It's Hard to Understand Some "Pro" Shops.
08-29-2009, 09:59 PM
#31
Fork Horn
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Southeastern Michigan
Posts: 225
It has been my experience over the years that any pro shop that has been in business more than 5 years will not produce crappy workmanship like Rob described in the orginial post. Otherwise they would have been run out on a rail inside of 3 years.
I don't know if you knew this guy or not, but in my experience here, quite often a customer will have monkeyed with a bow A LOT, and after toying with it to no avail, will bring it to another shop swearing up and down that they had it over at XYZ shop and they messed it all up. I guess it saves them face.
I do have a sign back by the press (hidden from public view) that reads: "ARCHERY PRO SHOP LABOR RATES: $60/HOUR.....$75/HOUR IF YOU WATCH.....$100/HOUR IF YOU HELP.... $150/HOUR IF YOU WORKED ON IT FIRST." Of course, this is meant as a joke.
I have personally seen this happen as well. I have a couple good friends who work regular jobs (one in the Navy, another a mechanic) that work over at Bass Pro in the archery department part time. They are both quite comepetent bow techs too and I'd recommend either of them to someone in a heartbeat..... and they recommend our shop to folks several times a day. Anyway, I brought one of them a new set of cams for his Hoyt he ordered and stopped by at BPS just to say hey. A guy came walking up with a newish looking 82nd Airborne and said, "I swear I'll never go to Wilcox again! They got my bow shooting all backwards. I just picked it up from there... cost me a mint.... shot it at the range and its shooting cork screws....." I held my tounge and looked the bow over. There are two main techs at our shop.... Tom... who is flat out amazing when it comes to bows.... and myself.... who ain't no slouch either. We do things exactly the same way, so that no matter which of us works on your bow... the look and quality is uniform. We tie knots and do things differently than any other shop I've ever seen.... I recognize my own work.... and considering 15 minutes prior I had been at the shop and never seen this guy or his bow before.... he was clearly full of what made the bull famous. My friend at BPS let him know as much before I asked him who he had spoken with at our shop.... he said he couldn't remember his name.... middle aged guy.... kinda tall... he said.... ... nobody like that works there...... Tom is 50 years old.... 5' 7" and bald.... and I'm 26... look like I'm 21 and I am tall. This dude, it turns out... hadn't ever hardly set foot in our place..... and yet here he was bad mouthing us..... don't know where his bow came from or who worked on it..... but it for sure wasn't who he claimed it was.
And if a Reezen and an Admiral shot the same weight arrow, at the same draw weight, and same draw length at the same speed.... either somebody or somebody's chronograph is woefully mistaking. The Admiral is the quietest, most shock free bow right out of the box I've ever shot... but it ain't no speed demon..... and its draw is stiffer than the Reezen's (thanks to its short limbs). Compared to most Mathews bows.... the Reezen is quite a departure from the norm.... and while it has grown on me a bit.... I'll still be carrying a Drenalin in the woods. Everybody has their own favorites.... and nobodys favorite is ever wrong.... variety......its the spice of life.
I don't know if you knew this guy or not, but in my experience here, quite often a customer will have monkeyed with a bow A LOT, and after toying with it to no avail, will bring it to another shop swearing up and down that they had it over at XYZ shop and they messed it all up. I guess it saves them face.
I do have a sign back by the press (hidden from public view) that reads: "ARCHERY PRO SHOP LABOR RATES: $60/HOUR.....$75/HOUR IF YOU WATCH.....$100/HOUR IF YOU HELP.... $150/HOUR IF YOU WORKED ON IT FIRST." Of course, this is meant as a joke.
