A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

You just can' t argue that there are varying degrees of " trophies" . A little bitty plastic trophy that you get when you finish a season of T-Ball is nothing like winning the World Series Pennant. A plaque for flag football pales in comparison to a superbowl ring. Bragging rights for winning a round of putt-putt is a joke standing next to a guy sizing up his green jacket after winning The Masters. Winning a go-kart race at your local county fair is meniscule when compared to winning the Winston Cup. So to say that every animal taken with a bow is a " trophy" is not completely accurate IMO.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I think the " trophy" is all in the individual hunters eye. To some, just taking meat for the freezer is a well deserved trophy. To others, taking their first buck is a trophy. To those that want a large buck, that is their trophy if they get one. I have seen some friends take their first buck with bow, or even their first doe and be just as proud of it as a guy getting a world record.

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RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Definately a valid point but to some, they' ll never drive a NASCAR, never play in the Masters, Super Bowl or World Series so small trophies from the local fair might just have to be enough but I know what your saying as well.

If, and I mean if all the small bucks were allowed to grow, everyone would be shooting Booners, then what defines a trophy if all animals are 160 plus......then even 160' s would be too small, you' d have to have over a 200 to make trophy status.....I know if I shoot a 125 this year, it' ll be my best and I' ll be proud to call it a trophy whitetail to me and make book but it fails in comparison to the Hanson, Beatty, Zaft bucks... and for now, I can live with that....I' m always trying to outdo the last one I shot and I think that sets a good standard for everyone......it' s like the letoff....where is the line defined?

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

When a hunter fills his/her tag and is proud enough to brag about it, show off the pictures, mount it on the wall: It' s a Trophy period.

When a Hunter fills someone elses tag with a buck or bull. It is no longer a trophy, it is a hunter getting piggy.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I guess where I' m going with this is that I hate to see the impatient, lucky Joe hunter, that has the " brown it' s down" mentality, that doesn' t do much prep work or work at all to kill a deer but yet wants to criticize " trophy" hunters at the same time claiming that any deer killed with a bow is a trophy.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Wolfen,

I hear ya and your right. I feel it' s harder to take a mature matriarch doe than it is to take a 1.5 year old buck sporting good antlers...at times, I feel these young deer are just plain stupid....I' ve seen them do some stupid things for sure and I' ve never seen an old seasoned doe do stupid things, she' s very purposeful, much like a veterern mature buck. Tho I won' t criticize someone for taking a 4 pt, I sometimes wonder why they don' t wait and I' ll congratulate each and every person who chooses to do so, via lack of time, first timers or whatever....like I mentioned, I always try to out do last years animal and that sets a standard....like last year, I passed up some very nice animals just because they didn' t beat my 2001 animal...it was hard and I didn' t take a buck last year....that doesn' t bother me, I' m hoping all the ones I passed have another year of antler growth.

If someone burns a tag on the first buck they see, they' ll never have the what if opportunity of that once in a lifetime buck coming by the next time they hunt....that for sure is a garuantee.....you have be in the tree in order to harvest a mature animal and if we tag out on a small one, we won' t have the opportunity.

That being said, if someone takes a 4 pt, wants to post a pic and tell us the story....I' ll be the first one to congratulate that person, eargerly read the story and enjoy the pic......under the understandment it' s a good quality field shot....MATT, where are you with the quality photo thread.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Wolfen I hunt strictly in Va. and I will be honest and say that any deer with a bow is a trophy to me, as you say there are different sized trophies and some that mean more than than others.

Depending upon where you hunt a monster buck may only score 120 while there are other places where a 120 buck is not considered any more than average.

Another thing to consider is the number of deer you are allowed to kill in certain areas, an example is right here in Va., we can legally take 3 bucks and over 100 does, I am not saying I could do that, but there are a ton of deer here. I am not a " Trophy" hunter, there is one spot I hunt right now that there is only one buck I would take there and as a result I will let every doe and small buck walk hoping for the big boy to pay me a visit, I only hunt it once a week just to keep the pressure off.

