church and hunting
11-04-2008, 11:23 AM
#101
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Heaven is my home, temporarily residing in WNY :)
Posts: 6,679
RE: church and hunting
ORIGINAL: minnesotadeer
I'm not looking to get into some sort of contest, but Jesus does not talk of the fire and brimstone - devil stabbing you with a pitfork while you sink into fiery quicksand - hell that churches and religious leaders. He mentions it a total of a dozen times throughout the new testament when I counted and many of those times, its a passing veiled reference to not being saved. The most graphic depiction is in Revelations and that's not coming from Jesus. The old testament never mentions hell period. My point in bringing all of this up is that Hell, as most of us know it, devil and the pitchfork, was never propogated as widely or specifically by Jesus as it has been by church leaders. He was more concerned about people following God's teachings and being saved, not sending them to Hell. And this is getting way off topic.
I'm not looking to get into some sort of contest, but Jesus does not talk of the fire and brimstone - devil stabbing you with a pitfork while you sink into fiery quicksand - hell that churches and religious leaders. He mentions it a total of a dozen times throughout the new testament when I counted and many of those times, its a passing veiled reference to not being saved. The most graphic depiction is in Revelations and that's not coming from Jesus. The old testament never mentions hell period. My point in bringing all of this up is that Hell, as most of us know it, devil and the pitchfork, was never propogated as widely or specifically by Jesus as it has been by church leaders. He was more concerned about people following God's teachings and being saved, not sending them to Hell. And this is getting way off topic.
you need to read a Bible, buddy!!!!
11-04-2008, 11:32 AM
#102
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Roanoke, Va
Posts: 3,562
RE: church and hunting
When I humbled myself and realised that God could speak to me .... that He wanted to.... He loved me enough to send Jesus down to die for me ... it took someone perfect to pay for the imperfect. .....I asked God for HIS truth ...not all the other truths I was hearing ...not mine ...but HIS .....I didn't see a vision or anything wild like that .....God just opened up my spiritual eyes ....after my conversion, I witnessed to my family ....it was a tough road, being an Italian Catholic family ...but through prayer and truth, they got saved ....one by one!!! It was AWESOME!!! You talk about a powerful God!!!! Pride abounds in Italians and Catholics ...but God is greater ..... I no longer desired everything, but God, I wanted to know him ......
Donnie...think about the girl you first fell in love with ..... you wanted to hear her speak ...you had to hear her voice .... whne she wrote you a note, you read it with exitement and wanted more of her writings ....you wanted to do things that pleased her ....to make her happy ..... kinda like what conversion is like ....
Donnie...think about the girl you first fell in love with ..... you wanted to hear her speak ...you had to hear her voice .... whne she wrote you a note, you read it with exitement and wanted more of her writings ....you wanted to do things that pleased her ....to make her happy ..... kinda like what conversion is like ....
11-04-2008, 12:06 PM
#103
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
RE: church and hunting
Someone please help me if I'm misunderstanding...if someone never knows of god because they were never told of him, they are not going to heaven? How is this their fault? Shouldn't it be part of god's plan for them to know him? Please don't criticize me, I'm just trying to understand.
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
11-04-2008, 12:19 PM
#105
Guest
Posts: n/a
RE: church and hunting
ORIGINAL: GMMAT
Good luck getting that one answered. According to some....the all-knowing, gracious God they worship intentionally creates his flock in his image......knowing that some of them will never hear of his word, and that their souls are doomed. He knows all, right?
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
Someone please help me if I'm misunderstanding...if someone never knows of god because they were never told of him, they are not going to heaven? How is this their fault? Shouldn't it be part of god's plan for them to know him? Please don't criticize me, I'm just trying to understand.
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
My rule of thumb is, I want God to be much more than my feeble mind. If I could easily understand his will and his plan, he wouldn't be much of a God. I kinda expect more out of diety I worship.
God's will and plan is basically for the Jews. If we Christians benefit, thats great. Its a free gift, and should be selling itself. That covenant with Abraham hasn't changed. His will be done.
I sure can't say I know God's plan for everyone. I sure can't say I understand his will. I just know Paul teaches us that we are part of the body. Who are we who questions his will.
Jeff, you either believe or don't. Its that simple.
11-04-2008, 12:22 PM
#106
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 3,882
RE: church and hunting
ORIGINAL: GMMAT
Good luck getting that one answered. According to some....the all-knowing, gracious God they worship intentionally creates his flock in his image......knowing that some of them will never hear of his word, and that their souls are doomed. He knows all, right?
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
Someone please help me if I'm misunderstanding...if someone never knows of god because they were never told of him, they are not going to heaven? How is this their fault? Shouldn't it be part of god's plan for them to know him? Please don't criticize me, I'm just trying to understand.
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
Ive come to feel that the people know "something" is there. Relate to the idians if you will, though they were polytheistic they knew of a "great spirit".
Does that condem them to Hell? They gave thanks to the greatspirit, they worshiped. They KNEW something was there.
11-04-2008, 12:35 PM
#107
Guest
Posts: n/a
RE: church and hunting
ORIGINAL: buckmaster
I've thought of that myself, and have dwelled on it, theres nothing in the bible that says "people who never hear of Jesus goes to Hell"
Ive come to feel that the people know "something" is there. Relate to the idians if you will, though they were polytheistic they knew of a "great spirit".
Does that condem them to Hell? They gave thanks to the greatspirit, they worshiped. They KNEW something was there.
ORIGINAL: GMMAT
Good luck getting that one answered. According to some....the all-knowing, gracious God they worship intentionally creates his flock in his image......knowing that some of them will never hear of his word, and that their souls are doomed. He knows all, right?
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
Someone please help me if I'm misunderstanding...if someone never knows of god because they were never told of him, they are not going to heaven? How is this their fault? Shouldn't it be part of god's plan for them to know him? Please don't criticize me, I'm just trying to understand.
It's about the biggestcase of "class envy" I've ever seen cited.
Ive come to feel that the people know "something" is there. Relate to the idians if you will, though they were polytheistic they knew of a "great spirit".
Does that condem them to Hell? They gave thanks to the greatspirit, they worshiped. They KNEW something was there.
But the bottom line is, I don't need to know what happens to others. I just need to know what happens to me if I deny Christ.
11-04-2008, 12:47 PM
#108
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: West MI
Posts: 408
RE: church and hunting
So how do we know who's right? Different religions have different interpretations of the bible. Obviously, each religion feels they are correct. Shouldn't there be continuity with one god?
11-04-2008, 12:53 PM
#110
Guest
Posts: n/a
RE: church and hunting
ORIGINAL: Vito1
So how do we know who's right? Different religions have different interpretations of the bible. Obviously, each religion feels they are correct. Shouldn't there be continuity with one god?
So how do we know who's right? Different religions have different interpretations of the bible. Obviously, each religion feels they are correct. Shouldn't there be continuity with one god?
Problems exist when people neglect the word of God. They only believe folk tales or what they remember a preacher said.
Lately, I have been going thru a bad stretch. Just in an onery way. Ready to fight at a moments notice. Upset that God has not been talking to my heart. And this forum and this post, has reminded me, going to Church you may not hear God talking to you, wanting him to speak to your heart may not happen. You have to go back to the source. Thats where his source is.