In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
06-17-2009, 09:20 AM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2003
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Posts: 219
In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
Let me say I am sorry for the length of this and I probably made matters worse, but I think some things needed to be said.
WoW back to this… I have experience in both areas of this discussion 1) I live in a state that is highly hunted (Michigan) and deal with the army of orange every year and it this year is it open to anyone to use a crossbow in the lower part and 2)For work, I was able to shoot and test out crossbows to the max… So I do have experience in both these matters.
I want to start off and say GMMAT is correct people where saying the same thing about the compound… Hell I remember when it from cedar arrows to alu and then from alu. to carbon and people where raising hell about that… The fact of the matter is crossbows have been a form of hunting for 1000’s of years.
Some of the arguments on here are at best baseless. For example, I have personally killed some monsters in Ohio during archery season where crossbows have been fully legal for sometime. The hunting is still good. Some are saying crossbows can shoot 60-70 yards… well maybe but its not its design or intent with the exception of one crossbow (the tactical PSE) they are made for 30-40yards tops. To exceed yardage of 60-70 yards you still need to practice A LOT. Just like the guys I personally know that can shoot their compounds accurately to 70+yards… Hell at last years ATA Rage did a 100 yard contest. Our compounds can shoot accurately to 100yards.
PABuck hunter is also correct… Instead of coming together we argue about what is the right gear to use… In all people need to grow up and stop being selfish thinking this is their woods and crossbows are going to ruin hunting… if crossbows aren’t your forte don’t use it… some people don’t like shotguns and only hunt with muzzleloaders… some people don’t like guns so they only shoot bows… some people don’t care the type of gear they are using… the goal is to take an animal and they use whatever means that are legal. DEAD is DEAD whether it is from a double lung arrow, bolt, or slug.
I did get a good laugh from Windwalker (sorry I have to call you out on this)… with the impudent statement of “Many of these new crossbow hunters will lack an understanding of what is involved in getting a deer with a bow. Many won't take the time that is needed. Just grab the crossbow and head to the woods.
Crossbows make it easy because the can be used by anyone. This includes lazy hunters. The kind of guys that will wound a deer and give up looking after a few minutes, guys that aren't that dedicated to archery hunting and who were rifle hunters all their lives.
Many that don't understand the kind of dedication that archery hunting requires, will be taking to the woods this fall. They don't understand blood trailing or even the importance of proper body angle with archery gear.”
I can tell you this with my PSE X force of 101 airborne shooting 300+fps and newbie can sight in one pin and be good to 30 yards… our compounds are soo technically superior that the manufactures made it easy on all of us with three shot center shot finders rest (NAP) quick spins for accurate arrows… the list goes on. It is not like the old days of having a pin for 10, 20, and 30. So I will say if you can draw 50 pounds and shooting a new age bow with the newest equipment anyone can use a compound…
Windwalker is correct however that lazy hunters give ALL hunters bad names… well how do you cure that one might ask? Well with education… education takes money, money comes from increase license sales, increased license sales comes from getting more people involved… (do I have to keep spelling it out) But to say that crossbow hunters won’t know what it is like to track blood or the proper angle to shoot a deer HAHAHAHAHA you are still shooting a bow it just happens to be horizontal not vertical.. It still has a bolt or if it is easy to comprehend a little arrow with a boardhead on it. And when you shoot a deer with it, the deer doesn’t just drop it still caused two holes and the deer tend to run away and the only way to find them is to follow the blood.
People…brothers in the hunting community STOP fighting with each other STOP making ignorant comments like… anyone who can afford a crossbow will just fling arrows around…. I have been in enough archery shops and bars hearing deer stories and there are idiots that use all weapons not just exclusively to crossbows. It comes to education. We need to stick together not fall apart… We have bigger issues to worry about… For example there is a pending supreme court case that just might make it illegal to posses any video or picture of an animal that was taken legally but picture or video is in a place where is it illegal for example Windwalkers photo of that Moose (nice moose by the way) would be illegal to post. Because living in Michigan it is illegal to kill a moose and since I can view it where it is illegal to hunt it will be considered flaunting animal cruelty… I am not making this up read for yourself.
Can't We Just Get Along?
A case headed for the United States Supreme Court has the potential to make it illegal to show "depictions of animal cruelty" - this one is supported by the government and the HSUS and pitched as an anti-dogfighting measure.
It isn't. It's about a 69-year old man with no criminal record facing three years in jail for making a film about pit bulls. The conviction was overturned by the Third Circuit Court of Appeals, which said the federal law against "depictions of animal cruelty" was unconstitutional. The government appealed the case, and it's now headed to the Supreme Court.