One thing to remember is one mans trash is another mans treasure, the same holds true for trophies.:D

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Amen to that brother - get that post up quick:D:D

I hate - and I mean HATE pickup truck pictures - damn that irritate me[>:]

Garbage in the backround and...........O.K. I will wait for Matts post:) ;)

Oh - the trophy thing.....

The greatness of any trophy is in direct proportion to the amount of work and sacrifice one endures to achieve it. The size of any trophy casts a shadow only as long as the road it takes to reach it. When the road is long and hard the trophy is great, and the satisfaction is even greater, no-matter what size animal lays at your feet.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Sorry Wolfen but I will have to disagree with you entirely.

Although what you say is true, it is completely unrealistic for virtually every single person in the world. Even the World Series champs may take great pride in a trophy won in a dune buggy race that was held in some obscure part of the country. No, it' s not NASCAR, but it is the best they' ve done in their endeavours.

Don' t try to tell my 5 year old that his T-ball trophy is meaningless. His face shone like the sun when he received it last year; it still sits on his shelf today and I still see him admiring it from time to time.

My greatest, albeit meaningless trophies, were from 1983 when I was top scorer and MVP in my hockey league up in Northern Ontario. Stanley Cup? I think not.

As for deer, the other forum states that if you wouldn' t be proud of what you shot, why did you? Perfectly said.

My very first deer was a small eight pointer (one tine broken off) that measured out around 115. I couldn' t see how big he was when I shot, but I am still proud to this day of my first deer! How lucky am I that I was able to harvest a buck the first time? From what I' ve read, many guys have waited a lot longer than 2 years to see their first buck let alone bag one. Also, this small buck weighed in at 182 lbs field dressed. Not bad, eh?

My second deer was 4 days later. How about that luck? It was an absolutely beautiful 10 pointer that was almost perfectly symmetrical and scored out just less that 130. It was field dressed at 200 lbs even, only 12 lbs heavier than the first.

I am equally proud of both animals. They have provided a great deal of meat for my family' s nutrition and made for a tremendously successful 2002 hunting season.

I am not trying to start a p*ssing contest with you, just thought I' d share my two cents.

Happy Hunting.

Mike

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Every deer is not a trophy and every hunt is not successful.

That being said, " trophy" qualifications seem to be about as individual as people themselves. Some deer are trophies under any conditions(1sts, record book, trad. gear, etc) Other times when you can whack a doe nearly at will and you have dozens of deer under your belt, that deer really ain' t a " trophy" ... its food. I can take a trophy buck for my area, that doesn' t get a second look in kansas.....that' s fine. I feel the word " trophy" has to maintain some form of integrity otherwise its meaningless. You can' t limit it to only world class deer, but you sure can' t include every deer into tht category as well.

As long as someone is proud and happy when they take a deer, their choice of what word to describe it is merely a matter of vocabulary. The ones that bug me are guys who don' t need meat, because they can and do shoot several does, but continue to shoot a small buck, just for the fact that it is a buck. Their only reason is to just say they got one. That doesn' t sit well with me.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

wolfen, you go tell that 6 year old that his t-ball trophy doesn' t mean anything. When you' re done with that tell a 12 year old with his first doe it isn' t a trophy and feel good about yourself doing it. Your right, to the general public they aren' t but how realistic is it to expect that everyone will play in the super bowl or shoot a 160 class deer? That is sure the way to get new hunters involved, have all of us with some experience degrade them for their lack of it.

Travis

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Taxman and FFTJ...Well boys, it must be in the genes because when my 6 year old daughter got her trophy this year at " trophy day" she was pissed because it was plastic and generic.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Well said Wimp!

Amen Rack!