I have personally seen this happen as well. I have a couple good friends who work regular jobs (one in the Navy, another a mechanic) that work over at Bass Pro in the archery department part time. They are both quite comepetent bow techs too and I'd recommend either of them to someone in a heartbeat..... and they recommend our shop to folks several times a day. Anyway, I brought one of them a new set of cams for his Hoyt he ordered and stopped by at BPS just to say hey. A guy came walking up with a newish looking 82nd Airborne and said, "I swear I'll never go to Wilcox again! They got my bow shooting all backwards. I just picked it up from there... cost me a mint.... shot it at the range and its shooting cork screws....." I held my tounge and looked the bow over. There are two main techs at our shop.... Tom... who is flat out amazing when it comes to bows.... and myself.... who ain't no slouch either. We do things exactly the same way, so that no matter which of us works on your bow... the look and quality is uniform. We tie knots and do things differently than any other shop I've ever seen.... I recognize my own work.... and considering 15 minutes prior I had been at the shop and never seen this guy or his bow before.... he was clearly full of what made the bull famous. My friend at BPS let him know as much before I asked him who he had spoken with at our shop.... he said he couldn't remember his name.... middle aged guy.... kinda tall... he said.... ... nobody like that works there...... Tom is 50 years old.... 5' 7" and bald.... and I'm 26... look like I'm 21 and I am tall. This dude, it turns out... hadn't ever hardly set foot in our place..... and yet here he was bad mouthing us..... don't know where his bow came from or who worked on it..... but it for sure wasn't who he claimed it was.
And if a Reezen and an Admiral shot the same weight arrow, at the same draw weight, and same draw length at the same speed.... either somebody or somebody's chronograph is woefully mistaking. The Admiral is the quietest, most shock free bow right out of the box I've ever shot... but it ain't no speed demon..... and its draw is stiffer than the Reezen's (thanks to its short limbs). Compared to most Mathews bows.... the Reezen is quite a departure from the norm.... and while it has grown on me a bit.... I'll still be carrying a Drenalin in the woods. Everybody has their own favorites.... and nobodys favorite is ever wrong.... variety......its the spice of life.
08-30-2009, 06:18 AM
#32
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Burke, VA (raised in MD)
Posts: 1,096
Good post Swampcollie!
I have spent a lot of time watching Tom Wilcox work on bows and he is a wizard. If you live within driving distance of Newport News, it is worth the time to go to Wilcox Bait and Tackle!
After two years of watching him, I finally figured out how to mimic his peep tying:
I have spent a lot of time watching Tom Wilcox work on bows and he is a wizard. If you live within driving distance of Newport News, it is worth the time to go to Wilcox Bait and Tackle!
After two years of watching him, I finally figured out how to mimic his peep tying:
It has been my experience over the years that any pro shop that has been in business more than 5 years will not produce crappy workmanship like Rob described in the orginial post. Otherwise they would have been run out on a rail inside of 3 years.
I don't know if you knew this guy or not, but in my experience here, quite often a customer will have monkeyed with a bow A LOT, and after toying with it to no avail, will bring it to another shop swearing up and down that they had it over at XYZ shop and they messed it all up. I guess it saves them face.
I do have a sign back by the press (hidden from public view) that reads: "ARCHERY PRO SHOP LABOR RATES: $60/HOUR.....$75/HOUR IF YOU WATCH.....$100/HOUR IF YOU HELP.... $150/HOUR IF YOU WORKED ON IT FIRST." Of course, this is meant as a joke.
I have personally seen this happen as well. I have a couple good friends who work regular jobs (one in the Navy, another a mechanic) that work over at Bass Pro in the archery department part time. They are both quite comepetent bow techs too and I'd recommend either of them to someone in a heartbeat..... and they recommend our shop to folks several times a day. Anyway, I brought one of them a new set of cams for his Hoyt he ordered and stopped by at BPS just to say hey. A guy came walking up with a newish looking 82nd Airborne and said, "I swear I'll never go to Wilcox again! They got my bow shooting all backwards. I just picked it up from there... cost me a mint.... shot it at the range and its shooting cork screws....." I held my tounge and looked the bow over. There are two main techs at our shop.... Tom... who is flat out amazing when it comes to bows.... and myself.... who ain't no slouch either. We do things exactly the same way, so that no matter which of us works on your bow... the look and quality is uniform. We tie knots and do things differently than any other shop I've ever seen.... I recognize my own work.... and considering 15 minutes prior I had been at the shop and never seen this guy or his bow before.... he was clearly full of what made the bull famous. My friend at BPS let him know as much before I asked him who he had spoken with at our shop.... he said he couldn't remember his name.... middle aged guy.... kinda tall... he said.... ... nobody like that works there...... Tom is 50 years old.... 5' 7" and bald.... and I'm 26... look like I'm 21 and I am tall. This dude, it turns out... hadn't ever hardly set foot in our place..... and yet here he was bad mouthing us..... don't know where his bow came from or who worked on it..... but it for sure wasn't who he claimed it was.
