doesnt come into play in the shot at all. And if you do lodge a broadhead into a bone, this gimmic wont do anything weight wise to help ,other than throwing your FOC way outta wack.

Chaoselite

I am not sure why I am even responding to this. Here it goes, just do the math like you said. Its been scientifically proven to work already. 5 years in the making. You don't have to buy it...obviously, but you are incorrect in your response. Think force. Essentially what your implying is if I shoot a target with an arrow lets say it penetrates 8 inches. Now with the slide hammer your also implying it will penetrate 8 inches. You have to take into account how force works. The slide hammer will penetrate much further every single time if you have your testing set up correctly because penetration measurement is very variable. Its already been shown hundreds of times to many researchers and hunters alike. You have no idea what this does to bone because you have not used it, so I suggest researching more into it before you falsify a product. An opinon is much different, but from what you wrote your falsifying a product proven to work. Of course many people will be leary on the product much like when carbon arrows first came out, that is understandable, however, carbon arrows are now very popular now. You will see by next year how this product will revolutionize the arrow industry. Arrow manufacturers can now make lighter arrows without sacraficing kinetic energy by using this product. Again it has already been proven to major manufacturers all of which made offers on partnerships and to purchase this product. More importantly this device also provides secondary impact and arrow flight stabailization two key points you missed sir which I should have included in my initial post, I apologize. It is very far from a "gimmick" that was pretty rude of you to say.

Psylocide

So... how long have you been selling these?

It would be cool to see those test results if they're available, but I've got a hard time seeing that it would make a huge difference. How much does the sliding part of the "slide hammer" weigh?

Chaoselite

Greetings Psylocide,

I do not work for this company. I work for an outdoors company with stores across the US. We are working on getting these in our stores. It was my mistake I did not include all of the benefits of this. It provides secondary impact and arrow flight stabilization as well. We did some testing here and I know that the company that sells them did it more on a large scale and ended up getting a patent after it was successful. I am confident you will see more proof within the next year once it hits the larger market. All of my information is from research and talking with manufactures of arrows and this company.

Psylocide

Gotcha... well, you're going to draw a lot of skepticism with your first posts on this site hailing the effectiveness of this add-on, and your links to "their" site in the first post is probably the most telling.

But, that aside... I'm still skeptical as to the actual usefulness of these. If you're getting pass-throughs with your current setup, then the "extra kick" from the slide hammer isn't going to make much of a difference. Also, if you hit bone... I'm not sure the slide hammer would be the difference between busting through or lodging/bouncing off.

Basically, one would need to see a control with ballistics gel and bone, same broadheads, same bow, same weight arrow (I'm assuming you would have to add weight to the non-slide hammer arrow) and then fire the same shots with the slide hammer. Would be interesting to see.

Chaoselite

All that testing has been done as I said you'll see. Your forgetting arrow flight stabilization as well

10Point1985

I had to make an account to correct all of you I was actually searching for gun slide hammers...wierd. First off you all are very wrong on penetration. You CANNOT measure penetration. Impossible. Now Arrow flight stabilization sure, secondary impact obviously, but do you really need that secondary impact? I would like to try this thing out what stores are they going to be in?

Edit: As far as bone....I mean lets get real here no way. Although I didn't see the op say it penetrates bone I saw he wrote "you don't know what it does to bone as you have not used it"

bowdaddy1964

Still calling B.S. And I dont care if you like it! It's my opinion. And if these are going to set the archery industry on fire I would need more facts than your opinion. Just saying. I'll keep my money, make only well placed shots or not at all, and check back next year when you insist all will be better for me.

Chaoselite

Unreal. One would think you would be excited about this new innovation with your many years of bowhunting, not degrading the product. How do you figure I am not providing facts. In your first post your implying weight has no factor in an arrow going through a deer, your saying speed is the factor...come on really? That right there tells me how much you actually know about the science behind bowhunting. Your wrong and it is unreal that you don't know this but, it's momentum that is the main factor, theres no argument to that whatsoever. In your opinion you are saying the slide hammer doesn't do anything for penetration, force, kinetic energy, momentum, arrow stabalization, or secondary impact? All of these have already been proven and that is why it is patented. Who is going to waste time and money on a patent for something that doesn't work. I will even give you the force formula....force = mass x acceleration, the kinetic energy formula 1/2MV^2. Most importantly the definition of momentum which is the most important part of penetration - A measure of the motion of a body equal to the product of its mass and velocity. Also called linear momentum. The slide hammer has mass, and it moves within the arrow therefore it has acceleration/velocity, do you agree the slide hammer has weight(mass) and moves in the arrow(acceleration/velocity)? This means it has kinetic energy, it has force, and it has momentum. It is in the arrow therefore it also effects the arrows kintetic energy, force, and momentum upon impact. So are you going to tell me now that the slide hammer has no mass or acceleration/velocity? Because by saying you want proof and you don't believe that it effects force, kinetic energy, and momentum you are basically saying the product has no mass or acceleration/velocity. Plain and simple the slide hammer will add more kinetic energy, force, and momentum to your setup. What else can this do well a light arrow does not have as much kinetic energy, force, and momentum as a heavy arrow. You can still go with that light arrow and use the slide hammer to increase your kinetic energy, force, and momentum, or simply just increase the kinetic energy, force, and momentum in your heavy arrow/current setup. Your speed will still be very good, however, keep in mind its momentum that should be your concern not speed. Were not shooting deer at 60 yards away. I have seen bows still shoot over 300 fps with this product. I can not stress enough not only is the slide hammer providing this it is also providing stability and secondary impact.

Your still going to tell me this has no effect? "Just do the math" As far as arrow flight stabilization well...that can be measured/seen and has been. It is a weight in the back of the arrow which helps stability, it moves forward upon impact. Secondary impact well it speaks for itself...I am done arguing because no matter what I say your to stubborn to realize the obvious facts and mathmatical calculations. Your proof that you seek is sitting here right in front of you. Do you have to buy this product, no you don't. Your entitled to that and I respect that you are part of bowhunting, something I love. I also respect you for all the years you have put into bowhunting. Thank you for being part of a great tradition. To sit here and say theres no proof and it wont do this or that well that is just you being stubborn because its obvious that the way this product reacts in an arrow will do all of these things. From all of your years experience I think you already know this, but I think you are hot headed and stubborn as well, so you will never admit you were wrong. Its like saying a bow doesn't shoot arrows, or a gun doesn't shoot bullets. I don't know how else to make this more clear to you.

Edit: An interesting take on speed vs momentum by T-Bone http://www.realtree.com/hunting/arti...ed-vs-momentum