Taken to its logical conclusion, this case has the potential to make it a felony to take, sell or publish images of hunting, fishing, trapping, and virtually anything else that's ruled as a "depiction of animal cruelty".
I've long been an opponent of kill shots on television, but the idea of criminalizing an entire industry bothers me far worse than graphic hunting videos. If you don't want to watch, change channels has always been a policy that's worked at our house.
Yesterday, a big push was made across the outdoor media to seek signatures for an amicus brief to be filed with the Supreme Court concerning this case. So there's a good chance you're more than likely to hear more about this case in your local media until it gets its day in the Supreme Court.
We'll keep you posted on this one, too.
--Jim Shepherd
WoW back to this… I have experience in both areas of this discussion 1) I live in a state that is highly hunted (Michigan) and deal with the army of orange every year and it this year is it open to anyone to use a crossbow in the lower part and 2)For work, I was able to shoot and test out crossbows to the max… So I do have experience in both these matters.
I want to start off and say GMMAT is correct people where saying the same thing about the compound… Hell I remember when it from cedar arrows to alu and then from alu. to carbon and people where raising hell about that… The fact of the matter is crossbows have been a form of hunting for 1000’s of years.
Some of the arguments on here are at best baseless. For example, I have personally killed some monsters in Ohio during archery season where crossbows have been fully legal for sometime. The hunting is still good. Some are saying crossbows can shoot 60-70 yards… well maybe but its not its design or intent with the exception of one crossbow (the tactical PSE) they are made for 30-40yards tops. To exceed yardage of 60-70 yards you still need to practice A LOT. Just like the guys I personally know that can shoot their compounds accurately to 70+yards… Hell at last years ATA Rage did a 100 yard contest. Our compounds can shoot accurately to 100yards.
PABuck hunter is also correct… Instead of coming together we argue about what is the right gear to use… In all people need to grow up and stop being selfish thinking this is their woods and crossbows are going to ruin hunting… if crossbows aren’t your forte don’t use it… some people don’t like shotguns and only hunt with muzzleloaders… some people don’t like guns so they only shoot bows… some people don’t care the type of gear they are using… the goal is to take an animal and they use whatever means that are legal. DEAD is DEAD whether it is from a double lung arrow, bolt, or slug.
I did get a good laugh from Windwalker (sorry I have to call you out on this)… with the impudent statement of “Many of these new crossbow hunters will lack an understanding of what is involved in getting a deer with a bow. Many won't take the time that is needed. Just grab the crossbow and head to the woods.
Crossbows make it easy because the can be used by anyone. This includes lazy hunters. The kind of guys that will wound a deer and give up looking after a few minutes, guys that aren't that dedicated to archery hunting and who were rifle hunters all their lives.
Many that don't understand the kind of dedication that archery hunting requires, will be taking to the woods this fall. They don't understand blood trailing or even the importance of proper body angle with archery gear.”
I can tell you this with my PSE X force of 101 airborne shooting 300+fps and newbie can sight in one pin and be good to 30 yards… our compounds are soo technically superior that the manufactures made it easy on all of us with three shot center shot finders rest (NAP) quick spins for accurate arrows… the list goes on. It is not like the old days of having a pin for 10, 20, and 30. So I will say if you can draw 50 pounds and shooting a new age bow with the newest equipment anyone can use a compound…
Windwalker is correct however that lazy hunters give ALL hunters bad names… well how do you cure that one might ask? Well with education… education takes money, money comes from increase license sales, increased license sales comes from getting more people involved… (do I have to keep spelling it out) But to say that crossbow hunters won’t know what it is like to track blood or the proper angle to shoot a deer HAHAHAHAHA you are still shooting a bow it just happens to be horizontal not vertical.. It still has a bolt or if it is easy to comprehend a little arrow with a boardhead on it. And when you shoot a deer with it, the deer doesn’t just drop it still caused two holes and the deer tend to run away and the only way to find them is to follow the blood.
People…brothers in the hunting community STOP fighting with each other STOP making ignorant comments like… anyone who can afford a crossbow will just fling arrows around…. I have been in enough archery shops and bars hearing deer stories and there are idiots that use all weapons not just exclusively to crossbows. It comes to education. We need to stick together not fall apart… We have bigger issues to worry about… For example there is a pending supreme court case that just might make it illegal to posses any video or picture of an animal that was taken legally but picture or video is in a place where is it illegal for example Windwalkers photo of that Moose (nice moose by the way) would be illegal to post. Because living in Michigan it is illegal to kill a moose and since I can view it where it is illegal to hunt it will be considered flaunting animal cruelty… I am not making this up read for yourself.
Can't We Just Get Along?
A case headed for the United States Supreme Court has the potential to make it illegal to show "depictions of animal cruelty" - this one is supported by the government and the HSUS and pitched as an anti-dogfighting measure.