My opinion is.....if it means something to YOU, and measures up to YOUR self imposed standards.... then by all means shoot it and call it a Trophy. If you wouldn' t consider it a Trophy, and be proud of it...(assuming it' s a buck) let him go so he can grow.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I guess you have never seen a kids face light up when they get that little league trophy.

Those last three letters say it all IMO

I' ve seen a couple guys turn into complete jerks because of trophy hunting.

My back is totally screwed up again, most likely won' t be able to hunt this year. Being able to get out in the woods and take a doe would mean as much to me as shooting any of the deer I have on my wall.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Wolfen I don' t feel it is in the genes, I feel it is the way a child is raised. A little story to prove my point, I grew up across the street from Jim Barbe, he pitched the first perfect game ever in little league, he had more trophies than you could shake a stick at. His dad pushed him like a dog, Jim went to colledge on a baseball scholarship then played 2 years in the minor leagues, he had gone from pitcher to third baseman by this time because he had a hot bat. Well they pulled him up to the big leagues (I wish I could remember what team)! Well he played one season and quit! I run into him about 15 years ago and asked him why? You know what he told me? He told me it was all because of his dad, he said he grew to hate the game because to his dad it was all about the glory, the being the best, it was no longer fun! He told me that his dad had ruined the younger years of his life because unless he was the top dog and won the top prize he was a loser!

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Tazzer, I agree with you that too much pressure on a kid is a bad thing but buddy I promise you, she came up with this comment all on her own. I was the coach but I made no comments about the trophies. ;)

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Taz - great story!

My closest friend who I have known for over 30 yrs has the same exact story - only with hockey. But the outcome was the same

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

wolfen I will be honest and tell you that all 3 of my older kids won so many trophies playing sports over the years that when they moved out the stinkers left them!!!! There were for about 5 or 6 years three big cardboard boxes stuffed with them, when I got ready to move I called them and told them to get them or they were going to the dump! They went to the dump. What killed me was how proudly they displayed them in thier rooms and the living room and then they meant nothing. I have several plaques given to me over the years for coaching and those still mean something to me, mainly memories.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

LOL at your last comment Wolfen!:D

I know for sure that one day that T-ball trophy will fall away to some other newer, more special trophy. I was simply saying that a true " trophy" is in the eyes of the beholder.

A guy that' s been fortunate enought to shoot a 160 class should never consider himself to be higher or mighter than my 130 10 point. Same way, a World Series champ should never be condescending to someone else who' s proud of his little league championship.

Kudos, by the way, to taking my comments as they were intended! [:-]

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

So getting a plastic, generic trophy somehow tarnished the acts she made to gain it? Was she expecting a silver cup? Hunting is going to go by the wayside someday because everyone feels it' s necessary to kill a 150 class buck to prove their manhood to other hunters rather than enjoy the challenge of simply hunting. Hopefully you used the situation to teach your daughter that it' s not the trophy that matters but the fun she should have while participating.

Travis

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Travis...of course I did. She is a great daughter but quite a pistol. Her comment brought a grin to my chin for sure. But as far as the point to my post goes, I maintain that there are differences in trophy deer and a guy who shoots the first deer he sees and claims it' s a trophy because he is too lazy, incompetent, or impatient to put forth any more effort but then will come on this thread and bash me for ruining the sport of hunting because I " trophy" hunt pisses me off as well.

Of course I understand the hunters who don' t have great land or great herds to hunt or who are disabled etc etc...that' s not what I' m speaking to.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

wolfen just a question out of curiosity, if you hunted in area with a high population of deer and you were allowed 3 bucks a years and a ton of doe, would you take the first 2 mature bucks you saw and save the third tag for the trophy or would you just go for the trophy?

Do you eat venison or do you strictly hunt for the bragging rights?

