Schultzy

Great post there JeffB with some excellent Info!!

GMMAT

Carbon shafts are now available with .001 tolerances (I believe that to be true). Honest question......can the avg. archer hope to gain better accuracy than these tolerances will allow?

I shot a/c/c's for a couple seasons. Great arrows....no doubt. But, again....are you paying (premium) for something you can realize?

I broke/bent more a/c/c's than I do carbons. BUT, I also don't shoot the speeds (with carbons), now, that I used to shoot. Full disclosure.

I've bought probably 4-5doz. carbon arrows in the last 2yrs.. I've broken "maybe" 3 in that time.....and I shoot thousands upon thousands of shots/yr (+/- 15K/yr). If I thought the carbon/alum. technology was a benefit, I'd buy 'em. I just don't see paying the premium. Personal opinion. NO cut on the product. Again, there's no doubting they're quality.

bigcountry

Straightness is not the the important point. In fact its actually not that important. What is most important is spine consistency and how fast an arrow looses its spine.

carbon can never be as consistent spined as aluminum. Aluminum can never be as durable as carbon wrap. Alum's loose thier spine faster than "most" carbons. Hense the marriage of ACC.

I made my spine tester. But I have tested on a RAM spine tester and was shocked how inconsistent even the higher end carbons are compared to aluminum.

GMMAT

Big....

Probably fodder for another thread.....but.......

Does any empirical evidence exist that supports carbon arrows "losing" spine? I honestly have NO idea.

Thanks.

bigcountry

You bet ya. They are only held by epoxy wrapped. I have tested it several times. I have seen cheap beman hawks loose spine in one season (measureable) and seen alum's loose them in one season.

You might not even know they lost the spine but the problem is they loose the spine differently, and groups could open up some. In other words, one arrow might loose it, another might loose more.

This is the reason I suggest to folks that they shoot the whole dozen when they get em evenly.

GMMAT

I learned something about CX Heritage arrows, last year. I had been shooting my 250's at 30" with std. insert and 145gr. FP's up front. So, when I ordered a new doz., naturally I ordered them cut to this length, and I set them up the same way.

STIFF REACTION.

Flabbergasted, I called LAS to inquire. He asked me how many times I'd shot the new shafts. Well....only enough to know they were stiff!.....lol

He told me to blank bale each shaft 30 or so times, then call him back.

30X/ea....and they're perfect.

He explained that the wood grain coating added stiffness to the arrows, and that they would weaken after about 30 shots. I would have never guessed.

I've "heard-of" carbons losing spine....but I've never seen any real data on it. So....I was/am skeptical. If you know of any articles on this....can you provide (here) or PM me the links? I'd love to read more about this. Makes me wonder if I need to worry about "shelf-life".

bigcountry

I don't think its a static issue but more of a dynamic issue. Each time they are shot, you get archers paradox. I believe, (don't know) that this is what weakens the spine.

I heard of spine getting weaker from Len in MD, so I did my own tests.

surprised too that 30 shots made that much difference.

blacktail4ever

my pesrsonal opinion is the fmj's are great for 3d they pull like butter but if you slap an arrow on anything they are pretty much toast they are a good arrow as long as you don't do anything to bend them.and be careful pulling the as you would an aluminum

bigcountry

I made one that is surprisingly accurate.

kwilson16

That's an impressive spine checker, BIGCOUNTRY. What is the correct amount of weight? 1 pound?

I wish WWAG would use his considerable mechanical experise to develop a reasonably priced spine checker. His press and CAMirror are genius.