It isn't. It's about a 69-year old man with no criminal record facing three years in jail for making a film about pit bulls. The conviction was overturned by the Third Circuit Court of Appeals, which said the federal law against "depictions of animal cruelty" was unconstitutional. The government appealed the case, and it's now headed to the Supreme Court.
Taken to its logical conclusion, this case has the potential to make it a felony to take, sell or publish images of hunting, fishing, trapping, and virtually anything else that's ruled as a "depiction of animal cruelty".
I've long been an opponent of kill shots on television, but the idea of criminalizing an entire industry bothers me far worse than graphic hunting videos. If you don't want to watch, change channels has always been a policy that's worked at our house.
Yesterday, a big push was made across the outdoor media to seek signatures for an amicus brief to be filed with the Supreme Court concerning this case. So there's a good chance you're more than likely to hear more about this case in your local media until it gets its day in the Supreme Court.
We'll keep you posted on this one, too.
--Jim Shepherd
06-17-2009, 10:45 AM
#3
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
Yeah.....I gotta tell ya....
If they'd JUST outlaw them xbows.....there would be a lot fewer slobs in the woods. Everyone knows it's the weapon that defines the hunter.....and not the hunter himself.....right?
If they'd JUST outlaw them xbows.....there would be a lot fewer slobs in the woods. Everyone knows it's the weapon that defines the hunter.....and not the hunter himself.....right?
06-17-2009, 12:13 PM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Eldred, PA
Posts: 1,667
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
Not really Jeff, but what is "easier" to hunt with.... A gun or a bow...? Obviously there is more effort and patterning while bowhunting... NOW, with the inclusion of the crossbow, will some of the "gun only" hunters cross over with hopes that they can now "bowhunt" as well...?
06-17-2009, 12:29 PM
#5
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
alright so you guys know where im coming from let me explain what happened yesterday... so i get home from work and there is a message on the machine it is one of my cousins. he just got his hunting license and got an archery stamp he wants me to call him back and tell him what kind of crossbow to buy and how powerful a scope. my heart sank. my cousin is the kind of hunter who thinks hunting is a job and he has to get an animal or it was a waste. and he has no idea about archery hunting and has never wanted to go before but now since it is so easy he wants to do it he told me. this is what i fear will happen state wide people like him will crowd the woods. archery season was always my time to get away from people like him i deal with them rifle season. archery season used to be so relaxing but not now. i hope that he is the only one like that in PA but i doubt it. that is why i was so upset
today i thought about it all day and i came to the conclusion that i would be alright with the crossbow if they would only get ride of the scopes. but i doubt they will
Fingerz that is what it is like for my cousin man i hate that
today i thought about it all day and i came to the conclusion that i would be alright with the crossbow if they would only get ride of the scopes. but i doubt they will
Fingerz that is what it is like for my cousin man i hate that
06-17-2009, 12:29 PM
#6
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
I'll just say this....
A crossbow is a HEAVY mofo. It's cumbersome. My gut feeling is ....it's kinda like "most" gun hunters hunt, here (I share a tract of land with 2 of them).....
They're field edge hunters for 2 reasons:
1. It's easy to get to their stands.
2. They think they have an advantage by being where they can see more.
They impact the way I hunt very little. They bother me (the fact that they're there)......none. They may even help.
I'm betting it's going to be the odd xbow hunter (of the new ones you're worried about) that ventures far off the beaten path.
A crossbow is a HEAVY mofo. It's cumbersome. My gut feeling is ....it's kinda like "most" gun hunters hunt, here (I share a tract of land with 2 of them).....
They're field edge hunters for 2 reasons:
1. It's easy to get to their stands.
2. They think they have an advantage by being where they can see more.
They impact the way I hunt very little. They bother me (the fact that they're there)......none. They may even help.
I'm betting it's going to be the odd xbow hunter (of the new ones you're worried about) that ventures far off the beaten path.
06-17-2009, 12:44 PM
#7
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
ok GMMAT lets say that semi auto rifles are now legal there and you have to share that land with two more hunters that no little about hunting how would that make u feel.
06-17-2009, 01:11 PM
#8
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
It would make me feel like I was probably more fearful for MY life than the deer's lives.
I don't see where a semi-auto is any more disruptive than a bolt action (to the deer). They can shoot semi-auto shotguns at deer, here.
I don't see where a semi-auto is any more disruptive than a bolt action (to the deer). They can shoot semi-auto shotguns at deer, here.
06-17-2009, 01:18 PM
#9
RE: In Response of PA archery is now a JOKE
the semi auto would mean little in the equation it would just be a weapon that put more uneducated and sloppy hunters in the woods that was the point i mean that is what is happening to me right now.