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Tazman...First off, I would hate my state wildlife dept if they allowed 3 bucks per year and if they did I would not shoot that many. But to answer your question in a hypothetical manner, my goal is my goal with bucks and I would not make any exceptions. I would also shoot does to maintain the health of the herd. And as far as your next question, " Do you eat venison or do you strictly hunt for the bragging rights?" I' m somewhat offended at what you may be insinuating.[:' (] If you' re not going to eat it then why kill it? That' s a bit sacraligous if you ask me. [X(]

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I' m in 100% agreement with Wolfen on this one.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Wolfen and some others obviously have different views then some about what is a trophy. They are lucky enough to live in areas that have deer in the size and age structure for which they feel good about taking an animal. Unfortunately the list of states that equals or is better than Kansas for antler size is VERY small. Here in the Northeast a Wolfen type hunter would have to accept only scoring on a " trophy" every couple of years or pay the money to travel a bit.

Wolfen when you say something like that it kind of contradicts your point though, he has a valid question, you sometimes wobble between the taking of a deer for horns or for food. You say you shoot does for food but won' t shoot a small buck for venison because you want big horns. You do realize many states and areas only allow 1 deer a year so what would you do? Shoot a doe for food, small legal buck for food or wait for a wall hanger and risk no venison? Just curious what would you do?

Tazman .. your kids may not have realized what they lost with those trophies that are now in the dump for a few years yet. But if they are anything like me and my siblings ... they will later when they realize they are gone.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I bowhunt a lot in the fall, in addition to attending college full time and working part time. If I go out and shoot a doe the first time out this year, I' ll consider it a trophy. Yeah it would be great to hunt where there are numerous mature deer, but sometimes it isn' t possible. Using your example, what happens if you earn $50,000 a year, and some guy earns $500,000. Would it be right for him to call your money and life " chump change" , because he earns way more? No, it is sometimes the circumstances. Being very busy, if I harvest a nice doe or buck, it' s a trophy to me, regardless of what someone else who hunts all fall on managed trophy land may say.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I don' t have a dictionary handy but using the MSWord Thesaurus-

Trophy:
memorial of victory
prize
memento
award
citation

I think the first one says it all. It is a memorial. It has to do with the road to get there and the battle that day in the field. I can' t go out today and play in the superbowl, I have to do my time and earn the chance. the playoffs etc. so yes this has a longer road and is a bigger prize because fewer have the chance,

If taking a large buck required a long trail of shooting smaller bucks it may mean more. But anyone " could' walk out their back door and kill a world record with with their first arrow shot.

IF you can' t tell me a good story it is only an impressive animal not a trophy.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

This sounds like the argument short people make. " We aren' t short we are vertically challanged" No matter what you call it short is short.

We have terms that quantify trophys for people. P&Y, SCI, B&C, etc. The " Trophy" itself is irelivent. The symbol is just that.

In deer hunting it' s the same thing. I could go out drop 5,000 on a hunt, shoot a 180 class buck in the guts, have a guide and some others go out and track him, find him 4 days later, cut off the head and mount it on the wall. Trophy?

Or I could be a guy with a second hand bow, hunting public land, three kids, not a lot of extra time or cash, shoot a forker at 15 yards, bring my kids out to help track him after a couple of hours, take some pictures with the family, show them how to take care of the meat and animal. Put the pictures on the wall, remind them of the hunt when we eat the meat. Trophy?

Are some of you arguing that we should be more PC about this word?

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Hey!! That' s me :) Trophy? You betcha. Hell, I cherish the time being out in the woods, the kill is secondary. I' d much rather eat a 2 year old moose than a monster anyway. Too me it' s all about the quality of the eating.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

To me, it' s comical when a person thinks a P&Y score makes him a better hunter--as if he actually grew the antlers in the first place.

But hey, I still enjoy hearing folks declare their hunting prowess for killing a " book buck" that they' ve scouted all year from their sofa via a trail camera. I really crack up when they brag about shooting it from 30' in the air, wrapped in half a dozen layers of Scent-Mummy clothing, with 80% letoff, an electronic sight, a mechanical release, and a laser rangefinder, while the deer was standing in the middle of a puddle of doe-whiz while en route to a chum pile or food plot.