And if a Reezen and an Admiral shot the same weight arrow, at the same draw weight, and same draw length at the same speed.... either somebody or somebody's chronograph is woefully mistaking. The Admiral is the quietest, most shock free bow right out of the box I've ever shot... but it ain't no speed demon..... and its draw is stiffer than the Reezen's (thanks to its short limbs). Compared to most Mathews bows.... the Reezen is quite a departure from the norm.... and while it has grown on me a bit.... I'll still be carrying a Drenalin in the woods. Everybody has their own favorites.... and nobodys favorite is ever wrong.... variety......its the spice of life.
I don't know if you knew this guy or not, but in my experience here, quite often a customer will have monkeyed with a bow A LOT, and after toying with it to no avail, will bring it to another shop swearing up and down that they had it over at XYZ shop and they messed it all up. I guess it saves them face.
I do have a sign back by the press (hidden from public view) that reads: "ARCHERY PRO SHOP LABOR RATES: $60/HOUR.....$75/HOUR IF YOU WATCH.....$100/HOUR IF YOU HELP.... $150/HOUR IF YOU WORKED ON IT FIRST." Of course, this is meant as a joke.
I have personally seen this happen as well. I have a couple good friends who work regular jobs (one in the Navy, another a mechanic) that work over at Bass Pro in the archery department part time. They are both quite comepetent bow techs too and I'd recommend either of them to someone in a heartbeat..... and they recommend our shop to folks several times a day. Anyway, I brought one of them a new set of cams for his Hoyt he ordered and stopped by at BPS just to say hey. A guy came walking up with a newish looking 82nd Airborne and said, "I swear I'll never go to Wilcox again! They got my bow shooting all backwards. I just picked it up from there... cost me a mint.... shot it at the range and its shooting cork screws....." I held my tounge and looked the bow over. There are two main techs at our shop.... Tom... who is flat out amazing when it comes to bows.... and myself.... who ain't no slouch either. We do things exactly the same way, so that no matter which of us works on your bow... the look and quality is uniform. We tie knots and do things differently than any other shop I've ever seen.... I recognize my own work.... and considering 15 minutes prior I had been at the shop and never seen this guy or his bow before.... he was clearly full of what made the bull famous. My friend at BPS let him know as much before I asked him who he had spoken with at our shop.... he said he couldn't remember his name.... middle aged guy.... kinda tall... he said.... ... nobody like that works there...... Tom is 50 years old.... 5' 7" and bald.... and I'm 26... look like I'm 21 and I am tall. This dude, it turns out... hadn't ever hardly set foot in our place..... and yet here he was bad mouthing us..... don't know where his bow came from or who worked on it..... but it for sure wasn't who he claimed it was.
And if a Reezen and an Admiral shot the same weight arrow, at the same draw weight, and same draw length at the same speed.... either somebody or somebody's chronograph is woefully mistaking. The Admiral is the quietest, most shock free bow right out of the box I've ever shot... but it ain't no speed demon..... and its draw is stiffer than the Reezen's (thanks to its short limbs). Compared to most Mathews bows.... the Reezen is quite a departure from the norm.... and while it has grown on me a bit.... I'll still be carrying a Drenalin in the woods. Everybody has their own favorites.... and nobodys favorite is ever wrong.... variety......its the spice of life.
08-30-2009, 11:35 AM
#33
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Where the ducks don't come no more
Posts: 4,420
Good post Swampcollie!