Then again, if that' s your thing...

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

JRW, WOW[:o] Way to put into perspective.....lol

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

JRW............LMAO!;)

What about the hunter who has put in many hours of time, I mean real hard hunting time without getting a shot at a specific animal he was after, BUT then while hunting............ a huge animal unknown to the hunter in the area just happens to come by. The hunter kills that large unknown to the area buck.............is that any less of a trophy?

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

In my opionion, espically in bowhunting, a deer killed is a trophy. The amount of time and effort spent to get the point of " experiencing" bow hunting, and taking that particular animal, is well worth stating it is a trophy. It is all about being able to follow thru on the opportunity to take such a wonderful animal.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

I' m one of those guys who doesn' t have access to the great trophy spots, but still holds out for mature deer to harvest--and bucks have to be 8 points or better with a very nice rack in order to make MY grade. I didn' t even shoot a buck last year because all of the bucks with-in range were too small for MY personal standards.

Some hunters don' t have the access, the experience,the equipment, or the skill needed to wait for Mr. Big to come by--especially when he might not even exist in their hunting area. I' m not going to denigrate their deer which they may value very highly. Some hunters try very hard, but it' s just not going to happen for them--just like many novice athletes.

My son was told on his first hunt to not shoot baby deer. He spent the entire first evening with a fawn under him which he just watched. His first kill was a nice 8 point which just made P&Y.

I wish everyone would pass the younger deer and let ' em grow, but I can' t tell someone who worked very hard and ended the season with a small deer that his deer was insignificant and not a trophy because it' s score wasn' t high enough.

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JRW...I think you' re comical and lucky that last year or whenever it was you shot a nice buck. FYI, I don' t use trail cameras, scent lock, laser range finders, 80% letoff, electronic sights, or even treestands sometimes. You have a deranged, misinformed, unjustified, and unhealthy view of me and any trophy hunter that I know. I work my arse off to get what I get and despite what you or others believe, there is not a PY or better buck behind every tree in the midwest and yes it does take more skill to harvest a mature buck consistently vs. killing an immature deer every year and I certainly don' t get one every year or let alone every trip to the tree stand. It' s sad that you are missing so much yet are so vocal and outrageous in your views...loud and dumb is a dangerous thing to be.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

By the way folks please read all the posts before posting....I already explained that this doesn' t apply to disadvantaged hunters, including those that have horrible populations of deer from which to hunt.

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Why do you guys feel it' s necessary to pass judgement on what constitutes a quality hunt or quality deer to everybody else. If you' re offended by someone calling a smaller deer a trophy you need to get a life. If this thread was " What do you think is a trophy" I wouldn' t have a problem with stating your personal requirements. This is just another thread that turned into an arguement about who' s better than who. The biggest challenge we have facing hunting today is non-hunter ignorance. They see 50 hunters calling 50 other hunters names because they don' t conform to one' s personal ideas of good hunters and this really leaves them with a bad impression of hunters in general. They are turned off to the whole deal. Then you have new hunters who read the original post and are turned off because the people they look to for guidance and support slam them for not killing a monster buck every year. If you want to give your personal opinion of a trophy by all means do it but don' t make others feel bad about the choices they make.


Travis

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

W68, I don' t think JRW is talking directing towards you. I took it as a broad/general statement and a very justified one at that. You have a valid point of view with many allies, pick your convictions.;)

RE: A Trophy is Not a Trophy is Not a Trophy....
 

Wolfen,

Perhaps you thought my previous post was directed at you. Perhaps you failed to notice that I didn' t address it as such. Perhaps you took offense for some reason. And...

" By the way folks please read all the posts before posting."

...perhaps you should take your own advice. ;)


" ...despite what you or others believe, there is not a PY or better buck behind every tree in the midwest..."

Psssstttt...take a look to the left and tell me where I' m from. [:o]