I have spent a lot of time watching Tom Wilcox work on bows and he is a wizard. If you live within driving distance of Newport News, it is worth the time to go to Wilcox Bait and Tackle!
After two years of watching him, I finally figured out how to mimic his peep tying:
I have spent a lot of time watching Tom Wilcox work on bows and he is a wizard. If you live within driving distance of Newport News, it is worth the time to go to Wilcox Bait and Tackle!
After two years of watching him, I finally figured out how to mimic his peep tying:
Pretty work Kevin.... thats the way we roll.
08-30-2009, 11:44 AM
#34
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Where the ducks don't come no more
Posts: 4,420
Same chrono for both bows Swampie, 
It may very well be off but then it was off for both bows. Either his Reezen was a dud or my Admiral is exceptional. 
I was quite surprised. Thus my shock and wondering. I assumed the Reezen was faster, probably is but not that one. 
My chrono matches what most others say they get from their bows and what my birth certs say when my bows come in. It's a phenomenon. LOL
It may very well be off but then it was off for both bows. Either his Reezen was a dud or my Admiral is exceptional. I was quite surprised. Thus my shock and wondering. I assumed the Reezen was faster, probably is but not that one. My chrono matches what most others say they get from their bows and what my birth certs say when my bows come in. It's a phenomenon. LOL
Based on the ones I've shot (be them at 29") that admiral is about on course.... When we first got them, the one I set up and tested was shooting low to mid 280s with a 390gr arrow at 70#s, I remember doing the math and it coming out right at IBO listed speeds (which for some reason is a range of about +/- 8 fps). For a Reezen... that one is a dud..... big time. 277 at 28.5 with a high 300s gr arrow.... 65#s.... I'd of expected mid to high 280s. I have guys shooting 30" 55# Reezens with 380gr arrow weights in the upper 290s.
08-30-2009, 01:46 PM
#35
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: CT, USA
Posts: 3,058
Chronoed a 6.5 Reezen last week- 28" cam (of course they run nearly an inch long) -71 lbs- loop, tie in nock and meta peep- 393 grain arrow @ 298 FPS. Shops 351 gr arrow @ 314 FPS. Cam rotation and specs were on the money
For comparison sake, my old Admiral with meta peep, 28.5" setting (about 28.75 AMO), 71 pounds. meta peep, big loop, brass nock and stock silencers shot the shops 351 grain arrow @ 300 on the nose.
Feel of the draw for the two is pretty similar until you get into the 29 & 30" range, and then the Reezen loads up a bit more at the back end, IME. At my draw length the Admiral may be a touch smoother- hard to say- both cam systems are a PITA to draw if you ask me, and when our 30/70 Omen arrived Friday I told everyone @ the shop they can go you know what themselves
The 29/70 was bad enough and I couldn't care less how fast the 30 is (I'm the only person in the shop who doesnt have a health issue/blown out shoulders/tendonitis-so I'm the shop "draw boy" for all the heavy poundage/beastly bows)
For comparison sake, my old Admiral with meta peep, 28.5" setting (about 28.75 AMO), 71 pounds. meta peep, big loop, brass nock and stock silencers shot the shops 351 grain arrow @ 300 on the nose.
Feel of the draw for the two is pretty similar until you get into the 29 & 30" range, and then the Reezen loads up a bit more at the back end, IME. At my draw length the Admiral may be a touch smoother- hard to say- both cam systems are a PITA to draw if you ask me, and when our 30/70 Omen arrived Friday I told everyone @ the shop they can go you know what themselves
The 29/70 was bad enough and I couldn't care less how fast the 30 is (I'm the only person in the shop who doesnt have a health issue/blown out shoulders/tendonitis-so I'm the shop "draw boy" for all the heavy poundage/beastly bows)
08-30-2009, 06:19 PM
#36
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,032
i no that feeling, i took my girlfriends bow to bass pro one night just to get some pluffy silencers put on it. they tied one on the right way and zip tied the other one on. i thought i was goin to kill the guy
08-30-2009, 06:21 PM
#37
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HENDERSON KY USA
Posts: 6,634
